Urban75 Home About Offline BrixtonBuzz Contact

Jewish Settler Violence in Occupied Palestine

rachamim18 said:
Nino: The "tourism" you allude to is just in the dreaming stages so it is not an industry. Even if it were somehow constructed in spite of Israel pulling out of the area I do not imagine that any Israeli run concession in the general vicinity would ever have the slightest chance at turning a profit or even merely breaking even.


Your comments about "British charity" are amazingly astute. I do think that I'll chance that ticket after all.

Vimto:If you have something to say than say it, otherwise you are just taking up space.It takes alot more than "blahblah" or stupid riddles to antagonize me, keep trying.

Cemerty: You need a hobby [or at least a thesaurus].

Aye but it isn't the only form of industry in the occupied territoires is it?

Face it, the British govenrment was only interested in one thing: an unbroken chain of compliant states from India to Egypt; it did not matter whether certain areas were settled by Jews or not; what mattered was compliancy.

Oh aye, I'm astute all right.
 
rachamim18 said:
Fenian: As I have stated in other threads I use parentheses around many words when I either want to stress them [as in referring to certain "Walls" or "Barriers"] or when their use is contentious. The term you refer to was not even in use by the "Palestinians" themselves [other than a very few intellectuals] until the ealy 60s. If you bother to study the issue at length [didn't you claim to have visited the land?] you would know that many refused any ssuch apellation as it conflicted with Pan Arabism. In addition the land in question was merely named Syria during the 500 [round about] years of the Ottoman Empire. Before condemning someone as a racist you should at least pretend to know about the subject you claim so much interest in.

Your offensive claim that I condone "child murder" [damn! there go those prejudicial parentheses again!] would only be valid if the fact that child murder had in fact been carried out and even then I'd still have to accept that fact. It hasn't and I most certainly do not. No court of law has pronounced any guilty verdict whatsoever so therefore you, as usual, are out of gas [actually you may very well be full of it but I do not care to find out].

The "Israeli/Jewish" [which by the way is a prejudiced statement in itself in that it assumes that an Israeli periodical and/or organization is automatically Jewish because it is Israeli] papers and organizations that you refer to do not offer any facts, merely opinions. I can easily provide 10 that counter every one that you scrounge up but the endeavour is pointless. I do not deal in opinions of media pundits or political action groups. If I did I could merely look towards the ADL or even Likud for data and soundbites. that is a mentally weak person's attempt at discourse.

What a foul and disgustingly racist post. So even when the murder of Palestinian children is reported in Israeli newspapers these are termed "opinions" by rachamam, also the reports by international agencies of named individuals being murdered by Israeli war criminals. How dare you adopt such a revisionist attitude to the murder of children.

.....and of course I did not say "Israeli/Jewish" as to do so would imply that the terms are inter-changeable - which they certainly are not. For instance, 20 -25 per cent of the International Solidarity Movement are Jewish people, and many many Jewish people oppose the war policy of the Israeli state. I said Israeli-Jewish to stress that there are indeed Jewish people in Israel who oppose racism and killing children.

But this is of course a smokescreen for your continued justification of child murder, and its support by the Israeli state - who of course support war crimes against Palestinian civilians as a rule.
 
Fenian said:
Ah the racist revisionist and apologist for child murder returns. I've not a great deal of time to waste on rachamam atm, just to note that in spite of your ramblings you've offered not facts but opinion and evasion, whereas many posters on this thread - including myself - have offered evidence from Israeli-Jewish and international sources to our positions.

It's really a question of morality, among other things. Obviously a racist who refers to "Palestinian" in parentheses (viz. denial of a people and the goal of seeking maximum lebensraum in a land free of its inhabitants?) and adopts a revisionist position faced with evidence of the Israeli military carrying out child murder would take a different position from, say, those who on general principle oppose child murder. rachamam's revisionism persists even when the evidence of Israeli military war crimes is from Israeli-Jewish sources, and the Israeli media. Sickening, really.
Excellent points and rebuttal
 
rachamim18 said:
Fenian: As I have stated in other threads I use parentheses around many words when I either want to stress them [as in referring to certain "Walls" or "Barriers"] or when their use is contentious. The term you refer to was not even in use by the "Palestinians" themselves [other than a very few intellectuals] until the ealy 60s.
Well wonders never cease! Israel didnt exist till ..... mmmm about 20 years before that. Of course there were always people living in Palestine, but that is the racist, revisionist history you subscribe to and GOD FORBID anyone know the truth of the ugly way in which the state of Israel was created.
 
