Mac sales fall, windows PCs up 7%

[tarannau]

Yes, but they're a more slightly more effete curl of cat shit rather than the honking indiscriminate bovine turds of the likes of MS or Dell.

To be fair to Apple, they've also made significant progress towards greening/greenwashing their products subsequent to that 2008 artcile from Greenpeace. After Apple touted their new eco-friendler MacBook Greenpeace responded by saying:

"While Apple and other top electronic companies still face many challenges on the road to truly green electronics, it can only be a good thing to see a top CEO and high profile a public figure as Steve Jobs devoting significant time to environmental concerns at Apple," the environmental group said in a statement today.

Source Treehugger.com (no, seriously)

And subsequent to that Apple's also updated the imac, mac mini and mac pro, promoting their new green friendlier credentials to some acclaim. OK, it's a bit tardy and perhaps slightly cynical, but they've made a genuine effort to consistently update their product line to arguably the best standards in the industry.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

To be fair, Apple's never released a product like the XBox on the market, with 10times the failure rate of its competitors, consistent hardware fail despite revisions and needing to be heavily subsidised to gain market share. In fact it's taken until about now for the XBox division to make even the slightest profit, notwithstanding the 1 billion $ contingency fund MS had to put aside to cover returns.

It's a hell of a way to buy your way into a market and batter the opposition with an inferior, faulty product. That hardly speaks of a company committed to the highest quality experience for its users, nor one willing not to abuse its market position and monopoly profits to enter another sector.

How do you mean 10x the failure rate of its competitors?

 

[Kid_Eternity]

The games aren't comparatively expensive.

Your points are valid, but for me, I'm getting a great console for £100. I'm happy.

It's more than that though, the online experience is the best of this or previous console generations (they've achieved what Sega probably would have if they'd had the cash to keep making hardware). It's the reason I'm happy with my machine, single player is great fun but online pisses all over it imo.

 

[tarannau]

The estimated historical failure rate of console over 3 years is/was apparently 2-4%. Return rate of xboxes is estimated at the 20%-30% range, with the rate of multiple returns unprecedented. Consoles were generally stable, hardware consistent platforms in the past

I did post up a load of links on an earlier x-box rantathon on this board, including comments from one of the USA's biggest repair shops. A quick google or search should back me up, but allow me some laziness here

 

[Gromit]

Apple will only Greenwash their products whilst their demographic see being enviromentally friendly as cool.

Its cool to spend more on a hybrid car cause poor people can't afford them and you can pretend how nice you are whilst being individual and exclusive.

When it ceases to be cool Apple will stop doing it.

 

[editor]

And subsequent to that Apple's also updated the imac, mac mini and mac pro, promoting their new green friendlier credentials to some acclaim. OK, it's a bit tardy and perhaps slightly cynical, but they've made a genuine effort to consistently update their product line to arguably the best standards in the industry.

Yes. Their standards are so class-leading that in Greenpeace's last study of less than four months ago, Apple found themselves firmly residing in the bottom quarter, trailing behind Nokia, Sony Ericsson, Toshiba, Samsung, Fujitsu Siemens, LGE, Motorola, Sony, Panasonic, Sharp, Acer, Dell and HP, and to add insult to industry, they once again refused to offer their products to Greenpleace for independent testing.

I know you love Apple, but sometimes you've got to get your head out of your arse and accept that they can be just as bad as other companies when it comes to business practices.

If Palm turn out to be a bunch of twats when it comes to environmental concerns, I'd be the first to acknowledge it (heck, I'd even write to them to moan) but how you can twist Greenpeace's figures into a claim that Apple now offer the "best standards in the industry" is frankly nothing short of delusional.

 

[tarannau]

Yeah, but Apple's design ethos of quality, small form factors (in the main) and high energy efficiency tends to encourage greener products.

My 8 year old cube is still chugging along. Doesn't need a fan - striking for a 'supercomputer' of the time - because of some clever convection cooling. Same with the original imacs.

 

[winjer]

but how you can twist Greenpeace's figures

Which 'figures' would they be?

 

[editor]

Which 'figures' would they be?

The ones included their study. But if it makes you happy, let me replace 'figures' for 'findings.'

Yeah, but Apple's design ethos of quality, small form factors (in the main) and high energy efficiency tends to encourage greener products.

My 8 year old cube is still chugging along. Doesn't need a fan - striking for a 'supercomputer' of the time - because of some clever convection cooling. Same with the original imacs.

None of which is particularly relevant.

 

[winjer]

The ones included their study. But if it makes you happy, let me replace 'figures' for 'findings.'

Because there aren't any figures.

As Greenpeace freely admits, so why make shit up?

 

[Kid_Eternity]

The estimated historical failure rate of console over 3 years is/was apparently 2-4%. Return rate of xboxes is estimated at the 20%-30% range, with the rate of multiple returns unprecedented. Consoles were generally stable, hardware consistent platforms in the past

I did post up a load of links on an earlier x-box rantathon on this board, including comments from one of the USA's biggest repair shops. A quick google or search should back me up, but allow me some laziness here

Ah right, no probs not having a go was just curious how you were defining failure (I was skim reading).

 

[ChrisFilter]

I thought console return rate was an average 8%, historically.

Isn't the PS3 12%?

 

[editor]

Because there aren't any figures.

