no, there aren't (stats showing lowered wages) the last time this was discussed in detail YOU posted up the latest stats, which were actually the ones i was thinking about.
do you know anything about the realities of such migration? the fact that their families - poor families - get into massive debt because that is the only way they might bring in enough to live on (so they hope). yes, the middle-class migrate too, same as they migrate from poor towns in england, and from other parts of the uk. but thats okay. 1)aah so because i dare to disagree with the mighty durutti i msut be middle-class. cracking argument, based upon crass assumptions, which are massively wide of the mark, but hey ho. you know fuck all sunshine.
2)obviously the chinese cockle pickers were all middle-class,
3)And yes your analogy is an essentially moralistic one, worse, its actually one straight from thatcher. great way to build 'strong communities'. you've accepted half her arguments, and therefore blame the wrong targets. communities aren't strengthened by splitting groups off from one another. THAT helps the BNP
this is a terrible post d, one I'd expect from baldie maybe, but you're not usually this bad.
well, no its not wrong. Do you seriously think those chinese workers were the 'better off'? You're delusonal if you do. They weren't. better off chinese workers move to the cities or Hong Kong by and large, or get govt grants to come to UK universities it is the truly desperate who get exploited by the people traffickers. And plenty of those who remain, even if they are not starving, are living in dire poverty, and/or with a massive threat of death and disease hanging over them. Thats why they bloody well move! It aint for the weather.
lol, patronsing twat
I think you should actually think about it, you only ever seem to thnk about the 'pull' factor, never the push factor. People migrate becuae the economic situation at home is fucked. They might not be starving, but they'd have fuck all, I'm sure you noticed the collapse of the eastern european economies as they went all free market (with lots of western, uk, companies running in to make a handsome profit from them). Baldie may be right that if they 'stayed at home' it would ultimately do their national economy more good might be right (tho even thats debateable), but why wshould they care about the 'national' economy? Tis just nationalistic nonsense.by unionising that labour. Not splitting the workers off from one another. Have you seen Matewan? it's the most basic lesson in the film, age old, and still just as relevant.
I didnt say strong communities were a thatcherrite idea, oh most disingeuous one, I said that using the analaogy of 'the home' for 'the nation' was a thatcherite one, and it is, it is deeply deeply reactionary.
becuae the wages aren't high enough, nor the coonditons good enough, to attract sufficient uk born workers. We oppose that by unionisation and fighting to improve condirions, not blaming other workers as you and baldie do.
but until we do that, the poor can just fuck off, stay at home like good boy and girls? Bollocks.
"Nowhere do I denyt that the bosses try and use migratin to restrict wages, I argue - and use the stats you posted - that they have been succesful only in a very limited way. There is evidence to show that some trades, a very small minority in terms of employment, tho obivously not an insignificant number, some trades wage rises have been smaller than they probably would otherwise have been. That's bad, but it is not a specific wage cut, nor is it the norm, not for most working-class people, however defined."
"well, no its not wrong. Do you seriously think those chinese workers were the 'better off'? You're delusonal if you do. They weren't. better off chinese workers move to the cities or Hong Kong by and large, or get govt grants to come to UK universities it is the truly desperate who get exploited by the people traffickers. And plenty of those who remain, even if they are not starving, are living in dire poverty, and/or with a massive threat of death and disease hanging over them. Thats why they bloody well move! It aint for the weather."
"lol, patronsing twat
"by unionising that labour. Not splitting the workers off from one another. Have you seen Matewan? it's the most basic lesson in the film, age old, and still just as relevant."
"I didnt say strong communities were a thatcherrite idea, oh most disingeuous one, I said that using the analaogy of 'the home' for 'the nation' was a thatcherite one, and it is, it is deeply deeply reactionary."
"becuae the wages aren't high enough, nor the coonditons good enough, to attract sufficient uk born workers. We oppose that by unionisation and fighting to improve condirions, not blaming other workers as you and baldie do."
but until we do that, the poor can just fuck off, stay at home like good boy and girls? Bollocks.
you are mental if you think that backs up your POV .. that debate shows totally that migration exists currently as a key part of neoliberalism, and that the ordianry owrker is not benefitting, which is what i have argued all along
