Meat mmmmm

[joustmaster]

Oh really? You never ate a cheap meat pie? A sausage roll? A supermarket chicken sandwich? You can bet your arse these animals have definitely not had a healthy life and been treated well. They suffer through the fucking wazoo for your tastebuds, you fuck wit.

To be perfectly frank, I'd dig up all the dead grannies in the world to put an end to living beings being killed for human enjoyment. It's all a matter of perspective and living things in the here and now > respect of dead things.

To everybody who just decided to jump on AnMarie's spelling rather than her actual point - you're all twats, and AnMarie, you're brave making such a point in a meatie thread , but well done nonetheless *doffs cap*

Oi - you shit faced cock master.
When did i say i hadn't eaten some 'cheap meat' - all i said was that i prefer organic/well treated animals. I do eat cheap meat from time to time. Mostly cos i'm broke, and partly cos its to hard not to some times.

Animals are meant to be killed and eaten. They are meant to have fear when that happens to them. Thats how nature works. I'd prefer it if animals that are killed by humans for food don't suffer, and have as little fear as possible. I'm sure everyone would.

The only thing that is perverse are the people who humanize animals and can't deal with the way nature has always been

If your going to call me names at least read my post properly - now fuck off back to teaching a lion to live on lettuce

 

[subversplat]

Who do you think your calling a TWAT , i don't remmeber calling anyone names on here so do slow down

And i do hope kangaroo is tasty

To say "Because of your vegetarian views I shall now eat even more meat" makes you a twat. Sorry if you can't handle that, maybe next time try being a bit more of a considerate person.

Oi - you shit faced cock master.
When did i say i hadn't eaten some 'cheap meat' - all i said was that i prefer organic/well treated animals. I do eat cheap meat from time to time. Mostly cos i'm broke, and partly cos its to hard not to some times.

Animals are meant to be killed and eaten. They are meant to have fear when that happens to them. Thats how nature works. I'd prefer it if animals that are killed by humans for food don't suffer, and have as little fear as possible. I'm sure everyone would.

The only thing that is perverse are the people who humanize animals and can't deal with the way nature has always been

If your going to call me names at least read my post properly - now fuck off back to teaching a lion to live on lettuce

Oh ho ho ho! So it's quite alright for you to go bandying the insults about, but you get on your high horse when someone dares to repeat the exact same insult back to you? Well done, you hypersensitive nob end.

You say you'd rather that animals don't suffer, don't get put through utter terror before becoming your dinner, but that's just words. How about not eating the cheap meat when you're poor? Don't buy the dodgy sausage roll out of convenience. Give the bastard farmers the incentive to only ever rear decent, well treated animals and, hell, you might even grow enough of a concience to stop eating meat altogether. To make any kind of hint towards you actually caring about animal welfare makes you all mouth and no trousers, in my oh-so-very humble opinion.

 

[Roadkill]

To be perfectly frank, I'd dig up all the dead grannies in the world to put an end to living beings being killed for human enjoyment. It's all a matter of perspective and living things in the here and now > respect of dead things.

Humans have always eaten meat; our bodies are adapted to do so.

There's nothing less natural about humans eating meat than big cats doing so. Sure, we're the only species to practise agriculture, but so what? We're the only species to do many things: that's why humans run the world and bonobos don't. Since we have that power, it's up to us to make a moral judgement on what is acceptable use of it.

 

[subversplat]

Humans have always eaten meat; our bodies are adapted to do so.

There's nothing less natural about humans eating meat than big cats doing so. Sure, we're the only species to practise agriculture, but so what? We're the only species to do many things: that's why humans run the world and bonobos don't. Since we have that power, it's up to us to make a moral judgement on what is acceptable use of it.

And in one fell swoop you legitimise every "might is right" argument that ever existed...

 

[mr steev]

Humans have always eaten meat; our bodies are adapted to do so.

Our bodies are adapted to survive quite healthily without it too.