rachamim18 said:
The thought occurs, that you are unabashed liar. Provide proof. Your word is not good enough because I myself am an IDF soldier and can tell you from my own experience over many years that I have never once seen an IDF soldier firing at any unarmed person.
Either he is an unabashed liar or you are Rachamim. You (Rachamim) have already displayed your proclivity for lying in other posts, i.e. the one in which you said there were no palestinians living in walled ghettoes ......... remember that lie? ........ and do you remember lying about how the 7 year old Palestinian girl who died while having supper with her parents, because she was shot by an IDF soldier through the head, and how you suggested it could have been a Palestinian who killed her? Each of your posts has relied on this smoke and mirrors tactic. We provide proof of something terrible that is happening in our name, and you argue that we provide partisan sources - if you dont like the links, then refute them with your own. If you dont like the idea then put forward your own, do something more than just say "thats a bad idea" - that is YOUR obligation - or go to hell where I am sure you have have many friends!
 
vimto said:
Not saying too much are we pal.

Come on you can do better than this soldier!



At long last Mr Rachimin18 ...we get to the crux of the matter......you now admit that your one of those child killing cunts from the I.D.F. (well fuck me, there`s a surprise then......
So defender of the peace loving state of Isreal.......pray tell where you actually born in the land you defend??????...or as i suspect, are you one of those nuts who thinks that just because his granny or someone you happenend to know was jewish it gives you the right to come to someone else`s country and expell them by force from their land..
What a total cunt....
 
cemertyone said:
At long last Mr Rachimin18 ...we get to the crux of the matter......you now admit that your one of those child killing cunts from the I.D.F. (well fuck me, there`s a surprise then......
So defender of the peace loving state of Isreal.......pray tell where you actually born in the land you defend??????...or as i suspect, are you one of those nuts who thinks that just because his granny or someone you happenend to know was jewish it gives you the right to come to someone else`s country and expell them by force from their land..
What a total cunt....

that's been a known fact here since shortly after he started to post.
if you read back (rachamim18's posts, i think you'll even find all those questions are already answered by him).
 
Invisible: Quite right, in fact it merely confirms what I have long susoected: Cemerty only reads what Cemerty wants to read. Sadly I have just found a racist p.m. in my box from Cemerty who accused me of "finally admitting that I am one of those child killing c%^@ts."

Fenian: On the subject of newspapers and opinions: I had meant in terms of columns and op-ed pieces, but even in other cases one could accurately say that ALL periodicals are slanted one way or another.

On the subject of your sojourn as a stooge of the "Solidarity Movement," I really could not care less whether or not you were a pawn. I am interested though in your impressions that "checkpoints are only for collective punishment since all able bodied people are able to traverse backroads, wadis, etc to reach their destination." A person so very interested in the area ,and in truth, is surely aware that these checkpoints have nabbed dozens of armed homocide bombers, conventionally armed militants, and caches of weapons. It would be much easier for Israel to not have checkpoints. Since a good deal of Israel's economy has always relied on "Palestinians" it would be counter productive to impede their passage. In truth, the economy took a clear nose dive during the "First Intifadeh" and is still suffering during the current one. It also does not make sense for Israel politically at home or abroad to tar its own image.

From the offered thread you took offense at the destruction of shops and buisinesses. You stated that the IDF claimed that these were being demolished for lack of permits. I have news for you, the IDF could not care less about permits, it is not equipped or mandated with the enforcement of civil codes. That is a P.A. responsibility. IDF concerns itself with security issues in the "Territories."

Raisin:"Israel did not exist until 20 years before that." EXACTLY. Before Israel there was no movement for the establishment of a "Palestinian State." Of course there were always people living in "Palestine." The truth of the matter is that there was a Jewish majority there until about 50 years after the advent of Islam. Still from then, until the 20th Century, there have been parts of the land that never lost their Jewish majority [Tiberias,Safed, Jerusalem, etc.] The early Zionists were pragmatic and envisioned 2 states,1 Arab and 1 Jewish. I am sure there is no need to repeat the subsequent refusals of the Arabs to accept this. The nonsense put forth about supposed Zionist propaganda ["A land with no people for a people with no land"] is tired rhetoric. The cold, hard truth is that the Arabs are responsible for their own predicament. That said, I am an optimist and believe that Abbas is a rational being and will lead his people better than his predecessor. The pull out from Gaza is set for immediately after the "Palestinian" elections for the short term, and in the long term a conference in 05 is already on the table.

