Labour Councillor defects to Respect

[Zeppo]

Despite the usual negative remarks from some on Respect. It is a fact that the biggest left of centre votes i.e. actual people that have been put their cross on the ballot since post 1945 has gone to Respect.

Of course this could be an indication of the vast vacuum on the left in terms of electoral politics. New Labour is very right wing and has attacked the workers on all fronts.

This will not be the last defection from the Labour ranks.

 

[Fisher_Gate]

I do support PR, why go for the swipe (numpty? heh..)? Just because I didn't mention it doesn't mean I don't support it. Ugh, cripes, Respect have me forming clumsy sentences....

And Respect as a whole is a party I cannot abide. Michael, who may well be the face of Respect /in Preston/ is someone I do have time for.

Really, Fisher_Gate, must I spell /everything/ out...? =D

Respect came 2nd in 4 out of 5 wards with an average vote of over 25%, (and won 2,800 votes in 2005) across the inner urban part of Preston, but has yet to turn this into seats because of FPTP. This is not a failure - this is a success in building support.

What is it about Respect you cannot abide that is not reflected in Michael Lavalette? Goodness.. I hope it isn't because he's white?

Must I spell everything out ...?

 

[Streathamite]

Despite the usual negative remarks from some on Respect. It is a fact that the biggest left of centre votes i.e. actual people that have been put their cross on the ballot since post 1945 has gone to Respect.

errmmm...you do realise you're spouting utter shite here, yes? FWIW the manifesto Labour fought in '74 on was no less 'socialist', and no more reformist, than RESPECTs manifesto of 2005, but without the craven kowtowing to medieval deistic superstition

 

[Groucho]

errmmm...you do realise you're spouting utter shite here, yes? FWIW the manifesto Labour fought in '74 on was no less 'socialist', and no more reformist, than RESPECTs manifesto of 2005, but without the craven kowtowing to medieval deistic superstition

Bollocks.

What's on TV?

 

[Streathamite]

Respect came 2nd in 4 out of 5 wards with an average vote of over 25%, (and won 2,800 votes in 2005) across the inner urban part of Preston, but has yet to turn this into seats because of FPTP. This is not a failure - this is a success in building support.

A success of the very tiniest type, and it'd be interesting to see what %age of those votes AREN'T muslim

What is it about Respect you cannot abide that is not reflected in Michael Lavalette? Goodness.. I hope it isn't because he's white?

well, there's a turnup, WESPECK supporters deflect criticism of their busted-flush project by thcweaming 'wacist'...
I agree with liam here, I think ML is a decent, honourable man, just with completely delusional politics

Must I spell everything out ...?

must you play the 'racist' card?

 

[becky p]

Despite the usual negative remarks from some on Respect. It is a fact that the biggest left of centre votes i.e. actual people that have been put their cross on the ballot since post 1945 has gone to Respect.

Of course this could be an indication of the vast vacuum on the left in terms of electoral politics. New Labour is very right wing and has attacked the workers on all fronts.

This will not be the last defection from the Labour ranks.

RESPECT have done well to offer some kind of political alternative to anti war voters and yes lots of them maybe muslim but what exactly is the problem with that. It appears that a lot of people on these threads just look for any opportunity to be negative without ever saying something constructive.

 

[Groucho]

RESPECT have done well to offer some kind of political alternative to anti war voters and yes lots of them maybe muslim but what exactly is the problem with that. It appears that a lot of people on these threads just look for any opportunity to be negative without ever saying something constructive.

Yep,tell me about it!

 

[Streathamite]

Bollocks.

What's on TV?

well no, I've had a good look at the manifesto for 05, and it strikes me as very 'Old Labour', in fact were it not for the fact it's nowhere near as vague, then 'Labour 1983' also came to mind.
which - given that you're going after all the voters Labour left behind, makes sense.

 

[Groucho]

well no, I've had a good look at the manifesto for 05, and it strikes me as very 'Old Labour', in fact were it not for the fact it's nowhere near as vague, then 'Labour 1983' also came to mind.
which - given that you're going after all the voters Labour left behind, makes sense.