 

[Roadkill]

And in one fell swoop you legitimise every "might is right" argument that ever existed...

Nope.

Read what I said next time, rather than going straight on the attack.

I said it's up to us to make a judgement on what is acceptable use of the might/power we have. That does not legitimise 'might is right' at all: it acknowledges that might is a fact, and needs to be used responsibly.

However, if eating meat is something so awful, you might expend a bit of time wondering why we have incisor teeth, if not to slice through meat.

 

[stevepinker]

To say "Because of your vegetarian views I shall now eat even more meat" makes you a twat. Sorry if you can't handle that, maybe next time try being a bit more of a considerate person.

Is this a Thread about animal rights or a thread about different types of meat, So maybe the poster should have been considerate about laying the guilt on meat eaters

And i would try to learn not to call people twats, Some people might really take offense to it

 

[Roadkill]

Our bodies are adapted to survive quite healthily without it too.

If we decide so to do, yes.

But at the time homo sapiens evolved, he didn't really have the option of choosing food on ethical grounds.

 

[mr steev]

But at the time homo sapiens evolved, he didn't really have the option of choosing food on ethical grounds.

True. But most of us in the west have that option.

 

[joustmaster]

Oh ho ho ho! So it's quite alright for you to go bandying the insults about, but you get on your high horse when someone dares to repeat the exact same insult back to you? Well done, you hypersensitive nob end.

You say you'd rather that animals don't suffer, don't get put through utter terror before becoming your dinner, but that's just words. How about not eating the cheap meat when you're poor? Don't buy the dodgy sausage roll out of convenience. Give the bastard farmers the incentive to only ever rear decent, well treated animals and, hell, you might even grow enough of a concience to stop eating meat altogether. To make any kind of hint towards you actually caring about animal welfare makes you all mouth and no trousers, in my oh-so-very humble opinion.

I don't mind you calling me things - i was just saying if you are going to, make sure you are getting it right.

I care more about the flavour of the meat than thewelfare of the animal. sorry. If i am broke i will not stop eating meat. Even if they are poorly looked after. Its not nice, but its the truth. I do reduce the ammount i eat, but thats more to do with the shite quality of the food more than the suffering of the animal.

I don't ever want animals to stop being killed for my food. A well looked after animals death and the fear it has related to that death, is more than acceptable for my food. I even find it a fitting tribute for the animal to be cooked in a good meal.

you should give organic farming of animals a go. Its fun and rewarding and you'll get a greater respect for the animals that way.

 

[subversplat]

Nope.

Read what I said next time, rather than going straight on the attack.

I said it's up to us to make a judgement on what is acceptable use of the might/power we have. That does not legitimise 'might is right' at all: it acknowledges that might is a fact, and needs to be used responsibly.

However, if eating meat is something so awful, you might expend a bit of time wondering why we have incisor teeth, if not to slice through meat.

You know, I don't think that eating meat in all instances is wrong - there are people who live in places where vegetables just don't grow and they would probably die if they don't eat some animals. I'm also constantly amazed by how well the human body can adapt itself to a whole host of different situations and that if one particular part isn't needed for a great swathe of time, it can still remain there dormant in case it ever is needed again (as is the case with our incisors!)

People can do a lot of things, but that doesn't make them all right. I don't think it's morally wrong to attack or kill another person in the right circumstances, but that doesn't mean I'm going to try to justify attacking and killing everybody just because it makes me feel good! In much the same way I'm glad that we've got the ability to eat meat, but to do it when there isn't a burning need to do so is vicious, barbaric and wrong. IMHO

We've evolved these wonderful teeth, but we've also evolved a concience. Let's try using it

 

[Roadkill]

True. But most of us in the west have that option.

And now we get into the ethical side of it...