"I have been shown to lie." Really? I do not recall you [or anyone else] providing any proof. An aerial photo showing parts of a removable chain link fence [which admittedly skirts the Green Line] is not at all like a "walled ghetto." You should research the word "ghetto." Then you bring up the unfortunate case of the 7 year old girl killed at the dinner table? Sorry, noone saw the shooter, the bullet came through the house while the family was eating. There were no eyewitnesses to her death [other than her family]. Yet, your supposed source is a grief stricken father who raises his fist at the Israelis. You talk about "proof," The burden of proof lies with the accuser. The man honestly believes what he said? Provide anything of value. You obviously believe his story, provide corroborating evidence.

"Put forth my own idea." I do offer ideas, you just abhor them.
 
rachamim18 said:
Invisible: Quite right, in fact it merely confirms what I have long susoected: Cemerty only reads what Cemerty wants to read. Sadly I have just found a racist p.m. box from Cemerty who accused mo of "finally admitting that I am one of those child killing c%^@ts."

Fenian: On the subject of newspapers and opinions: I had meant in terms of columns and op-ed pieces but even in other cases one could accurately say that ALL periodicals are slanted one way or another.

On the subject of your sojourn as a stooge of the "Solidarity Movement," I really could not care less whether or not you were a pawn. I am interested though in your impressions that "checkpoints are only for collective punishment since all able bodied people are able to traverse backroads, wadis, etc to reach their destination." A person so very interested in the area ,and in truth, is surely aware that these checkpoints have nabbed dozens of armed homocide bombers, conventionally armed militants, and caches of weapons. It would be much easier for Israel to not have checkpoints. Since a good deal of Israel's economy has always relied on "Palestinians" it would be counter productive to impede their passage. In truth, the economy took a clear nose dive during the "First Intifadeh" and is still suffering during the current one. It also does not make sense for Israel politically at home or abroad to tar its own omage.

From the offered thread you took offense at the destruction of shops and buisinesses. You stated that the IDF claimed that these were being demolished for lack of permits. I have news for you, the IDF could not care less about permits, it is not equipped or mandated with the enforcement of civil codes. That is a P.A. responsibility. IDF concerns itself with security issues in the "Territories."

Raisin:"Israel did not exist until 20 years before that." EXACTLY. Before Israel there was no movement for the establishment of a "Palestinian State." Of course there were always people living in "Palestine." The truth of the matter is that there was a Jewish majority there until about 50 years after the advent of Islam. Still from then, until the 20th Century, there have been parts of the land that never lost their Jewish majority [Tiberias,Safed, Jerusalem, etc.] The early Zionists were pragmatic and envisioned 2 states,1 Arab and 1 Jewish. I am sure there is no need to repeat the subsequent refusals of the Arabs to accept this. The nonsense put forth about supposed Zionist propaganda ["A land with no people for a people with no land"] is tired rhetoric. The cold, hard truth is that the Arabs are responsible for their own predicament. That said, I am an optimist and believe that Abbas is a rational being and will lead his people better than his predecessor. The pull out from Gaza is set for immediately after the "Palestinian" elections for the short term, and in the long term a conference in 05 is already on the table.

"I have been shown to lie." Really? I do not recall you [or anyone else] providing any proof. An aerial photo showing parts of a removable chain link fence [which admittedly skirts the Green Line] is not at all like a "walled ghetto." You should research the word "ghetto." Then you bring up the unfortunate case of the 7 year old girl killed at the dinner table? Sorry, noone saw the shooter, the bullet came through the house while the family was eating. There were no eyewitnesses to her death [other than her family]. Yet, your supposed source is a grief stricken father who raises his fist at the Israelis. You talk about "proof," The burden of proof lies with the accuser. The man honestly believes what he said? Provide anything of value. You obviously believe his story, provide corroborating evidence.

"Put forth my own idea." I do offer ideas, you just abhor them.

Liar. Liar. And liar again.

The Isaeli army - many of them deliberate killers of children along with similar disreputable forces in history e.g. Waffen SS, the Hutu genocidists - are not responsible for the destruction of homes and factories because they don't have permits you say?

I posted on this very site photos of the Iraeli army destroying markets and homes and shops in Ba'arta. I have submitted these photos to editor to post again, as the web-sites I posted on have updated their links.

No doubt if and when editor re-post these photos you as a racist dissembler will attempt to produce more evasions.

I really cannot stress enough my contempt for racists who attempt revisionism over documented attacks on civilians.
 
I also note that you say in newspapers all articles are slanted one way or another. The point is, as numerous posters on this site have demonstrated by evidence in addition to Israeli newspapers, the Israeli military are child-murderers.