No, it might resemble the political programm the Labour left would have liked to have seen adopted, but it is more radical than the 1983 or 1974 manifestos, especially when you consider the political climate. I mean keep the railways nationalised would not have been radical in 1983 but renationalise the railways is too radical for LP in 2007.

 

[Fullyplumped]

Whilst I have little care or time for Respect I have a lot of time for Michael, and understand he is to stand for re-election this year. He made another front page story this past week regarding the CAT schemes in Preston.

Please indulge me, and explain what CAT schemes in Preston are, and why Respect think they're a bad thing. I tried googling the phrase and your candidate's name but wasn't enlightened.

 

[TAE]

lots of them maybe muslim but what exactly is the problem with that

I think many people see Respect targetting those votes at the expense of other issues (womens rights, holocaust denial, etc).

 

[Fisher_Gate]

errmmm...you do realise you're spouting utter shite here, yes? FWIW the manifesto Labour fought in '74 on was no less 'socialist', and no more reformist, than RESPECTs manifesto of 2005, but without the craven kowtowing to medieval deistic superstition

What was 'socialist' about this:

"Britain has a responsibility in Northern Ireland and the Labour Party rejects the view that the troops should be pulled out in advance of a political solution."

does it sound familiar ...

 

[Fisher_Gate]

I think many people see Respect targetting those votes at the expense of other issues (womens rights, holocaust denial, etc).

bit ironic really ... can you find the refusal to take up womens rights in Respect literature? cos I can find dozens of examples where it take it up. And Salma Yaqoob wrote a long piece for the Guardian online opposing the boycott of holocaust memorial day by the Muslim Council for britain which has a link to it from the Respect website. Do I need to provide all the links?

 

[Fisher_Gate]

Please indulge me, and explain what CAT schemes in Preston are, and why Respect think they're a bad thing. I tried googling the phrase and your candidate's name but wasn't enlightened.

http://www.lep.co.uk/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleID=2040508&SectionID=5400

This article was the front page of the local paper. Web article has video footage of Michael Lavalette winning the vote at the meeting.

 

[Fisher_Gate]

http://www.lep.co.uk/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleID=2040508&SectionID=5400

This article was the front page of the local paper. Web article has video footage of Michael Lavalette winning the vote at the meeting.

Earlier article leading up to the meeting. Respect and Unison were the main instigators of the protest.

http://www.lep.co.uk/viewarticle.aspx?sectionid=73&ArticleID=2037988

 

[Fisher_Gate]

A success of the very tiniest type, and it'd be interesting to see what %age of those votes AREN'T muslim


well, there's a turnup, WESPECK supporters deflect criticism of their busted-flush project by thcweaming 'wacist'...
I agree with liam here, I think ML is a decent, honourable man, just with completely delusional politics


must you play the 'racist' card?

Who in Respect is not "decent" or "honourable" and why not?

In the case of Preston Riversway ward, where Respect has twice scored 25%, Muslims constitute around 10% of the electorate, less than Hindus on 12%.

 

[Fullyplumped]

http://www.lep.co.uk/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleID=2040508&SectionID=5400

This article was the front page of the local paper. Web article has video footage of Michael Lavalette winning the vote at the meeting.

Thanks - they are the same as the ‘ACAD’ (Ambulatory Care and Diagnostic Centre) or ‘walk in walk out centres’ that we are getting in Glasgow. I have no problem with these and I don't suppose Respect has either - the issue is presumably that the centre in Preston will be run by a contractor rather than a NHS unit?

 

[glenquagmire]

keep the railways nationalised would not have been radical in 1983 but renationalise the railways is too radical for LP in 2007.

Nationalisation of rail is official LP policy as of a few conferences ago. Don't tar the whole party with the brush of the leadership; some of us still think it's worth fighting for socialist ideals in a party supported by millions of working class voters nationwide.

 

[Fisher_Gate]

Thanks - they are the same as the ‘ACAD’ (Ambulatory Care and Diagnostic Centre) or ‘walk in walk out centres’ that we are getting in Glasgow. I have no problem with these and I don't suppose Respect has either - the issue is presumably that the centre in Preston will be run by a contractor rather than a NHS unit?

