Monbiot wants a recession

[poster342002]

Adaptable is the good manners word for it.

The word I'd use for capitalism is "vampiric", in that it continues to exist and exist - forever parasitically sucking the blood from the world's poor nomatter how many attempts are made to kill it off.

 

[Idaho]

Hold the front page. You just worked that out, Einstein? AFAIK, 'real left wing' ideals are based on making the most of economies of scale and automation that capitalism can't achieve and green ideals is based on negative growth in productivity and rolling back consumption to levels seen in the 15th century

'Real left-wing ideals' are based on the fantasy that you can ignore/replace the price mechanism with a seemingly infinite number of committees and local democratic formations who can spend all day voting for what kind of wooden spoon to manufacture and whether they are going to send 400 to Leeds or 200 each to Newcastle and Preston.

As to rolling back consumption to the 15th century - that is amusing nonsense

 

[Spion]

'Real left-wing ideals' are based on the fantasy that you can ignore/replace the price mechanism

Quite wrong. Capitalism doesn't simply equal the price mechanism and in Marxist thinking there is no question of ignoring it. Even in the early USSR Lenin recognised its role and that it could not be 'abolished' straight away.

with a seemingly infinite number of committees and local democratic formations who can spend all day voting for what kind of wooden spoon to manufacture and whether they are going to send 400 to Leeds or 200 each to Newcastle and Preston.

I would have thought that in the age of the internet there'll be far better ways of collectively organising production and distribution of goods than your suggestions. Go to the back of the class!

 

[Idaho]

I would have thought that in the age of the internet there'll be far better ways of collectively organising production and distribution of goods than your suggestions. Go to the back of the class!

I would have thought that the age of the internet teaches exactly the opposite lesson. That left their own devices people piss about talking bollocks and needlessly arguing

 

[fredfelt]

I found it interesting where he states that an economyies carbon emmisions have always risen with growth in an economy.

So long as interest is charged on borring money it must be put to more efficient use to pay back interest and the capital sum. This results in growth in an economy. If if it costs to borrow money in the long term there must be growth in an economy.

 

[London_Calling]

If memory serves the Goverment's economic definition of 'recession' is two quarters of negative growth.

 

[sihhi]

Monbiot - full respect to him for not buying the phone and hopefully doing something better with the money - but he sounds like a Which? columnist. If the company say 'no, it's legit no child labour' would he believe them?

I decided not to buy a smartphone ...
Confronting this issue prompted me to ask another question altogether: do I really want one anyway, and might I not be happier without it? What about you?

 

[Buckaroo]

Monbiot - full respect to him for not buying the phone and hopefully doing something better with the money - but he sounds like a Which? columnist. If the company say 'no, it's legit no child labour' would he believe them?

And he's wearing a Primark shirt.

 

[brogdale]

And he's wearing a Primark shirt.

...but I think he's right to ask "...do I really want one anyway, and might I not be happier without it?"

 

[Barking_Mad]

Met him once, very amiable guy, hearts in the right place, political views dodgy.

 

[weltweit]

I decided not to buy a smart phone, but I didn't make a fuss about it.

wuss !!

 

[Idaho]

It kind of reminds me of those people who "turn down" a gong. You are actually offered it confidentially first. The drama queens accept at this point and then publicly turn it down later. That way they can milk the event to the full.

 

[where to]

It kind of reminds me of those people who "turn down" a gong. You are actually offered it confidentially first. The drama queens accept at this point and then publicly turn it down later. That way they can milk the event to the full.

Can you give an example of someone who has done that?

 

[Idaho]

Can you give an example of someone who has done that?

People who have publicly declined a knighthood/cbe etc? There are a fair few. I'd be surprised if some searches didn't come up with examples.

 

[classicdish]

Can you give an example of someone who has done that?

Massive list here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declining_a_British_honour

 

[where to]

No, I was looking for someone who accepted, and then turned it down later, but before recieving it. This is as the poster above says has happened before by "drama queens". To my knowledge nobody has done that.

Not nitpicking for the sake of it. Its worth clarifying this as the portrayal above does a disservice to the many who genuinely do told them to fuck off. And to those who had genuine regrets later. I suspect the alternative camp described above does not actually exist.

 

[classicdish]

The wikipedia page does say:

"Nowadays potential recipients are contacted by Downing Street, well before any public announcement is made, to confirm in writing whether they wish to be put forward for an honour. Therefore those who now decline an honour, when it is announced, normally will have indicated acceptance beforehand, but not always (e.g. Keith Hill)."
and
"In most cases, the offer of an honour was rejected privately"

However it doesn't offer specific examples.

 

[where to]

The wikipedia page does say:

"Nowadays potential recipients are contacted by Downing Street, well before any public announcement is made, to confirm in writing whether they wish to be put forward for an honour. Therefore those who now decline an honour, when it is announced, normally will have indicated acceptance beforehand

But when has that ever happened? As far as I can remeber I have only ever heard about people declining honours in interviews, rumours at a later date etc, never by someone who has formally been offered one at the time of honours being announced.

Though I can see why the royalists would want to give a different impression...

 

[Idaho]

Though I can see why the royalists would want to give a different impression...

Some Royalists yesterday:

 

[platinumsage]

Don't buy anything you sheeple! We should all become agrarian eco-fascists, or something.

Whatever happened to Buy Nothing Day?

 

[Fruitloop]

Ye gods. Thread from the dead. Although I got to read a smart-arse post from myself 13 years ago, which was kind of cool.

 

[steveo87]

I was 20 when this thread started.


I'm now 33 (if you can't be arsed to do the maths), and have six month old son...

 

[Idaho]

Don't buy anything you sheeple! We should all become agrarian eco-fascists, or something.

Whatever happened to Buy Nothing Day?

Not really sure what you are trying to express.

 

[platinumsage]

Not really sure what you are trying to express.

A big really. Today is when non-essential shops were allowed to reopen. But a scouring of his twitter reveals Monbiot believes non-essential shops should never reopen, on account of them being non-essential. Apparently people don't beds and shoes and stuff.

 

[Idaho]

A big really. Today is when non-essential shops were allowed to reopen. But a scouring of his twitter reveals Monbiot believes non-essential shops should never reopen, on account of them being non-essential. Apparently people don't beds and shoes and stuff.

Oh. Ok.

 

[platinumsage]

Oh. Ok.

Right.

 

[bellaozzydog]

I want a zombie apocalypse

 

[two sheds]

.

 

[Pickman's model]

I want a zombie apocalypse

be careful what you wish for

 

[ska invita]

Don't buy anything you sheeple! We should all become agrarian eco-fascists, or something.

Whatever happened to Buy Nothing Day?

Well the Tories are encouraging shopping for the sake of the economy, not because people need things. I think there's a difference. GM is saying dont do the first, dont shop for shoppings sake. Fair enough