Maybe one day you'll realise that if you accept this people may begin to take you seriously........but I doubt it.
 
"Liar, Liar"...I have it on DVD.

Fenian: Aside form your ad hom orgasm I suspect that you take offense at my honest staement that the IDF does not perform civil code enforcement. I mean, why wouldn't a foreigner who ssupposedly spent a few weeks linking arms and singing songs know more than a person who actually spent a little over a year patrolling the very same area? If you say so, Fenian...It still does not make it so.

1] You do not know Hebrew and I suspect you do not know Arabic

2] Even if you somehow understood what was going on [as opposed to your "translator's" version] you would still not be privy to military matters.

"People may begin to take me seriously." Fenian, just because you cannot stand dissention [isn't THAT a case of the pot calling the kettle black?] does not mean others cannot stomach an opposing viewpoint. Isn't it always like the professional protesters to scream bloody murder when someone doesn't see eye to eye with them?
 
rachamim18 said:
Fenian: Aside form your ad hom orgasm I suspect that you take I mean, why wouldn't a foreigner who ssupposedly spent a few weeks linking arms and singing songs know more than a person who actually spent a little over a year patrolling the very same area?


Fuck me... this is the same shit that the British Army used to come out with to lazy Fleet Street hacks and their agents in the media when they used to patrol West Belfast.....Of course when they where wrecking peoples homes and interning them to support the democratic government (like is-reail does...) they where doing it to " maintain order and security"......
I ask you again Rachamim18......you call Fenian a "Foreigner" and what perchance are you......Where you or where you not Born In isreal?????and if not are you also not a "foreigner" too???? ....
Fenian is no more an outsider than you.....do you really think that because some trashy religious book says "the land is ours" that it gives you and your naueous kind the right to inflict genocide upon the Pal people all in the name of your God.....
What makes you different from the fundamentalists you say you oppose?????
Your governments methods make the nazi`s look like amateurs......spot any similarities between the Thrid Reich and your mates in the Isreal goverment..
1. The process of collective punishment of an entire people...
2. State sanctioned assisination and murder.
3. confiscation (theft) of individual property and land in the name of the state.
4. the de-humanisation of the oppossition to ensure illegal and un-human laws are passed by which the Majority of the populace agree.
5. the return of the " Pass" laws which see`s the Pal people having to carry their red identy cards to ensure thay are always aware of their separate idenity...kinda like the yellow star of david in the polish ghetto.....
6. the herding of an entire people into modern day "open prisons"/concentration camps by any other name surrounded by yankee filth carrying uzi`s.
So while the Pal people are not perhaps subjected to the same level of over all death as that which your people wheresubjected to during the Soarh.....the effects remain the same...
Your government has been an excellent example of how a modern state (thats a joke by the way) has been able to update and modify the methods and modialities of the Nazi regime......and there`s not a rizla paper between the Nazis and your lot..........
 
When is a “quiet period” not a quiet period?

As far as the Israeli Occupation Forces and state are concerned – along with most of the international media – a “quiet period” under the occupation is one where only Palestinians are killed. Since Yasser Arafat’s death 40 have been killed, eleven of them in the last six days.

http://www.palestine-pmc.com/details.asp?cat=1&id=746

“Atta Sheikh el-Aid, 20, died overnight Saturday of serious wounds sustained from IOF gunfire on the Gaza Strip refugee camp of Khan Younis on Thursday.

On Friday, IOF troops shot dead a 7-year-old Palestinian girl inside her home in the same camp.

Rania Omar Siyam was having lunch among family members when IOF troops stationed at the nearby illegal settlement of Neve Dekalim opened sporadic gunfire, killing her and wounding her father as well as two other civilians in the vicinity of their home.”

Rania’s father Omar Siam said: “I felt a pain in my leg, but I was only lightly injured, thank God... Our meal was splashed in blood. We then realized that Rania had been killed by a bullet to the head.”

Also helpful is a Guardian article from 2003: http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1007051,00.html – and revealing. For instance the articles documents the previously-quoted exposé by B’Tselem of a child murder by the Israeli Occupation Forces and details of the way it was to be covered up.

The Israeli Occupation Forces military commander who told the media in Israel the military’s version of the death of Rachel Corrie, ISM peace activist, gave the interview to the Guardian. Among the many instances the Commander comments on of children being murdered by the IOF is Huda Darwish, a 12-year old shot in the head as she studied at her desk in her school classroom. Urbanites will be familiar from rachamam’s dissembling with the following tactic attempted in such instances: “At his headquarters in the Gush Khatif settlement in Gaza, the commander rattles through the army's version of the shootings: either the military knew nothing of them, or the children had been caught in crossfire - a justification used so frequently, and so often disproved, that it is rarely believed. But three hours later, after poring over maps and military logs, timings and regulations, he concedes that his soldiers were responsible - even culpable - in several of the killings.