I've no moral problem with eating meat at all and don't see why I should. I don't buy any of the animal rights arguments: animals don't have 'rights.' Rights are something we give/claim for ourselves, and they presuppose sentience. But I don't believe in treating animals with uneccessary cruelty, which is why I'm against testing of cosmetics (but not medicines) on animals and don't agree with intensive farming.

 

[Roadkill]

We've evolved these wonderful teeth, but we've also evolved a concience. Let's try using it

see above

'Vicious, barbaric and wrong' is quite a way to describe the bacon sarnie I've just had for lunch...

 

[stevepinker]

<--- Funny how calling people twats didn't save this one, You must try harder

 

[subversplat]

I don't mind you calling me things - i was just saying if you are going to, make sure you are getting it right.

I care more about the flavour of the meat than thewelfare of the animal. sorry. If i am broke i will not stop eating meat. Even if they are poorly looked after. Its not nice, but its the truth. I do reduce the ammount i eat, but thats more to do with the shite quality of the food more than the suffering of the animal.

I don't ever want animals to stop being killed for my food. A well looked after animals death and the fear it has related to that death, is more than acceptable for my food. I even find it a fitting tribute for the animal to be cooked in a good meal.

you should give organic farming of animals a go. Its fun and rewarding and you'll get a greater respect for the animals that way.

You arguments to me are similar to "I enjoy mugging people and I won't stop, sorry" so I won't even bother trying to change your mind (it's unlikely to happen) and just resign myself to the fact that you'll probably stop eating bad meat when the intensive farms are forcibly shut down, should that ever happen.

As for the suggestion that if I don't like killing animals then perhaps I should try raising and killing some well that's... bizarre

 

[subversplat]

<--- Funny how calling people twats didn't save this one, You must try harder

As you're nothing but a common troll on this issue, I can probably safely ignore your posts from now on. Let me know if you've got anything of substance to say.

 

[joustmaster]

which is why I'm against testing of cosmetics (but not medicines) on animals

I agree

this is exactly the point that i'd make to show we have made a moral judgement about the treatment of animals.

I choose to eat animals
I choose to test drugs on animals
I choose not to test makeup on animals.
I choose to wear animal skin

So we have thought about it and made a a decision about how far we will go with it. thats what i think and have decided to do. subversplat has decided a differnt set of options. And its not his place to tell us we are wrong.

 

[Onket]

Bringing it back to the OP then-

I had seal the other weekend while I was in France. It was a mistake, I didn't know that was what it was, but it was very nice.

 

[joustmaster]

You arguments to me are similar to "I enjoy mugging people and I won't stop, sorry" so I won't even bother trying to change your mind (it's unlikely to happen) and just resign myself to the fact that you'll probably stop eating bad meat when the intensive farms are forcibly shut down, should that ever happen.

As for the suggestion that if I don't like killing animals then perhaps I should try raising and killing some well that's... bizarre

There you go humanizing them again. Mugging some one is entirely different to killing animals (or mugging them). If you spent time looking after them in an orgaic farm situation, then perhaps you'd realise that - thanks for clarifying my confusing point.

I don't eat cheap meat anymore as i have money these days, and can afford to eat good quality food.

 

[Roadkill]

subversplat has decided a differnt set of options. And its not his place to tell us we are wrong.

Mmmm, not sure about that.

He's quite entitled to tell us we're wrong, in exactly the same way anyone else who cares about a particular issue is. I don't approve of supermarkets and I urge people who are able to avoid them to do so. by doing so, I lay myself open to the same charge as subversplat. I can live with that, because I think I'm doing the right thing.

On this particular issue, my ethical judgement about animal rights differs from his, and I'm quite happy to debate it. What I'm not happy about is being deemed a bad person (not that he's done that, but some ar campaigners do) because my ethical position is different.

 

[pengaleng]

I love killing things.

 

[subversplat]

So we have thought about it and made a a decision about how far we will go with it. thats what i think and have decided to do. subversplat has decided a differnt set of options. And its not his place to tell us we are wrong.

