Magnolia - Crap / Not Crap?

[killer b]

Its inspired from this thread.

is a grip of basic grammar included in this theory of yours?

 

[akirajoel]

PS - don't agree with everything you say in the other thread, but the basic premise I do...altho I'd amend it to 'People are stupid because they are lazy'...

I agree with your distinction between movies and films.

But surely Magnolia fails on both levels - why did you vote Not Crap?


And included that people are lazy therefore - stupid in my workings. Check reason 1......

 

[andy2002]

I hate Magnolia – it's overlong, pretentious cobblers that has nothing very interesting to say about anything despite wishing it had. Some decent performances from the likes of William H Macy and Philip Seymour Hoffman are its only saving grace.

Punch Drunk Love – by the same director – was shite too.

 

[akirajoel]

I hate Magnolia – it's overlong, pretentious cobblers that has nothing very interesting to say about anything despite wishing it had. Some decent performances from the likes of William H Macy and Philip Seymour Hoffman are its only saving grace.

THANK YOU!!!

 

[killer b]

could you tell us a few films which you consider are serious, AJ?

 

[kyser_soze]

I agree with your distinction between movies and films.

But surely Magnolia fails on both levels - why did you vote Not Crap?


And included that people are lazy therefore - stupid in my workings. Check reason 1......

I really liked Magnolia - from the hyper-reality feel of every scene to the individual performances. From what I remember of it, there were a couple of niggles that annoyed me, but on the whole I rated it as a good film, not a bad-film-but-good-movie.

Damn, gonna have to watch it again now.

And I DO remember it being infinitely better than the polished turd that was Vanilla Sky.

 

[Santino]

I hate Magnolia – it's overlong, pretentious cobblers that has nothing very interesting to say about anything despite wishing it had. Some decent performances from the likes of William H Macy and Philip Seymour Hoffman are its only saving grace.

Succint and pertinent criticism.

On the subject of 'Untouchables', I find it a very poor script redeemed by some decent direction into a mediocre film. 'Carlito's Way' is fucking ace though.

 

[akirajoel]

could you tell us a few films which you consider are serious, AJ?

You misunderstand me Killer - i dont like films just because they're "serious" or whatever. I like films that are well-made and good. And show a bit of intelligence (which isnt the same as being intelligent).

Films I like (feel free to pick one of them apart by saying how much you dont like it):

The Thing
Rosamarys Baby
Donnie Darko
The Game
Fight Club
Christine Malrays Own Double Entry
Jacobs Ladder
Team America: World Police
The Truman Show
Airplane
Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind

(all films off the top of my head)



Will that do?

 

[poului]

Donnie Darko

Aha, Donnie Darko, now that really is an overrated sack of shit!


Name me a scene in DD that rivals the intensity of Tom Cruise's interview scene or Jason Robards' deathbed lament in Magnolia and I'll eat my hat.


EDIT - and not only that, but your "theory"'s criticism of an "empty arthouse" style present in some films actually fits Donnie Darko way better than fucking Magnolia! The irony is overwhelming!

 

[killer b]

fair enough - i've enjoyed most of the films i've seen from your list, and i don't really have much interest in picking any of them apart. the day is far too short...

i was just curious... you seem to be on your high horse about high/low culture today, and i wanted to see how cultured you were. it's pretty much as i expected.

 

[akirajoel]

i was just curious... you seem to be on your high horse about high/low culture today, and i wanted to see how cultured you were. it's pretty much as i expected.

Actually its less of a high horse - more a pony.

 

[akirajoel]

Aha, Donnie Darko, now that really is an overrated sack of shit!


Name me a scene in DD that rivals the intensity of Tom Cruise's interview scene or James Coburn's deathbed lament in Magnolia and I'll eat my hat.

 

[poului]

well go on then!

 

[akirajoel]

You're obviously a fool poului...

What other kinda films do you like?

 

[poului]

You're obviously a fool poului...

Obviously.

What other kinda films do you like?

Not fucking Donnie Darko, that's for sure.

 

[akirajoel]

Not fucking Donnie Darko, that's for sure.

*yawn!*


*leaves thread*

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

IYSWIM. I just find it useful to switch certain critical faculties off. For example, Independence Day and Van Helsing are both movies, but IMO ID is a far better piece of movie-making than VH. It's funnier, it's got a better story, it's narrative progression makes some kind of sense etc.

I agree (although I'm not keen on Independence Day). I'd rather watch a good movie like the original Star Wars trilogy, for instance than a bad film, like any one of many crap french films I watched when I was in France (the ones that never seethe light of day in the UK)...

 

[Grandma Death]

Brilliant....P T Anderson is showing much more flair and ability with his first few films (Hard Eight, Boogie Nights, Punch Drunk Love and Magnolia) than a lot of the established directors and their first few films-P T Anderson is a genius IMO.

