Italians treatment of Roma people

[Bang to Rights]

Well, it's certainly a documented fact that there has never been a Gypsie in history who's worked a day in his/her life other than the effort required in the age-old profession of pickpocketing. If in doubt you can find it at: www.bangtorightslittleknownfabricatedfacts.com Hey! The internet doesn't lie.

You can also take a look at. www.savatteslistofconrivedquotes.com Here you can find such quotes as "fascism as a love of one's country" and "Gypsies are all thieving scum". It makes for a good laugh really. Highly recommended.

 

[likesfish]

me condemning an Italian head of state is going to achieve the sum of fuck all unfortunately let alone persuade him to spend cash solving the problem
people should not be living in shanty towns in Europe.

 

[likesfish]

although bang to rights has a point about travellers.
brighton and hove is suffering its annual visit from traditional traveling folk £30000 worth of damage already
http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/3611433.Patcham_travellers__site_is_shut/

 

[Bang to Rights]

... people should not be living in shanty towns in Europe.

Yes indeed. Not in ANY EU country. That point (among others) ought to be part of membership agreement. I'm actually surprised that it isn't.

 

[likesfish]

I guess you could stretch that rule to include cardboard city and protest camps and the hippy's in the hills etc
But as a basic rule of civilization there should not be shanty towns or ghettos in the EU any goverment that does have them ought to explain to the european goverment.
how they came about.
What they are doing to rehome the inhabitants deal with the situation. I'd include sangratte etc as well.
The problem with the Roma should be dealt with in a grown up manner that does not involve force

 

[october_lost]

although bang to rights has a point about travellers.
brighton and hove is suffering its annual visit from traditional traveling folk £30000 worth of damage already
http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/3611433.Patcham_travellers__site_is_shut/

Where you get this info from is revealing? You take it from a single source that essentially reaffirms your bigotry, as if there are no other variables in play.

 

[likesfish]

sorry I can see where the large amount of fly tipped junk appeared in the bottom of the field when I walk my dog. That just happens to have a load of travellers in it that have a couple of flatbed lorries with them Somebody could have used the travellers as cover to fly tip but they'd have had to drive through the camp to dump the waste
Now once might be a coincidence but for the last three summers Brighton has paid host to illegal travellers camps and coincidentally had to deal with fly tipping afterwards
twice having two community festival type things canceled because travellers had occupied parks and playing fields.
So no I don't have a lot of time for people turn up for the summer cause bother feck off and leave industrial waste behind

 

[october_lost]

1. Fly tipping happens in areas where there are no gypsy/travellers
2. Should be the duty of said council to sort an arrangement out

 

[Bang to Rights]

I guess you could stretch that rule to include cardboard city and protest camps and the hippy's in the hills etc

I took that for granted, except for the "hippies in the hills" - I didn't think there were any more of those.

But as a basic rule of civilization there should not be shanty towns or ghettos in the EU any goverment that does have them ought to explain to the european goverment.
how they came about.

Have you been to Lisbon? I accidently stumbbled into one of the most grotesque ghettos I've ever seen "in the West". I thought I was in the slumiest of the slumiest of Bangkok. Couldn't believe it!

The problem with the Roma should be dealt with in a grown up manner that does not involve force

We've got a particulary unsavoury situation, one that you may be familiar with. "Discrimination!!!" We can't even politely ask for our wallet back from the Roma thief (clearly witnessed with his hand in your pocket) without him screaming superlatives. Oh, and it'll be in the evening rag you can bet, how a Roma was treated to some dreadful discrimination. Can you imagine what would happen if the police were to get involved? The slightest word of warning would be construed as "police brutality".

It would actually be a relief if I were merely exaggerating with racist intent but such things happen and I've had a personal experience or two.

sorry I can see where the large amount of fly tipped junk appeared in the bottom of the field when I walk my dog.

Yes. I think they carry everything from the tip to a secluded spot (home) to have a good rummage and see if there's anything worth keeping. What's considered unworthy is chucked out the window onto the road below or if the cops happen to be passing by they just toss it down the stairway.

 

[nino_savatte]

Well, it's certainly a documented fact that there has never been a Gypsie in history who's worked a day in his/her life other than the effort required in the age-old profession of pickpocketing. If in doubt you can find it at: www.bangtorightslittleknownfabricatedfacts.com Hey! The internet doesn't lie.