"The Israeli army's instinctive response is to muddy the waters when confronted with a controversial killing” (my italics)."At first, it questioned whether Huda was even shot. I described for the soldiers the scene in the classroom with blood rippling up the wall behind the child's desk.

'I don't know how this happened,' says the commander. 'I take responsibility for this. It could have been one of ours. I think it probably was.' (My italics again.)

Many Urbanites will be impressed as I was at the fantastic courage shown by Huda’s teacher, Said Sinwar. Said Sinwar's name should be immortalised in the annals of decency. Despite the injuries to herself from the raking of her classroom by Israeli gunfire she dragged poor Huda from her desk, shepherding away Huda’s terrified classmates. Several weeks after the shooting Said’s arms and legs were on the mend, but from the injuries inflicted she is now permanently blind.

Could there be a more shining example of integrity, dignity and courage?

To contrast with the cowardice, revisionist dissembling, thuggery and racism of rachamam and the heroes of Israel’s Occupation Forces.
 
rachamim18 said:
"I have been shown to lie." Really? I do not recall you [or anyone else] providing any proof. An aerial photo showing parts of a removable chain link fence [which admittedly skirts the Green Line] is not at all like a "walled ghetto."

"Put forth my own idea." I do offer ideas, you just abhor them.
You call this a chain link fence?
The Wall is concrete and 10 metres high!
We're playing semantics again!


wire4.jpg


Here is a further image of the Wall surrounding Qalqilya.

2-IllusionWall2truck.jpg


Now for some visual semantics. It is not obvious that the bridge in the background is the Wall as it has been painted to give the illusion of pastoral scenery viewed through illusory arches - this is how it is viewed on the Israeli side.
 
Chris and Kim are volunteers with an organization called Christian Peacemaker Teams (CPT), which provides nonviolent intercession in areas of violence. They serve in the West Bank city of Hebron, where Palestinian civilians are frequently attacked and harassed by Israeli settlers. The presence of such international witnesses often reduces this violence.

Children in a small village outside of Hebron, Tuba, attend school in the neighboring village of Tuwani. The problem is, Israeli settlements lie between Tuwani and Tuba. The route around these settlements is over six miles—too long for small children to trek twice a day. There is an alternative route between settlements that reduces the journey to a little over a mile. Villagers asked CPT to accompany the children on this shorter route.

Last Wednesday, Chris and Kim picked up the children from their village at 6:30, and all began walking to school. Part of the way there, settlements on either side, Kim and two of the children had gotten a little ahead and were just turning a bend in the road, when Chris saw them suddenly stop and begin running back, screaming.

Then he saw why.

“I saw men with black masks on, dressed all in black, wielding chains, one carrying a bat, most of them wearing black.” As the five men rushed at them, Chris called out, “Please don’t hurt the children, please don’t hurt the children.”

The men smashed a rock to his head, knocking him to the ground, and began beating and kicking him with steel-toed boots. The attackers tried, unsuccessfully, to break his left wrist and dislocate his shoulder.

“I said, ‘Why are you doing this? All we’re doing is walking children to school—we’re nonviolent,’” Chris told them. “We’re Americans.”

Israeli settlers smashed Chris Brown’s head with a rock, knocked him to the ground and kicked him, puncturing his lung and breaking his ribs (Courtesy San Francisco Bay View).


An attacker laughed, and Chris heard a man say, in a heavy Israeli accent, “They’re Americans.”

Kim, meanwhile, lay face down, not moving as the men kicked and beat her. She says much of the attack is a blur—“It’s almost like for a moment you leave reality.…I just remember thinking, ‘If I just lie here like I’m unconscious, maybe they’ll leave me alone.’”

Finally, the men sauntered away, stealing Kim’s waist-pack containing her money, passport and cell phone. Unable to walk, she crawled over to Chris, who still had his phone and was able to call for help.
 
The walk to school for five Palestinian children has become so dangerous they require an escort from Israeli soldiers and police.

Jewish settlers living along the path have repeatedly ambushed the young students, setting dogs on them, throwing stones and beating one 7-year-old girl with a stick until she bled, according to the children, their parents, their principal and human rights workers.

"It's rare that a day passes and there isn't an attempt to pick on the kids, or even worse, hurt them," said Omar Jundiyye, father of three of the children and the uncle of the other two.