I was going to leave this thread alone until some of the quite pathetic attacks on AnMarie's post. People started taking the piss and then I started getting pissed off and hence we've had this lovely little barney

There's nothing wrong with telling someone their opinions are wrong, by the way - that's how we've developed so far as a conscious species.

 

[joustmaster]

Mmmm, not sure about that.

He's quite entitled to tell us we're wrong, in exactly the same way anyone else who cares about a particular issue is. I don't approve of supermarkets and I urge people who are able to avoid them to do so. by doing so, I lay myself open to the same charge as subversplat. I can live with that, because I think I'm doing the right thing.

On this particular issue, my ethical judgement about animal rights differs from his, and I'm quite happy to debate it. What I'm not happy about is being deemed a bad person (not that he's done that, but some ar campaigners do) because my ethical position is different.

ok - what i should have said is - He can tell me why he has chosen other options, and why he wouldn't choose my options. I still think its wrong to tell peopel they are wrong. Its all about informing people and letting them make there choices.

But when its a heated debate/arguement we all for get that . I know i do.

 

[pengaleng]

I think the point was that she was yet another of the bile spilling members of the vegetarianism recruitment drive, and it was a bit stupid of her to stick her nose into a thread called 'mmm meats' what the fuck did she expect? not to get flamed?

 

[stevepinker]

I've order the A Really Wild Party Pack which is which is 7 different types of animal, I hope they tastes totally different to chicken and beef.Just a shame i didn't find this site in the summer would have made for a nice BBQ

 

[Roadkill]

I still think its wrong to tell peopel they are wrong. Its all about informing people and letting them make there choices. .

Nah, subversplat's right to say that debate and rational argument is how we've developed as a species.

It's the facility for that which marks us out from every other species on the planet. It's also what invalidates the whole notion of animal rights, but let's not get into that...

 

[WouldBe]

There's nothing wrong with sitting around hoping that people get bowel cancer/CJD/salmonella/E Coli/foot and mouth/whatever other lovely disease the meat industry has introduced this week - especially those sorts that revel in their sadism

It's spinach that's causing those (or similar) infections in the US at the moment.

 

[joustmaster]

Nah, subversplat's right to say that debate and rational argument is how we've developed as a species.

It's the facility for that which marks us out from every other species on the planet. It's also what invalidates the whole notion of animal rights, but let's not get into that...

ok - i think we are agruing the same point.
I'm say or debates/arguements should be driven by facts and logic. Not just saying you're wrong. Intellegent arguements - not just shouting and swearing.

ok - a bit of shouting and swearing then

 

[mr steev]

I think the point was that she was yet another of the bile spilling members of the vegetarianism recruitment drive, and it was a bit stupid of her to stick her nose into a thread called 'mmm meats' what the fuck did she expect? not to get flamed?

Unlike every thread on vegetarians, which will have the obligatory "mmm bacon" post?

As for the morals, I don't see believing animals have "rights" or not being the crux, but whether we have the "right" to cause unnecessary suffering. Which I believe most people believe we don't.
So in the same way veggies are accused of hypocracy for wearing leather or drinking milk, meat eaters will go on about healthy animals and ethical farming but still eat sausage rolls iyswim

It's spinach that's causing those (or similar) infections in the US at the moment.

Due to using animal waste/by products as fertilizers no doubt... one for the vegans

However, if eating meat is something so awful, you might expend a bit of time wondering why we have incisor teeth, if not to slice through meat.

Ever tried to crack a nut with your teeth?

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

And now we get into the ethical side of it...

I've no moral problem with eating meat at all and don't see why I should. I don't buy any of the animal rights arguments: animals don't have 'rights.' Rights are something we give/claim for ourselves, and they presuppose sentience. But I don't believe in treating animals with uneccessary cruelty, which is why I'm against testing of cosmetics (but not medicines) on animals and don't agree with intensive farming.

Word.