Minimising BNP seats in London

[butchersapron]

Eh?

You reveal more with each post. Have another and tell us about the library....

 

[thelibrarian]

Eh?

You reveal more with each post. Have another and tell us about the library....

the first book you'll find in my library says it might all just be a game. I swear it's the turnstiles that make us hostile. little point in trading insults with each other in the terraces when the game is probably fixed. Or is there?

 

[butchersapron]

the first book you'll find in my library says it might all just be a game. I swear it's the turnstiles that make us hostile. little point in trading insults with each other in the terraces when the game is probably fixed. Or is there?

The first book says don't index when drunk.

 

[butchersapron]

the first book you'll find in my library says it might all just be a game. I swear it's the turnstiles that make us hostile. little point in trading insults with each other in the terraces when the game is probably fixed. Or is there?

Is this a plaintive call across the barricades?

 

[thelibrarian]

The first book says don't index when drunk.

hehehe I've only had two funnily enough so it must be the curry. The thing is there is something not right about the BNP at all and you can't deny you've not noticed this. More i can't say. Your theories are as valid as mine. but alas I don't honestly think oyu need worry about them. I think they're being taken care of.

 

[PaulOK]

What's the truth behind the rumour that Griffin will be invited onto BBC's "Question Time" if the BNP get at least one GLA seat? A real sign of entering into the political mainstream - will be interesting to see if any Labour politician will sit on the panel with him (the Tories and the Liberal obviously will).

 

[butchersapron]

I don't reckon anyone of them would - maybe some independent looking tory looking to stand in say 4/8 years time and strike an independent streak.... (without official backing of course).

 

[The Black Hand]

No seriously it reminds me of the camp batman movies of the sixties. Whenever the vilains threw a net anywhere near batman and robin they would always deliberately get snaggled up in it and really even as a kid you thought it was daft because you could tell they were deliberately getting as snagglled up in it as possible even though they' were supposedly trying to wrestle themselves free. The BNP splits seem very similar. for a start you'rd have expected a normal party to have avoided the fall out with graham it's most talented member in the first place, but with a split having taken place oyu're expect them to play it down and move on as quickly as possible. Instead it seems when there's any possibility of dissent the leadership and all concerned seem to wade in absolutely preversely trying to make as much of it as possible as though they delight in it. It was the same with the Tyndall business that caused the fall out iwth the burnely branch.It only seems to need the slightest hint of disagreement or an internal dispute and the party seems to become as willfully entangled as possible with everyone trying to make as much of everyhting to do with it as they can. Let's burgle her computer for good measure, oh dear it seems to eb dying a death now, never mind let's start a court case- why let it lie- there must be some more life to be got out of it...

Am I wrong?.

This seems to be a reasonable interpretation.

 

[sexton]

Don't be afraid of the Bogeyman children!

Hey, Comrades! Don't be glum!

Look at it another way, a solid vote for BNP is one less vote for bloody Boris.

What will their candidates do anyway in the Assembly - if they can find their way there?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Hey, Comrades! Don't be glum!

Look at it another way, a solid vote for BNP is one less vote for bloody Boris.

What will their candidates do anyway in the Assembly - if they can find their way there?

It doesn't really matter.

What will matter is the amount of political credibility the BNP might be able to generate from winning a seat on the GLA. A gain like that could in some eyes give the BNP a legitimacy that would allow the votes of those the BNP wish to garner, the middle-classes, to flow BNP-ward without the middle-classes feeling guilty for their racism.

But hey, I'm just a chippy working class chap, so I@m probably wrong, and there's absolutely nothing to worry about.

 

[tangentlama]

On minimising BNP seats in London - this is a very good idea - make the seats smaller to prevent BNP from squeezing their supersized butts into them.

 

[KeyboardJockey]

It doesn't really matter.

What will matter is the amount of political credibility the BNP might be able to generate from winning a seat on the GLA. A gain like that could in some eyes give the BNP a legitimacy that would allow the votes of those the BNP wish to garner, the middle-classes, to flow BNP-ward without the middle-classes feeling guilty for their racism.

But hey, I'm just a chippy working class chap, so I@m probably wrong, and there's absolutely nothing to worry about.

Agreed. Winning GLA seats WOULD give the bnp credibility. Like the fash of previous times they need to win support not just of the support of overtly racist meatheads but those in the middle class and upper working classes (those who've moved down the line to places like Hornchurch and similar places) who look around them and see the society around them crumbling and blame the crumbling on the wrong targets.

Its for this reason that I would advise reluctantly that if it was a choice between the bnp and the Tories then you should vote for the Tories to keep the bnp out.