You can also take a look at. www.savatteslistofconrivedquotes.com Here you can find such quotes as "fascism as a love of one's country" and "Gypsies are all thieving scum". It makes for a good laugh really. Highly recommended.

More antiziganism as well as trolling? You're excelling yourself today.

 

[nino_savatte]

although bang to rights has a point about travellers.
brighton and hove is suffering its annual visit from traditional traveling folk £30000 worth of damage already
http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/3611433.Patcham_travellers__site_is_shut/

Travellers or Roma? Or do you know/understand the difference? Given your other posts, I doubt it.

 

[likesfish]

too be honest wouldn't care if they were Martians they are taking the piss. I'm talking about there actions

 

[nino_savatte]

Oh, I'm sure.

I'm familiar with that event and I'm also familiar with the usual knee-jerk antiziganist rants from the local press and public.

 

[nino_savatte]

Some more reading on antiziganism
http://www.coe.int/t/dg3/romatravellers/Documentation/discrimination/knudsen_en.asp

 

[nino_savatte]

If this was happening to any other group there would be a real outcry but antiziganists (like those on this thread) are given a free pass to voice their bigotry.

Of the 150.000 Roma and Ashkali once living in Kosovo before the persecution by the Serb regime (1990 to 1999) and by the Albanian extremists (from 1999 until today) 34.431 men, women and children came to Germany as refugees and displaced persons: 24.351 Roma, 8.197 Ashkali and 1.138 Egyptians. The last are a group of the Roma and Ashkali from Kosovo, who believe that their ancestors were in ancient times driven out of Egypt.

http://www.gfbv.de/inhaltsDok.php?id=612

 

[Bang to Rights]

Where you get this info from is revealing?

Yes, "revealing" is the right word. The fact that he can read - as oppose to his antagonists.

too be honest wouldn't care if they were Martians they are taking the piss. I'm talking about there actions

Ah! A man of few words but straight into the eye of the bull.

 

[likesfish]

any group that rocks camps on public ground without permission and then fucks off leaving a mess and industrial waste behind behaviors unacceptable regardless if there an ethnic group or not
Whining there are no open meadows where they could legally park there caravans is bullshit its the 21st century times change. Theres nothing traditional about a white van or 4x4

 

[Bang to Rights]

..... and that includes White Anglo-Saxon Protestants as well!

 

[october_lost]

Yes, "revealing" is the right word. The fact that he can read - as oppose to his antagonists.

No. He probably gets it from another bigoted source...Daily Mail anyone

 

[Bang to Rights]

...Daily Mail anyone

 

[Nardini]

This is a disgrace.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/the-picture-that-shames-italy-873743.html

Have you anything to add, Bang?

The photographer that took the photograph published throughout the world, Alessandro Garofalo, who works for il mattino in napoli, was disgusted that the only photograph that was used was the one showing a couple in the distance, looking sad and uncomfoirtable. He took many other photographs that show that the press - including the Guardian and Independent - were not at all truthful in their presentation of this "story".

Have a look at a few other photographs taken at the same time...

See the couple you know already in the distance? How about the other side, where they are sunbathing and throwing frisbees...:

Ahh - lots of people sunbathing..? or are they standing up, looking concerned... How about looking out to sea:

All these images are taken from a LA7 news article.

Take a look at another video?
http://www.videocomunicazioni.com/2008/07/19/torregaveta-muoiono-annegate-due-sorelline-slave/

The power of the press - and the irresponsible use of images to both sell newspapers and create a story out of nothing to peddle a rather sad, xenophobic view of their political stance.

So much for the press in the UK at the moment. Everything is turning into a "red-top" moment - a slightly more intellectual version of Page 3...

Now, apart from showing us how many names you know to describe Gypsies, what point are you trying to make - other than all Italians are b'stards and are fully paid-up members of the KKK...

Pshawww!

 

[nino_savatte]

Do you always repeat the same post across threads? It's hardly original and besides, anyone would think that you had an agenda.

So has Berlusconi ordered the fingerprinting of the Roma or not?

 

[Nardini]

Do you always repeat the same post across threads? It's hardly original and besides, anyone would think that you had an agenda.

So has Berlusconi ordered the fingerprinting of the Roma or not?

No, he hasn't.