The attacks began after the outbreak of Israeli-Palestinian fighting in 2000, when tensions between settlers and Palestinians in the West Bank rose considerably. Dozens of settlers have been killed in Palestinian shooting ambushes, while settlers on occasion clash with Palestinians and rampage through villages.
 
X-mas indigestion...must have been that lack of eggnog...

Cemery:Was I born in Israel?" Nope, Manhattan, NYC. My ancestors though came from there. In addition My family has lived in Israel and Syria since Biblical days so what is your point? Because my family moved from Aleppo to Brooklyn I am now a foreigner? What a genius. Even if I were a blonde French Jew whose family has lived in Paris for three hundred years, I would still be a Jew. When there was no Arabia, no Arab people, certainly no Europeans, there were still Jews. You do not get it...I by chance have family who never left the land but that does not make me any different from my brothers who lived in Europe, or Morrocco, or India. Our blood is the same and our dream since exile has been to restore our land. It has finally happened and it is not bound to go back to those days of statelessness, despite "concerned foreigners" such as yourself,

As I have said in other threads more than once: I am not religious and DO NOT rely on religion for ANYTHING. Certainly not for my rationale in believing in Israel's right to exist. That comes from history defended by science.


"State sanctioned murder and assasination." Which would be totally unneeded had the P.A. answered its mandate and at least made an attempt at taking into custody the murderous individuals who bombed infants and elderly into oblivion...inside the Green Line. If there is no alternative, if noone will do the dirty and tasteless job, the world is fortuante that Israel has the will. You complain of many things but strangely I've never seen you once complain about the use of random violence against non combatants, by "Palestinians," inside of the Green Line. Yet, you have the audacity to mount your soapbox and condemn Israel for attacking those that have committed such atrocities. That is the epitome of hypocrisy. I could stomach you if you made the case that all violence was wrong but your "shtick" is that only the strong are wrong. That is childish and unrealistic.

"The Red Pass Law." EVERYONE in Israel must carry an i.d. That is a universal law. Palestinians carry a separate colored card if they are not Israelis, as any foreigner should. It is not anything like the Nazis' "Yellow Stars" in that those Jews were residents of those nations and were singled out from other residents. They were not foreigners as the "Palestinians" from the "Territories" were.

Fenian: Yes Fenian, we already know what a "Palestinian" source will say about Israelis, but thanks anyway. Oh, and you did not think that the Guardian was somehow objective did you? I have been reading the Guardian [in print] for the last 6 years and to date have not found a SINGLE article that presented Israel in a favorable light. Here, I have an idea. This argument is going no where. You and yours provide these articles that trash Israel and then play the child's game of,"But they are are sources..." Why don't I just waste people's time and provide a sympathetic piece from a pro Israeli periodical for everyone of your negative ones? Instead of substance you offer al Jazeera or Guardian pieces, it takes 15 seconds to whisk one up out of cyber space. I forgot, you "spent a few weeks there" with a translator...Ooohhh...Truth at work. We have already "discussed" your article about the 7 year old girl so I will not take that bait...As to the 12 year old, provide a corroborating international source and I would be happy to look into it and unravel another of your "spools of truth."

Two photos of concrete portions and not a thing about the 69% of the "Barrier" that consists of removable chain link? Honesty in Action! They teach you that in Solidarity Apolegetic classes?

Raisin: 2 foreigners get robbed in a dangerous area and of course it is the evil Israelis...Oh, I love the part about the "Israeli accent." So these terrible Israeli muggers conversed in English? In front of Americans? Most Israelis speak Arabic to some extent, just as most "Palestinians" speak Hebrew to some extent, why would they not have attempted to throw off suscpicion by adopting another language? The story is ridiculous.
 
Question for rachamim18

If your family also lived in Syria - as did many Jews - why wasn't Syria claimed by the Zionists as well? Jews lived there for thousands of years too.

Are you familiar with the Baghdadi Jews and what they went through; how they were bombed out of their homes by agents acting on behalf of Israel? Did you also know that Iraq has one of the oldest Jewish populations in the Middle East? It seems to me that the most Zionists couldn't give two shits about these people.

So why was there no Zionist claim on Mesopotamia? It seems to me that if Jews had an 'ancient claim' on Palestine then does it not follow that Mesopotamia too, should be part of metropolitan Israel?
 