 

[Grandma Death]

A quote from someone else (whose opinions match my own):

"P.T. Anderson's "style" is a direct lift of Martin Scorsese's style, only P.T. doesn't know how to use it. Sure, MAGNOLIA was chuck full of LONG steadicam shots, "dramatic" push-ins, and various other little tricks, but to what end? NONE of these devices were well used in the film- they ALL called attention to themselves. If Kevin wanted to be self-conscious, he could wildly throw around the camera too because it's "cool", but you know what? He doesn't need to dress his films up with a bunch of window-dressing to make them interesting. Take away all the overbearing "style" and what have you got with MAGNOLIA? Three still boring, but less annoyingly self-consciously "cool" hours of tripe. Every camera move in MAGNOLIA seems to serve but one purpose- P.T. Anderson looking at us and jumping up and down exclaiming- "LOOK! I did a steadicam shot like the one in GOODFELLAS! I'm cool, right? RIGHT?? Actually, he's probably saying he hasn't seen any of those movies- there's a boatload of movies that I'm sure were really bad that I didn't see this year, because I had no interest in seeing them. MAGNOLIA is the worst kind of failure, because it's such a self-conscious, insincere attempt to be "meaningful" and "important", and it fails so badly because P.T. doesn't have his heart in any of it, and it shows."

That review is fucking gash.

Scorsese didnt pioneer the steadicam shot-so why the fuck is he comparing it to Goodfellas. The steadicam goes as far back as the 1976 film Bound For Glory IIRC and was popularised by Kubrick in The Shining. Granted PT Anderson does a hell of a lot of jump cut editing-but hey again Scorsese wasn't the pioneer of this style of film making either. Problem with this reviewer is his dick is so far up Scorseses arse he can't see the wood for the trees.

 

[kyser_soze]

That review is fucking gash.

So much more succinct than my paragraph above^^^^

 

[Grandma Death]

So much more succinct than my paragraph above^^^^

I always believe in getting straight to the point when it's pretty fucking obvious the reviewer hasn't got a clue about films

 

[Yossarian]

You misunderstand me Killer - i dont like films just because they're "serious" or whatever. I like films that are well-made and good. And show a bit of intelligence (which isnt the same as being intelligent).

Films I like (feel free to pick one of them apart by saying how much you dont like it):

The Thing
Rosamarys Baby
Donnie Darko
The Game
Fight Club
Christine Malrays Own Double Entry
Jacobs Ladder
Team America: World Police
The Truman Show
Airplane
Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind

(all films off the top of my head)



Will that do?

Airplane pisses all over the rest of those films from a great height, as anyone knows.

I saw Magnolia in a double-bill with Dude, Where's My Car - I thought Magnolia was better but could have used some of the brevity of the latter.

 

[sparkling]

I thought Magnolia was great and have watched it a few times much to the disgust of other people in my home who hate it...maybe its the marmite of the film world you either love it or hate it.

ps I also thought Tom Cruise put in the best perfomance of his life in the film and showed that he could actually act as opposed to just looking pretty.

 

[Firky]

I've never watched it to the end, so it must be crap

 

[Firky]

Films I like (feel free to pick one of them apart by saying how much you dont like it):

The Thing
Rosamarys Baby
Donnie Darko
The Game
Fight Club
Christine Malrays Own Double Entry
Jacobs Ladder
Team America: World Police
The Truman Show
Airplane
Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind

(all films off the top of my head)

The Thing - alreet
Rosamarys Baby - alreet
Donnie Darko - alreet but vastly over rated
The Game - shite
Fight Club - over played and rated
Christine Malrays Own Double Entry - aint seen
Jacobs Ladder - good
Team America: World Police - funny for about twenty minutes
The Truman Show - shite
Airplane - classic
Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind - pretty good actually

 

[Firky]

Airplane pisses all over the rest of those films from a great height, as anyone knows.

I saw Magnolia in a double-bill with Dude, Where's My Car - I thought Magnolia was better but could have used some of the brevity of the latter.

There was going to be a sequel called 'Seriously, dude. Where's my car'

best name for a sequel. ever.

 

[Pieman]

It staggered between Altman-esque great and self indulgent crap until the characters started singing along with Aimee Mann; at which point it went completely off the rails into crapville. The raining toads only finished the deal.

 

[oi2002]

"It's dangerous to mistake children for Angels"

Love this film.

That's perhaps the worst line. I was reminded a little of Festen, which is also melodramatic cack and not half as clever.

Magnolia is a rather dodgy construction but it has an outstanding cast going at it like a starved badger. Macey moaning like a bitch, Robards on his deathbed, Cruise all teeth and trousers and that awesome Ginger woman to mention just a few.

One of the best movies to come out of Holywood in some time. The extensive cruelty to frogs was just gravy.

 

[jayeola]

There's no such a thing as a crap colour. Just depends on how it's used. Magnolia brings back many memories of me being a teenager bored at home.... daydreaming....bored....

 

[GroovySunday]

Watched it quite recently after not seeing it for about fifteen years. Amazing film. Brilliant acting by the whole cast, including Tom Cruise. He was at his best ever. Such a powerful, gripping film but also has it's moments of humour. And the scene where the old, dying man is talking about regret made me cry.