LGBT Support for Israel

[DownwardDog]

thats how i think it goes anyway - if i've missed something majorly important someone stop me

Another thing worth recalling is that zionists have had a major hard on for Gaza ever since the minority Jewish population was beaten, looted and burned out in the 1929 riots.

 

[jcsd]

Who cares? What Israel is doing is wrong, infact not just wrong, but very wrong. I don't really want to hear mealy-mouthed justifcations, whoever them come from.

 

[DotCommunist]

another quality thread from Cumbrialandoddball

 

[ViolentPanda]

It died centuries back, whereas the obscenity that is Sharia law is alive and well.

Well, to be accurate, it stopped killing people about 120 years ago (overtly anyway, who knows what the soldiers of Rome get up to in their spare time?), and changed it's name, so it too is "alive and well". It's now known as the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, former head one Joseph Ratzinger, now known as Pope Benedict XVI.

 

[ViolentPanda]

The article was by a Jewish person, I would have thought it more likely a Jewish person would be supporting Israel's appalling(imho)actions in Gaza than a non Jewish person.

The fact that she is Jewish as well as gay makes her stance at least slightly understandable.

If a non Jewish gay had made the same suggestion it would not have made any sense at all. The suggestion being that gays should support Israel's current actions in Gaza because of Israels(alledged)more liberal stance on gays than it's neighbours.

Being a Jew in no way implies implicit or explicit support of the policies of the state of Israel, as anyone with even an ounce of knowledge of or acquaintance to Jews would know.
In fact you'll find that there are probably more Christian Zionists that support the state of Israel's actions in Gaza than there are Jews that do the same.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Obviously things can get a bit more complicated but I was purely pointing out that the person making the case started by saying something entirely unncontroversial and moderate, namely that Israel has the right to maintain its borders within the reasonable boundaries of international law.

As for maintaining a Jewish majority at all costs - I don't even know what you're talking about - I imagine youdo, but I don't.

The state of Israel has a very real and very pressing demographic problem: It's population, notwithstanding the fecundity of the Orthodox community, is growing at a very slow rate, far slower than it's neighbours.
This idea of the maintenance of a Jewish majority has led, over the past several decades, to such manouvres as: using agents provocateurs to scare entire Jewish communities in Arab countries into emigrating to Israel; allowing relict Jewish populations such as the Beta Israel and the Bene Israel to emigrate into Israel (and then treating them like shit because they happen to be ethnically different); encouraging emigration from Russia and the former Soviet Union by people (a couple of million by now) with little provable Jewish heritage except family tales or the fact that they once sat down and ate a sandwich near an abandoned synagogue (I may be exaggerating slightly with that last one! ) or ploughing vast PR resources into "pumping up" incidences of anti-Semitism in Europe and the US in order to encourage Jewish emigration to the only supposedly safe place for Jews in the whole world.
That's not to mention the "sweeteners" offered to appropriate immigrants.

All of this in order to attempt to deflect demographic reality, to maintain a Jewish majority population and to justify settlement and expansionism.

 

[frogwoman]

Well, to be accurate, it stopped killing people about 120 years ago (overtly anyway, who knows what the soldiers of Rome get up to in their spare time?), and changed it's name, so it too is "alive and well". It's now known as the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, former head one Joseph Ratzinger, now known as Pope Benedict XVI.

Opus Dei still kills people, allegedly.

 

[CUMBRIANDRAGON]

another quality thread from Cumbrialandoddball

Thankyou very much.I get my inspiration frtom thr left

 

[8ball]

The state of Israel has a very real and very pressing demographic problem: It's population, notwithstanding the fecundity of the Orthodox community, is growing at a very slow rate, far slower than it's neighbours.
This idea of the maintenance of a Jewish majority has led, over the past several decades, to such manouvres as: using agents provocateurs to scare entire Jewish communities in Arab countries into emigrating to Israel; allowing relict Jewish populations such as the Beta Israel and the Bene Israel to emigrate into Israel (and then treating them like shit because they happen to be ethnically different); encouraging emigration from Russia and the former Soviet Union by people (a couple of million by now) with little provable Jewish heritage except family tales or the fact that they once sat down and ate a sandwich near an abandoned synagogue (I may be exaggerating slightly with that last one! ) or ploughing vast PR resources into "pumping up" incidences of anti-Semitism in Europe and the US in order to encourage Jewish emigration to the only supposedly safe place for Jews in the whole world.
That's not to mention the "sweeteners" offered to appropriate immigrants.

All of this in order to attempt to deflect demographic reality, to maintain a Jewish majority population and to justify settlement and expansionism.

Thanks again.

Though I'd be surprised about a Jew living in Nottingham deciding that Israel was a safer bet, I'm sure in some instances in some places (esp. Russia) this kind of PR could be successful in bring people home to invented Jewish motherland.

What is the main big danger to Israel if it loses a Jewish majority? Would it be a matter of possible loss of US support?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Opus Dei still kills people, allegedly.

Hence my line about "...overtly, anyway...".

 

[ViolentPanda]

Thanks again.

Though I'd be surprised about a Jew living in Nottingham deciding that Israel was a safer bet, I'm sure in some instances in some places (esp. Russia) this kind of PR could be successful in bring people home to invented Jewish motherland.

You'd be amazed.
We had a hilarious thread a couple of years ago where a pro-Zionist Canadian journo span the rise in anti-Semitic attacks after the last but one big banlieu blow-up (you know, the one where a rise in French North Africans attacking anyone and anything was recorded?) into a horror story of respectable bourgeois French Jews being forced through fear to emigrate to Israel.
The only error in the story was that the emigration figures were the same for every previous year, anti-Semitism or no anti-Semitism, roughly 5,000 a year.
We still have a couple of thousand British Jews a year emigrating. Usually orthodox Judaists, to be sure, but some secular Zionists too. It's a matter of belief. If you believe you'll be safer in the belly of your people, then...
Me, I may be a Jew, but I'm an English Jew. I'm not an Israeli, and don't intend to ever be. Even if anti-Semitism became a massive issue in the UK, I'd stand and fight here as an English Jew, not thousands of miles away.

What is the main big danger to Israel if it loses a Jewish majority? Would it be a matter of possible loss of US support?

Very little to do with that, but a lot (IMO) to do with losing political control, and losing any legitimacy (if any remains) for the idea of a Jewish state.