As Greenpeace freely admits, so why make shit up?

If 'findings' isn't good enough for you, feel free to put forward an alternative description.

 

[spacemonkey]

I don't really see that as a valid comparison seeing as you can pick up an iPhone for nothing on contract.

I know this isn't really relevant to the thread. But I still can't believe people think that the phones are free.

For a 'free' Iphone on O2 you have to stump up £45/month for 18 months.

That's a whopping £810 you're committed to paying them.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

I thought console return rate was an average 8%, historically.

Isn't the PS3 12%?

I've normally seen the 3-4% figure quoted...never heard the PS3 is so high though.

 

[elbows]

I dont understand why its so hard for some to get the balance right, love Apple for the things they do well, hate them for the things that make skin crawl, fine. If product is for you, buy it, if not, dont.

Or start a competitor to beat Apple at their own game, do what they do well, better, and dont do the freaky stuff they do. Call it Worm Computers.

 

[pk]

I know this isn't really relevant to the thread. But I still can't believe people think that the phones are free.

For a 'free' Iphone on O2 you have to stump up £45/month for 18 months.

That's a whopping £810 you're committed to paying them.

You'd also be paying similar for a Nokia or any of the other smart phones, albeit in a 12 month contract...

 

[editor]

You'd also be paying similar for a Nokia or any of the other smart phones, albeit in a 12 month contract...

18 months is a helluva time to be stuck with a phone that's tied to one network.

 

[Crispy]

Hah, I've had the same phone for 5 years and the same contract for 9

 

[editor]

Hah, I've had the same phone for 5 years and the same contract for 9

But you had a Treo 680 a while ago. I saw it! I touched it!

 

[Kid_Eternity]

18 months is what I expect the Palm Pre to be sold on contract wise, I'm more than happy to sign up to a 18 month contract if the phone is decent and got a good build.

 

[spacemonkey]

You'd also be paying similar for a Nokia or any of the other smart phones, albeit in a 12 month contract...

My point wasn't to single out the Iphone, (although it is stupidly expensive). Just the notion that the handsets are somehow free.

It just seem that normally rational people get sucked into 'free stuff' when it's bundled with a mobile phone contract.

I had a friend bragging about his free ps3....on a 24 month £55 contract.

 

[editor]

18 months is what I expect the Palm Pre to be sold on contract wise, I'm more than happy to sign up to a 18 month contract if the phone is decent and got a good build.

I *really* don't want to sign an 18 month deal - I've always been a 12 month kinda fella - but so long as it's not tied to one network forever, it'll at least be easier to sell.

 

[pk]

My point wasn't to single out the Iphone, (although it is stupidly expensive). Just the notion that the handsets are somehow free.

It just seem that normally rational people get sucked into 'free stuff' when it's bundled with a mobile phone contract.

I had a friend bragging about his free ps3....on a 24 month £55 contract.

I got a good deal as I migrated from a 14 year business contract, 18 months is nothing really...

 

[Kid_Eternity]

I *really* don't want to sign an 18 month deal - I've always been a 12 month kinda fella - but so long as it's not tied to one network forever, it'll at least be easier to sell.

Me either but for something like the Pre I think I could live with it...

 

[editor]

Latest sales figures see sales are down all over t'shop.

PC sales slumped 6.5-percent with 67.2 million units shipped during the last quarter, although HP managed to shove its way to the worldwide #1 slot shifting 13.3million units, way head of Dell’s 8.8 million. Acer are in third place with a huge 26 percent rise, with Lenovo and Toshiba in fourth and fiifth place. I can't see Sony anywhere in there, so they must be royally borked.

Apple's growing US market share has come to an abrupt end too: they started off at 7.5 percent of the market at the beginning of last year, soared to 8 percent but now they've slumped back down to 7.4 percent.

Stat fans thisaway-> http://gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=939015
(Slightly off topic, but Nokia reported a 96% drop in profits. Ouch!)

 

[Idaho]

Stat fans thisaway-> http://gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=939015
(Slightly off topic, but Nokia reported a 96% drop in profits. Ouch!)

To be fair - the fact they are still making any profit in the current climate is some saving grace.

 

[editor]

To be fair - the fact they are still making any profit in the current climate is some saving grace.

Netbooks have certainly boosted Windows XP sales by a massive factor and shunted Asus into the big boy league.

I've never owned anything by the current #1 HP, but they shift PCs galore in the States.

 

[Silva]

I've seen Apple laptops going for something less than £700 here, which is remarkably cheap for them (the low-end usual went around £900, I think). They recalled their phased out models much faster even just one year ago, so perhaps they're noticing there's market for slightly outdated but cheaper quality tech. Or their Iberian distributor did, or retailers told them to fuck off.

Just a question re: Netbooks - is the XP version the same "vanilla" installed in Desktops, or are those tweaked to fit netbooks? When it came out, I remember complete magazines devoted to "tweak XP to run on a Pentium II", most of them hints on removing unnecessary services that are loaded by default on most installations. Still on the subject, the "they can't run OSX" excuse is bollocks, as they can easily develop a slimmer version developed with them in mind. They aren't used in the same way as regular laptops do (more often than not, desktop replacements - those gigantic "22 panoramic screen things aren't exactly what I'd carry on a backpack), so they don't need a full-fledged OS either.

 

[Crispy]

Vanilla XP