Louis Theroux - Dark States

[Smokeandsteam]

There was a part where someone was saying that painkillers were always just available at home as family members did manual jobs. I took from this that manual jobs = pain so taking pain killers to keep working which in turn became normalised for the kids to see & then do.

Yes. But also those who had the drugs prescribed (which seemed to have been response to work related injury rather than actually treating them) often didn't bother taking them meaning a ready supply was always at hand

 

[twentythreedom]

It was an excellent - if grim - watch but Theroux missed a trick but not delving deeper into the deindustrialisation angle in more detail.

He found and reported a clear link time and again between industrial injury from working in the steel mills etc that lead to the explosion of 'legal drug' prescription and use by those suffering and also their curious kids.

Examining in closer detail the collapse of industry and jobs and the concomintant use of heroin - as the legal pills were cut off - would have made for a brilliant piece of investigative journalism.

Agreed. I thought is was a good, hard-hitting, and authentic view of the addicts' worlds but he did miss a trick there.

 

[twentythreedom]

If someone is a heroin addict would going back on pain pills cut the mustard? Surely that would be preferable to all this fucking about with needles and dealers and not knowing the strength of the gear.
Or once you have graduated from pain pills to heroin there's no going back?

Methadone, morphine sulphate etc (used for maintenance) is pain medication, and often prescribed to heroin users as a substitute in pill form. Had both prescribed myself when I was trying to get off heroin. It's incredibly common.

 

[maomao]

Does this get broadcast in the US? The woman who lived with her dealer/boyfriend talking about him while he was out of the room was a little worrying if it does.

 

[D'wards]

Theroux found that the supply of 'the pain pills' was suddenly and drastically withdrawn or totally withdrawn due to the levels of dependency. Hence the growing attraction of heroin for those hooked.

Yah, my point was that if they prescribed pain pills to addicts, rather than those in pain, would it help the situation?

 

[maomao]

If someone is a heroin addict would going back on pain pills cut the mustard? Surely that would be preferable to all this fucking about with needles and dealers and not knowing the strength of the gear.
Or once you have graduated from pain pills to heroin there's no going back?

I doubt there's one answer that's true for everyone.

Dunno what I'd do if they cut off my cocodamol. It's a wonder drug for me.

 

[D'wards]

Does this get broadcast in the US? The woman who lived with her dealer/boyfriend talking about him while he was out of the room was a little worrying if it does.

What an evil c-word he was. The girl seemed sweet, and could probably have a normal happy life if she could leave the gear alone.

 

[twentythreedom]

Yah, my point was that if they prescribed pain pills to addicts, rather than those in pain, would it help the situation?

They do, and it does (talking generally rather than specific context of the prog)

 

[Treacle Toes]

There was a part where someone was saying that painkillers were always just available at home as family members did manual jobs. I took from this that manual jobs = pain so taking pain killers to keep working which in turn became normalised for the kids to see & then do.

Yep, that was a clear point made. That taking meds were part and parcel of doing manual work in those areas. Completely normal.

 

[Plumdaff]

There's also the way medication is prescribed in a private system. There's no incentive not to write a script, to suggest trying paracetamol and seeing how it goes etc in a system that is about making money with every transaction. So painkillers (and many other types of meds) are overprescribed, prescribed in combination and more potent drugs scripted without evidence on a level unfathomable here.

 

[Treacle Toes]

There's also the way medication is prescribed in a private system. There's no incentive not to write a script, to suggest trying paracetamol and seeing how it goes etc in a system that is about making money with every transaction. So painkillers (and many other types of meds) are overprescribed, prescribed in combination and more potent drugs scripted without evidence on a level unfathomable here.

THe OH was also telling me about how very strong meds are available over the counter so people simply have more access to stuff that can lead to addiction.

 

[Mumbles274]

It was an interesting documentary and a really good thread about it too. Thanks, some of these posts provide some insight for me. Have worked with a couple of young US women that have come over here from that sort of background. I'm not unaware about the situation over there.obviousl but the points about what Lois could have raised were very interesting

 

[twentythreedom]

There's also the way medication is prescribed in a private system. There's no incentive not to write a script, to suggest trying paracetamol and seeing how it goes etc in a system that is about making money with every transaction. So painkillers (and many other types of meds) are overprescribed, prescribed in combination and more potent drugs scripted without evidence on a level unfathomable here.