For various reasons - including the negative experience of growing up alongside fash of various sorts - a Tory would be preferable to me as a representative in the GLA than a member of the bnp.

With any luck any bnp assembly member will be of the same intellectual ability as those who won seats in Barking and Dagenham who thought the council chamber desk light switches were voting buttons . Sadly, I think we are passing the time when the bnp would stick any old arsehole up for election and they are getting more election and media savvy which bodes ill for the future.

 

[melmaloney]

You are all being conned. There is NO BNP threat. This publicity is largely Labour Party inspired - to bring out reluctant (mainly black and asian) voters. The s---heads in the BNP are no threat unless a group of them catch one walking alone after a football match. Sexton was right when he asked "What will their candidates do anyway in the Assembly - if they can find their way there?"

All this publicity only encourages them to think that they have some importance - and that is a mistake.

 

[PaulOK]

You are all being conned. There is NO BNP threat. This publicity is largely Labour Party inspired - to bring out reluctant (mainly black and asian) voters. The s---heads in the BNP are no threat unless a group of them catch one walking alone after a football match. Sexton was right when he asked "What will their candidates do anyway in the Assembly - if they can find their way there?"

All this publicity only encourages them to think that they have some importance - and that is a mistake.

Although I agree that the BNP bogey men are being played up to get traditional Labour voters out - Livingstone is really pushing this line in London to get his Black and Asian vote out - I think there is still a real fascist threat in England. Just think about when Beackon was elected in 93 and what a shock it was. Now BNP get councillors and no one is surprised. Next they will be picking up Westminster MP's (this could well happen in 2009). There is certainly political space for them now.

 

[belboid]

Its for this reason that I would advise reluctantly that if it was a choice between the bnp and the Tories then you should vote for the Tories to keep the bnp out.

and where would that occcur? nowhere. So what is the point of writing it? Except for you to cover your own tory voting arse?

 

[KeyboardJockey]

and where would that occcur? nowhere. So what is the point of writing it? Except for you to cover your own tory voting arse?

First of all I'm a RELUCTANT Tory voter who's having to vote Tory to block something much worse.

I'm hearing rumours (which if they are wrong would be great) that Enfield and Harringey constituency may well turn in a bnp assembly member as there is a swing to the bnp in the north ie the Enfield bit of the constituency which may if the bnp can get their vote out cancel out the increased ethnic minority vote in the south of the consituency. Stamford Hill may well turn out for the Tories so its not as if there is a solid Labour vote (and Harrigey council has been doing its usual riding roughshod over the locals despite valuable work being put in by the IWW) in the south to counteract that.

A tory is in no way as bad as a fash.

 

[belboid]

No BNP will win a directly elected seat, not even searchlight claim that. Voting tory wont affect their proportion of the vote, which is how they will win any top up.

 

[JimPage]

Or what do you reckon? and Griffin for example why is he taking sadie garham and co to court at the time of a high porfile election effort: the rebellion is fizzling out why is he preversely trying to breath new life into it? Does it make sense to you?

The rebel group had potential to destro the BNP, but a good number of their supporters soon realised that reforming the BNP wasnt even on the agenda of the Voice of Change group- smashing them from inside was. I can only speak for our local BNP up here in Scotland- where local organisers who previously supported the rebels are now quite bitter and vocal in their condemnation of them

 

[JimPage]

First of all I'm a RELUCTANT Tory voter who's having to vote Tory to block something much worse.

I'm hearing rumours (which if they are wrong would be great) that Enfield and Harringey constituency may well turn in a bnp assembly member .

Doubt it. Whcile they may well get 5-10% in Enfield, if they poll 3% in Haringey i would be surprised. Saying that Barnbrook was out campaigning in Enfield over the weekend , so it is a target area for them

 

[JimPage]

What's the truth behind the rumour that Griffin will be invited onto BBC's "Question Time" if the BNP get at least one GLA seat? A real sign of entering into the political mainstream - will be interesting to see if any Labour politician will sit on the panel with him (the Tories and the Liberal obviously will).

On the basis that they occasionally invite Respect, Greens and UKIP on, he would probably get invited occasionaally. While no Tory/Liberal party member would share a platform with him, they will find a few pro freedom of speech fools who would create a political balance- journalists- authors etc

 

[articul8]

No BNP will win a directly elected seat, not even searchlight claim that. Voting tory wont affect their proportion of the vote, which is how they will win any top up.

1) Yes, The BNP has fuck all chance of winning Enfield
2) any vote on the list section which isn't a vote for the BNP is increases the aggregate total they'll need to reach 5%. Still, there's a lot of other ways to cast a vote to this end in the list section other than Tory!!!

