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Israel troops admit Gaza abuses

Fedayn

Well-Known Member
So Zachor is in no doubt

Mark Regev on CH 4 News being his usual loathsome self. Caying that the claims weren't true, but couldn't explain how he knew they weren't true.

One account tells of a sniper killing a mother and children at close range whom troops had told to leave their home.

Another speaker at the seminar described what he saw as the "cold blooded murder" of a Palestinian woman.

Soliders making it clear they were ordered to shoot civilians.

one soldier said. "We are the people of Israel, we arrived in the country almost by miracle, now we need to fight to uproot the gentiles who interfere with re-conquering the Holy Land."

That last quote wouldn't help anti-semitism fester neither would it?! :rolleyes:
 
one soldier said. "We are the people of Israel, we arrived in the country almost by miracle, now we need to fight to uproot the gentiles who interfere with re-conquering the Holy Land."

That last quote wouldn't help anti-semitism fester neither would it?! :rolleyes:

Your quote is a selective edit. I don't understand why you didn't quote it all.How is the context to be understood?

The entire quote is:
The soldiers' testimonies also reportedly told of an unusually high intervention by military and non-military rabbis, who circulated pamphlets describing the war in religious terminology.

"All the articles had one clear message," one soldier said. "We are the people of Israel, we arrived in the country almost by miracle, now we need to fight to uproot the gentiles who interfere with re-conquering the Holy Land."

"Many soldiers' feelings were that this was a war of religion," he added.
What Palestinians and Israelis feel towards each other is nothing like European/Western anti-semitism.

Religious zionism is the newest of the zionisms. It grew especially from the late 60s and 70s onwards and its rise seems related to the occupation of 67 onwards, and to various Rabbis (Kahane, Kook dynasty, etc). It is part of the fundamentalist wave that recruited Rachamim from Brooklyn age 7, sent him to training camps to learn to defend his people and land, and sent him over their to occupy. It fed him lies and myths about the rights of Jewish settlers to dispossess Palestinians from their land. It uses literal interpretations to justify these actions. The situation gets worse with each generation brought up within its ideology and these people are a majority in forming the 'facts-on-the-ground' of the continued illegal occupation.
 
Your quote is a selective edit. I don't understand why you didn't quote it all.How is the context to be understood?

The entire quote is:

What Palestinians and Israelis feel towards each other is nothing like European/Western anti-semitism.

Religious zionism is the newest of the zionisms. It grew especially from the late 60s and 70s onwards and its rise seems related to the occupation of 67 onwards, and to various Rabbis (Kahane, Kook dynasty, etc). It is part of the fundamentalist wave that recruited Rachamim from Brooklyn age 7, sent him to training camps to learn to defend his people and land, and sent him over their to occupy. It fed him lies and myths about the rights of Jewish settlers to dispossess Palestinians from their land. It uses literal interpretations to justify these actions. The situation gets worse with each generation brought up within its ideology and these people are a majority in forming the 'facts-on-the-ground' of the continued illegal occupation.

True, what and how I quoted, doesn't lessen the content of the quote however.
 
These motherfucking cunts don't seem too sorry about murdering women and children though...

Israeli Army T-Shirts Mock Gaza Killings

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Wo...nian_Women_And_Children_During_Gaza_Offensive

15245789.jpg
 
As a democratically minded person I condemn any abuses and I hope that the Israeli govt will investigate these matters throughly and any miscreants punished.

However all Armies will have their share of problems and issues around mistargetting and innapropriate targetting and fighting in a built up area with a poorly defined non uniformed enemy is going to mean that there are more of this type of event.

As for the loons with the 'burka' teeshirts above I file them under minority extremist nutter just as I do the dangerous fools who are in the Hebron settlement. They are part of the problem not the solution. The contribute nothing to the battle for Israel's survival and nothing to the battle against clerical fascism. These tee shirts are just as racist as the guff that spews out from Hamas and other similar groups.
 
As a democratically minded person I condemn any abuses and I hope that the Israeli govt will investigate these matters throughly and any miscreants punished.

However all Armies will have their share of problems and issues around mistargetting and innapropriate targetting and fighting in a built up area with a poorly defined non uniformed enemy is going to mean that there are more of this type of event.

As for the loons with the 'burka' teeshirts above I file them under minority extremist nutter just as I do the dangerous fools who are in the Hebron settlement. They are part of the problem not the solution. The contribute nothing to the battle for Israel's survival and nothing to the battle against clerical fascism. These tee shirts are just as racist as the guff that spews out from Hamas and other similar groups.
but they are the ones pulling the triggers killing the civillians and children... what part of that don't you get?
 