It does happen here. Eg I was prescribed by an expensive private doctor 240mg a day of morphine sulphate (well over LD50) after a relapse post detox, without any test dosing or titration. Could easily have killed someone, but in my case unfortunately it didn't even touch the sides

It's no doubt (or was) far worse in the States, but has / did happen here lots too. I've heard plenty of stories about dangerous and irresponsible prescribing of opioids to addicts by private doctors. In fact I ended up giving evidence to the GMC in one case about dangerous prescribing practices by a doctor whose care I was under but that's (not) for another thread.

 

[Plumdaff]

Yes twentythreedom I should have added that it can happen here. But as you say, when it does, it tends to be in the private system. Having said that, I've seen some terrible prescribing of benzos by GPs in the NHS, but thankfully that's getting rarer over time.

 

[twentythreedom]

Yes twentythreedom I should have added that it can happen here. But as you say, when it does, it tends to be in the private system. Having said that, I've seen some terrible prescribing of benzos by GPs in the NHS, but thankfully that's getting rarer over time.

Yeah I wasn't disagreeing with you really Just that I feel this issue really personally after my experiences. We certainly don't have adverts for opioids on the telly here like they do in the USA ("Ask your doctor for.... etc ), or the disgusting pervasive influence of big pharma in prescribing practices here (not so much anyway).

 

[cybershot]

Why is heroin killing so many people? - BBC News

 

[pengaleng]

the second one about sex traffiking keeps mentioning a site called backpage, theres a docu on netflix about backpage called 'I am Jane Doe' which might be worth watching

 

[sim667]

I thought last nights was much better than the previous ones, he seemed to do a much better job of breaking down barriers with the people he was interviewing.

 

[cybershot]

I thought last nights was much better than the previous ones, he seemed to do a much better job of breaking down barriers with the people he was interviewing.

I was surprised this didn't really cross over, i.e. that the sex workers were reliant on drugs, but alas, they all seemed to have their shit together in comparison. Just trapped in a different way.

I guess breaking down barriers with heroin addicts however is somewhat extremely difficult at the best of times, let alone in a limited time frame.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Was quite surprised it said at the end that Nikki left her pimp a couple of days after their last meeting. I can't think of many other instances of Louis' actions potentially having a life-changing effect on someone in his docs.

 

[D'wards]

Odd that in the 90s rappers like snoop dogg glamourised pimps when they are horrible evil cunts. There's few worse in society.

 

[Badgers]

 

[Mr.Bishie]

The depressing meter upped a notch on tonight’s episode. Land of the free, eh?

 

[Calamity1971]

Yep Mr.Bishie, that was fairly bleak. The woman who can cook, look after her kids and shoot at the same time! I jump if a door slams, they were so used to it the calmness when hearing a shot from a car/van was at most an angry shrug?

 

[Mr.Bishie]

Grim

 

[stavros]

I "enjoyed" it, but it didn't have as much focus as most of his other stuff. Maybe the theme of "Milwaukee is a forgotten shithole" was too wide.

He has a UK one on anorexia at the same time next week.

 

[D'wards]

I love Louis, but think it'd be good if the next series was one of his lighthearted ones.

Like the Savile and Paul Daniels etc

 

[toblerone3]

The Second Amendent is wrong. Loud and Clear and Simple. American constitution is rotten at the core. Louis did not mention gun control at all. Its not even a question. Horrible country, so angry at America.

 

[krtek a houby]

Not a Louis Theroux piece but very grim all the same

Why does US have so many child brides?

 

[stavros]

Louis did not mention gun control at all. Its not even a question.

I suspect because he knew he'd be talking to a brick wall, and a brick wall that couldn't do anything about it. It would take a repeat of Obama with Democrats ruling both houses to get any legislation through, and even then so many millions of guns would remain in private possession that nutjobs would still go on sprees.