 

[KeyboardJockey]

1) Yes, The BNP has fuck all chance of winning Enfield
2) any vote on the list section which isn't a vote for the BNP is increases the aggregate total they'll need to reach 5%. Still, there's a lot of other ways to cast a vote to this end in the list section other than Tory!!!

I would say that if you was anti Labour or Lib Dem and you have a negative view of the problems caused by various Govt policies then its better to vote Tory than BNP.

 

[belboid]

but what if you are anti Labour or Lib Dem or Tory?

All you seem to be saying now is 'Don't Vote BNP'

 

[KeyboardJockey]

but what if you are anti Labour or Lib Dem or Tory?

All you seem to be saying now is 'Don't Vote BNP'

Then you have to hold your nose and vote for what candidate is most likely to beat the bnp. Works as a way of beating all bigots and authoritiarians really which is why I'm voting for Boris even though I don't always agree with him as its the only way to beat the bigot hugger who's currently occupying City Hall.

 

[belboid]

aye, why vote for the bigot hugger, when you can vote for the bigot himself!

Other than that, all you're saying is vote to beat the BNP - who won't win any directly elected seat, so it won't matter who you vote for, and voting for anyone other than the BNP will lower their overall proportion of the vote, and so it won't make any difference which party you choose. I see no need for any nose holding' at all (except for the many people who think they're all a bag of shit)

 

[articul8]

I really don't undestand the logic of someone whose 'argument' seems to be "they're all a bag of shit so might as well vote Tory" - they must have been looking for an excuse to vote Tory all along.

 

[RedRumsBum]

aye, why vote for the bigot hugger, when you can vote for the bigot himself!

Other than that, all you're saying is vote to beat the BNP - who won't win any directly elected seat, so it won't matter who you vote for, and voting for anyone other than the BNP will lower their overall proportion of the vote, and so it won't make any difference which party you choose. I see no need for any nose holding' at all (except for the many people who think they're all a bag of shit)

We forgot. Only the left can use racist terminology when criticizing others who are either directly or indirectly racist.

 

[belboid]

what has that to do with anything? And what 'racist terminology'? You make no sense.

Whilst it may or may not be a good idea to criticise Livingstone for hugging 'bigots', to use that as an excuse to vote for a man who is an undeniable bigot is crass stupidity.

 

[pingupete]

...voting for anyone other than the BNP will lower their overall proportion of the vote, and so it won't make any difference which party you choose...

This is the trouble. The above is true but only to some extent. If the BNP get less than 5% then it is the only consideration, but we don't know that will be the result, and a lot of people think they'll mop up a lot of the votes UKIP won last time (UKIP gained 2 Assembly seats) in addition to the core BNP support.

If the BNP get more than 5% it does matter which party you vote for. If you've voted for a party that gets less than 5% of the list vote, it will have made it easier for the BNP to win an additional seat with just 6.5% or 7% of the vote.

If the proportion of people voting for parties that do finish with 5% or more on the Assembly list increases, then the higher % needed by the BNP to win a 2nd or 3rd seat.

If the proportion of people voting for parties that finish with less than 5% increases, the lower the % needed by the BNP to win a 2nd or 3rd seat.

However, it is clearly nonsense to suggest that you need to vote Tory, or that the BNP could win a constituency seat. Your choice is Labour, Lib Dem, Green or Tory if you want to guarantee you are voting for a party that finishes with 5% or more. If your priority is minimising BNP seats, these are the only parties that have won a 5% or higher share in both previous London elections.

 

[BarryB]

First of all I'm a RELUCTANT Tory voter who's having to vote Tory to block something much worse.

I'm hearing rumours (which if they are wrong would be great) that Enfield and Harringey constituency may well turn in a bnp assembly member as there is a swing to the bnp in the north ie the Enfield bit of the constituency which may if the bnp can get their vote out cancel out the increased ethnic minority vote in the south of the consituency. Stamford Hill may well turn out for the Tories so its not as if there is a solid Labour vote (and Harrigey council has been doing its usual riding roughshod over the locals despite valuable work being put in by the IWW) in the south to counteract that.

A tory is in no way as bad as a fash.

When you talk about Stamford Hill I take it that you are talking about Orthodox Jewish voters. Yes they mainly vote Tory but Stamford Hill happens to be in Hackney. Hackney is not in the Enfield and Haringey constituency- it is in the North East constituency. Perhaps you are think of the Orthodox Jewish voters in South Tottenham which is in Haringey. If so I doubt if there are enough of them to make any real difference.

BarryB