Yellow card

Originally Posted by rachamim18
"The Red Pass Law." EVERYONE in Israel must carry an i.d. That is a universal law. Palestinians carry a separate colored card if they are not Israelis, as any foreigner should. It is not anything like the Nazis' "Yellow Stars" in that those Jews were residents of those nations and were singled out from other residents. They were not foreigners as the "Palestinians" from the "Territories" were.

Is it not a mark of their inferior status? It is and you are being dishonest.

Another apology with your chicanery sir?
 
Rachamim, how would you compare the situation with Israel to that of apartheid South Africa? Not because of the apartheid wall "Barrier" (perhaps you don't understand the policies of the Bantustans well enough to know how apt the name is) but because I'm a white South African and your rationale in your last post here sounds very, very familliar. My betters didn't claim an ancestral right to the land, but the right to claim empty land (for the south-west of SA) and the rest as won by feat of arms. Other than that it's pretty identical, including the treatment by settlers of those in their way.
 
Photograph: cheery IOF pose beside dead Palestinians

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArtVty.jhtml?sw=Palestinian+children+killed&itemNo=518399

“When we see a camera, everyone runs to stand behind the bodies, to be in the frame. A souvenir of one of the most dramatic nights of our lives. I, who was totally revolted by it, even then, didn't have my picture taken, but nevertheless a film made its way to me as the souvenir of a turbulent night. I am standing 20 centimeters from the frame. I am there. I didn't say a word, I didn't think about morality, it's bodies and not life, and your commander is having his picture taken with them and you never make a critical comment to a commander. All my commanding officers are there. It was in the center of the base and I am certain they all saw it. Dozens, maybe hundreds of soldiers around and they all saw the process of the picture-taking. I remember it bothered me a little, that thing, but there was tremendous commotion all around. I was part of it.

"Then we went to the unit and we occupied ourselves with the topic of how we would develop the photos. Really. It's not pleasant. I absolutely remember that. There is a procedure where the pictures are developed at headquarters, but we couldn't give them things like that. It wouldn't have gone through. It would have got stuck somewhere and created a snafu. They were private photos. Anyone who would see the pictures would be shocked. So we had a mechanism of not sending certain pictures to HQ to be developed.”

Again rachamam has shown his deep and virulent racist hatred by dissembling over the murder of Palestinian children. When I post evidence from the international and Israeli press these are, in classic revisionist mode, referred to as if they are opinion pieces rather than fact – despite coming from Israeli sources as well, and quoting Israeli soldiers.

Rachamam cannot hide his racism by again asking what can be believed by “Palestinian” sources.

Note that this is for an international readership as people are finding out about the murderous practices of the Israeli Occupation Forces and this is causing consternation for the racists.
 
In 1973, Winston Churchill III* asked "How Israel will deal with the Palestinians?"

Ariel Sharon answered: “We’ll make a pastrami sandwich of them, we’ll insert a strip of Jewish settlements in between the Palestinians, and then another strip of Jewish settlements right across the West Bank, so that in 25 years’ time, neither the United Nations nor the United States, nobody, will be able to tear it apart.”

*(grandson of the former British prime minister)

Foundation for Middle East Peace (FMEP) said:
Israeli Settler Population
1993 ---------------2004
111,600 -----------224,224 (West Bank)​
168,000 -----------185,000 (East Jerusalem)​
4,800 ------------- 7,576 (2002)3 (Gaza)​
15, 313 (1999)----20,000 (Golan Heights)​

(Total Settler Population 2004) 436,8006

source: http://www.fmep.org/
 
No doubt the racist dissembler is preparing more evasions - after all all his posts are untroubled by any evidence, whereas he is confronted by evidence from international and local sources.

Or he may be out murdering children. So he's from New York? Typical, many real Israelis would hold him and his ilk in the deepest contempt.
 
Fenian said:
No doubt the racist dissembler is preparing more evasions - after all all his posts are untroubled by any evidence, whereas he is confronted by evidence from international and local sources.

Or he may be out murdering children. So he's from New York? Typical, many real Israelis would hold him and his ilk in the deepest contempt.

You can bank on it.

Bet he's really a street sweeper in Brooklyn.
 
rachamim18 said:
Cemery:Was I born in Israel?" Nope, Manhattan, NYC. My ancestors though came from there. In addition My family has lived in Israel and Syria since Biblical days so what is your point? Because my family moved from Aleppo to Brooklyn I am now a foreigner? What a genius. Even if I were a blonde French Jew whose family has lived in Paris for three hundred years, I would still be a Jew. When there was no Arabia, no Arab people, certainly no Europeans, there were still Jews. You do not get it...I by chance have family who never left the land but that does not make me any different from my brothers who lived in Europe, or Morrocco, or India. Our blood is the same and our dream since exile has been to restore our land. It has finally happened and it is not bound to go back to those days of statelessness, despite "concerned foreigners" such as yourself,

As I have said in other threads more than once: I am not religious and DO NOT rely on religion for ANYTHING. Certainly not for my rationale in believing in Israel's right to exist. That comes from history defended by science.