Yes - a private company is taking over NHS functions and the staff will be cut.

http://www.respectcoalition.org/index.php?ite=516

 

[Fisher_Gate]

Nationalisation of rail is official LP policy as of a few conferences ago. Don't tar the whole party with the brush of the leadership; some of us still think it's worth fighting for socialist ideals in a party supported by millions of working class voters nationwide.

Constituency Labour Parties representing the rank and file members voted overwhelmingly to oppose rail re-nationalisation (2004 conference) - it was only carried because of the trade union block vote. And it was refused inclusion in any party documents and the manifesto. I wish you luck but I fear your goal is hopeless.

 

[glenquagmire]

Thank you and I hope you're wrong.

 

[jackdoor]

How many councillors does Respect now have?[/QUOTE]

This guy seems to have a principled reason for jumping ship unlike most of the opportunists wo join respect as a stopover to somewherelse. What always puzzles me is why it took so long for for thenm to reach the conclusion.

 

[BarryB]

Despite the usual negative remarks from some on Respect. It is a fact that the biggest left of centre votes i.e. actual people that have been put their cross on the ballot since post 1945 has gone to Respect.

Of course this could be an indication of the vast vacuum on the left in terms of electoral politics. New Labour is very right wing and has attacked the workers on all fronts.

This will not be the last defection from the Labour ranks.

How do you know that Respect have achieved the biggest left of centre votes since 1945? Do you actually know how many councillors or votes the CP had between 1945 and 1950? I dont.I have tried to find out but failed. But until these details are available there is no way of knowing whether Respect have achieved what you claim.

Of course there will be some other Labour defections to Respect. But one or two such defections a year is not much too write home about.

BarryB

 

[liampreston]

"What is it about Respect you cannot abide that is not reflected in Michael Lavalette? Goodness.. I hope it isn't because he's white?"


Fisher_Gate - what the merry hell are you getting at here? What on earth has Michael Lavalette being white got to do with me liking the guy but not his party?

I am /literally/ shaking my head in bemusement.

 

[Fisher_Gate]

"What is it about Respect you cannot abide that is not reflected in Michael Lavalette? Goodness.. I hope it isn't because he's white?"


Fisher_Gate - what the merry hell are you getting at here? What on earth has Michael Lavalette being white got to do with me liking the guy but not his party?

I am /literally/ shaking my head in bemusement.

The party is the sum of the members - name a single member of Respect you have no time for or object to, and name a single policy (referenced by a policy statement not a myth) you disagree with.

I'll do it for the LibDems - I don't agree with your policy of keeping troops in Iraq and I don't support Trident. There! What are your disagreements?

 

[poster342002]

Despite the usual negative remarks from some on Respect. It is a fact that the biggest left of centre votes i.e. actual people that have been put their cross on the ballot since post 1945 has gone to Respect.

Only if you consider Resepct to be a leftwing party.

 

[militant atheist]

Do you actually know how many councillors or votes the CP had between 1945 and 1950?

BarryB

'Nearly 300 councillors', apparently. Source: http://www.marxists.org/history/international/comintern/sections/britain/history.htm

 

[SuburbanCasual]

The party is the sum of the members - name a single member of Respect you have no time for or object to

George Galloway, John Rees, Lyndsey German,

 

[Streathamite]

No, it might resemble the political programm the Labour left would have liked to have seen adopted, but it is more radical than the 1983 or 1974 manifestos, especially when you consider the political climate. I mean keep the railways nationalised would not have been radical in 1983 but renationalise the railways is too radical for LP in 2007.

hmmm....surely you'rer saying that RESPECT are to the left of 80s Labour cos the country's moved even further to the right?
not sure that holds up

 

[junius]

The party is the sum of the members - name a single member of Respect you have no time for or object to, and name a single policy (referenced by a policy statement not a myth) you disagree with.

I'll do it for the LibDems - I don't agree with your policy of keeping troops in Iraq and I don't support Trident. There! What are your disagreements?[/QU

Supporting the passage of the Religious Hatred Bill. And, of course, the numerous policy evasions and silences.

Is Respect pro-monarchy or anti? I suspect the former.