My agenda, as you like to call it, is to defend a nation of highly intelligent people from your extraordinarily ignorant attacks. You seem, on the one hand, to want to defend a racial group from attacks - whilst ignoring completely the fact that the situation you are trying to create a racial argument about is one devoid of racial grouping.

I have said before, to your chagrin, that i have, personally, been to a few of the camps here in Italy that some of your newspapers are claiming as full of Rrom people (or Rom, or Gypsies, or whatever) - when the reality is that the camps are full of incredibly poor people from a variety of racial groups and countries. The only thing linking them together (apart from you and certain of your press) is their poverty and the abuse they suffer at the hands of criminal elements. They are illegal immigrants, that is all. The sooner that ways can be found to make them "legal" the better for them - they then can claim benfits, claim healthcare, get jobs, houses, etc. To keep banging the drum that they are all Rrom and that all Italians are racists is ignorant in the extreme.

 

[nino_savatte]

No, he hasn't.

My agenda, as you like to call it, is to defend a nation of highly intelligent people from your extraordinarily ignorant attacks. You seem, on the one hand, to want to defend a racial group from attacks - whilst ignoring completely the fact that the situation you are trying to create a racial argument about is one devoid of racial grouping.

I have said before, to your chagrin, that i have, personally, been to a few of the camps here in Italy that some of your newspapers are claiming as full of Rrom people (or Rom, or Gypsies, or whatever) - when the reality is that the camps are full of incredibly poor people from a variety of racial groups and countries. The only thing linking them together (apart from you and certain of your press) is their poverty and the abuse they suffer at the hands of criminal elements. They are illegal immigrants, that is all. The sooner that ways can be found to make them "legal" the better for them - they then can claim benfits, claim healthcare, get jobs, houses, etc. To keep banging the drum that they are all Rrom and that all Italians are racists is ignorant in the extreme.

What utter rubbish. What I find breathtaking, is the fact that you deny that Berlusconi has ordered the fingerprinting of its Roma population. That isn't some crass claim made by the non-Italian press, this is official government policy. I would suggest that you look at your adopted country's government statements before leaping in with both feet.

 

[nino_savatte]

http://www.betapolitique.fr/Italie-danger-fasciste-10649.html

 

[nino_savatte]

I think you owe me an apology "Nardini".
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5jYz0mUMZ-ibspTo5C7qK_XkYt5QQ

 

[nino_savatte]

Liberation article.
http://www.liberation.fr/actualite/monde/340513.FR.php

"Myths and lies", eh? I think someone's having a problem with cognition.

 

[Nardini]

I think you owe me an apology "Nardini".
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5jYz0mUMZ-ibspTo5C7qK_XkYt5QQ

A what!?

Good god woman/man! Your "story" is based on a story about two gypsy girls that drowned off a beach by Naples. Your story claims that Italians did nothing apart from continue to sunbathe and play beach games over the bodies.

I have shown, absolutely, that the story you continue to use in justification of your position is false and groundless. In fact, the story itself is entirely xenophobic in both content and intention.

YOU apologise for propagating this particularly unpleasant and hate-inspiring lie.

 

[nino_savatte]

A what!?

Good god woman/man! Your "story" is based on a story about two gypsy girls that drowned off a beach by Naples. Your story claims that Italians did nothing apart from continue to sunbathe and play beach games over the bodies.

I have shown, absolutely, that the story you continue to use in justification of your position is false and groundless. In fact, the story itself is entirely xenophobic in both content and intention.

YOU apologise for propagating this particularly unpleasant and hate-inspiring lie.

Sorry but that underscores the general attitude towards the Roma, as much as you would like to dismiss it.

It would seem that you're the one who is being wilfully ignorant.

 

[Nardini]

Sorry but that underscores the general attitude towards the Roma, as much as you would like to dismiss it.

It would seem that you're the one who is being wilfully ignorant.

You are attacking a country (Italy) and an entire nation (Italians) - some 56 million people - for something that I have proven to be a lie. I am not taing about your defence of the Rrom race - only Italians. Your continuing to try justifying your attack on all Italians is beyond belief. It is the attitude of someone with the attitude toward race and nations that you attack other for having.

You have absolutely no idea of my political stance - in fact, you have no idea of my racial background either. You attack to defend you own, indefensible position and by so doing, undermine any shred of moral high ground that you might otherwise be able to occupy by attacking racialists and racial stereotypes. It is a shame you cannot see this for yourself. Really.