"State sanctioned murder and assasination." Which would be totally unneeded had the P.A. answered its mandate and at least made an attempt at taking into custody the murderous individuals who bombed infants and elderly into oblivion...inside the Green Line. If there is no alternative, if noone will do the dirty and tasteless job, the world is fortuante that Israel has the will. You complain of many things but strangely I've never seen you once complain about the use of random violence against non combatants, by "Palestinians," inside of the Green Line. Yet, you have the audacity to mount your soapbox and condemn Israel for attacking those that have committed such atrocities. That is the epitome of hypocrisy. I could stomach you if you made the case that all violence was wrong but your "shtick" is that only the strong are wrong. That is childish and unrealistic.

"The Red Pass Law." EVERYONE in Israel must carry an i.d. That is a universal law. Palestinians carry a separate colored card if they are not Israelis, as any foreigner should. It is not anything like the Nazis' "Yellow Stars" in that those Jews were residents of those nations and were singled out from other residents. They were not foreigners as the "Palestinians" from the "Territories" were.

Fenian: Yes Fenian, we already know what a "Palestinian" source will say about Israelis, but thanks anyway. Oh, and you did not think that the Guardian was somehow objective did you? I have been reading the Guardian [in print] for the last 6 years and to date have not found a SINGLE article that presented Israel in a favorable light. Here, I have an idea. This argument is going no where. You and yours provide these articles that trash Israel and then play the child's game of,"But they are are sources..." Why don't I just waste people's time and provide a sympathetic piece from a pro Israeli periodical for everyone of your negative ones? Instead of substance you offer al Jazeera or Guardian pieces, it takes 15 seconds to whisk one up out of cyber space. I forgot, you "spent a few weeks there" with a translator...Ooohhh...Truth at work. We have already "discussed" your article about the 7 year old girl so I will not take that bait...As to the 12 year old, provide a corroborating international source and I would be happy to look into it and unravel another of your "spools of truth."

Two photos of concrete portions and not a thing about the 69% of the "Barrier" that consists of removable chain link? Honesty in Action! They teach you that in Solidarity Apolegetic classes?

Raisin: 2 foreigners get robbed in a dangerous area and of course it is the evil Israelis...Oh, I love the part about the "Israeli accent." So these terrible Israeli muggers conversed in English? In front of Americans? Most Israelis speak Arabic to some extent, just as most "Palestinians" speak Hebrew to some extent, why would they not have attempted to throw off suscpicion by adopting another language? The story is ridiculous.

What a JOKE of a response. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: ...as i suspected your whole " I was born in Manhatten" but the land of isreal Is OURS ( and by implicatation OURS ALONE) routine fools no one...
What you and your kind are is UPSURPERS...yankeee trash with uzi`s forcing the native people of their land by force of arms and based on an ideology and book (your torah) which has been found to be historically and factually wanting......In the modern world its called "ethnic cleansing" dude. but of course nice jews ( such as you) would prefare to codify it with pleasent sounding words like "TRANSFER"...but the results and effect amount to the same thing.
In relatation to asking you about the "Pass laws" that are operated for the Pal people...you say that the Pal people (even those in the occupied terrorities) are foreginers......are you serious my friend...you have got to be living in a jewish-fox news bubble if you believe that... mind you seeing as most Americans have no idea as to what`s occuring outside their own geographical boundaries your ignorance comes as no surprise.....what`s even more amusing is that less than one in fifthteen of your own citizens actual possess a passport or have travelled abroad....what an insular lot you truely are.
For the record rachamin 18......my take on the violence is this..people such as you ( outside yankee ideologies) who base their beliefs that all the Middle-East is thier`s (and there`s alone) and who enter and take over Pal terrority by the force of the gun (outside the given boundaries of the 1967 Isreali state) are LEGITIMATE targets for violence....
I do not condone any violence against the isreali population inside the Isreali state but the settler FITLTH that come straight from Manhatten ( Like you did) deserve every fucking thing that comes there way...
And when i hear of settlers getting stiffed it gives me the same pleasure that i used to have when i listened to reports of british Soldiers getting killed in belfast as we (also) resisted their military occupatition of our land.......

Oh yeah Merry Christmas to you ....
 
Back
Top Bottom