This from the Herald Tribune:

When asked why that elderly woman was killed, a squad commander was quoted as saying: "What's great about Gaza — you see a person on a path, he doesn't have to be armed, you can simply shoot him. In our case it was an old woman on whom I did not see any weapon when I looked.
 
As a democratically minded person I condemn any abuses and I hope that the Israeli govt will investigate these matters throughly and any miscreants punished.

However all Armies will have their share of problems and issues around mistargetting and innapropriate targetting and fighting in a built up area with a poorly defined non uniformed enemy is going to mean that there are more of this type of event.

As for the loons with the 'burka' teeshirts above I file them under minority extremist nutter just as I do the dangerous fools who are in the Hebron settlement. They are part of the problem not the solution. The contribute nothing to the battle for Israel's survival and nothing to the battle against clerical fascism. These tee shirts are just as racist as the guff that spews out from Hamas and other similar groups.
You really are a pompous arse.

It's kinda weird seeing pomposity coupled with your kind of murderous depravity, all at the same time.
 
Those t-shirts....ffs:mad:

Black humour of the worst kind .
Its one thing seeing a fleeting target and then finding out you were mistaken.
Fortunatly my mistake was on an exercise.
Its quite another thing to shoot innocents when you know they are innocent.
 
Article by Gideon Levi in Haaretz, looks like he will stir up the readship again!

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1072821.html

Worth quoting:

"An army whose armored corps has yet to encounter an enemy tank and whose pilots have yet to face an enemy combat jet in 36 years has been trained to think that the only function of a tank is to crush civilian cars and that a pilot's job is to bomb residential neighborhoods.

To do this without any unnecessary moral qualms we have trained our soldiers to think that the lives and property of Palestinians have no value whatsoever. It is part of a process of dehumanization that has endured for dozens of years, the fruits of the occupation."
 
Religion kills....always has & always will. Israel has taken a very ugly swing to the right. They are becoming Hamas/Taiban/AQ like. In'67 they faced real external threats, but today the far biggest threat is from their own holy rollers.
New York Times: Fanatic Rabbis Encouraging IDF To "Expel Non-Jews."

As Israel moved right and religious, the IDF moved with it. In 1967, the officer corps was mainly from the kibbutzim, secular, and left-wing. But that Israel is disappearing (along with the near defunct kibbutz movement).

Now the officers, like a near majority of the troops, come from religious right backgrounds. And suddenly you have rightist rabbis who offer sanction to attacking anything that moves.

I am lucky. I spent some great times in my youth in the real Israel, the secular lefty place that existed until Menachem Begin brought Likud to power in 1977.

I'll never forget that ugly night. Begin won, ending 19 years of Labor dominance, and immediately headed to a West Bank settlement to join settlers dancing around with Torah scrolls.

Nonetheless, the old Israel hung on and even produced Rabin and Oslo.

But demography is doing its work. In a country of six million Jews, you have over a million religious fundamentalists, a million Russian immigrants (right of right), and over a million Jews from Arab countries who also are pretty rightwing. The "old" Israel is outnumbered and also produces fewer kids. And Avigdor Lieberman is just offstage, waiting for his close-up.

Is there good news? Yes, they may be outnumbered but Israel still has a left. It has a growing movement of teenagers who refuse to serve in the occupation. It still has writers, artists, and journalists who try to keep the dream alive. It still has Ha'aretz.

There's hope, just not much.
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/03/22/new_york_times_fanatic_rabbis_encouraging_idf_atta/
 
Nah, religion walks on two feet my friend. The Middle East conflict has got fuck all to do with religion and everything to do with power and politics.
But mix in religious fanaticism & the power/politics is made much more brutal. When you think you're killing for some god, anything can be justified.
 
The BBC is covering the sickening t-shirt aspect now as well:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7960071.stm

A sociologist quoted by Haaretz, Orna Sasson-Levy of Bar-Ilan University, warned the designs could strengthen, stimulate and legitimise aggression towards Palestinians in the occupied territories.
"There is... increasing callousness," she said. "There is a perception that the Palestinian is not a person, a human being entitled to basic rights and therefore anything may be done to him."
The Haaretz investigation discovered numerous T-shirts depicting violence against Palestinians and appearing to celebrate sexual assault.
Other designs appeared to bear witness to officially prohibited practices, such as "confirming the kill" (shooting lifeless enemies' bodies in the head to ensure they are dead), or deliberately harming religious sites and non-combatants.
 
No words are strong enough for that...

squaddie sense of humour:(
though are chain of command tended to be rather firmer.
mind you theres plenty of tasteless T shirts out there.
18 yr old blokes access to priniting t-shirts results are not going pleasant:(
 
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