Islamophobes 'r' us
- Thread starter darren redparty
- Start date
llantwit said:
Always beware of anything that seems "obvious." FWIW, I'd agree with you about *organized* religion, but that wasn't what the article was attacking. It was attacking religion in general. Such attacks are indeed pathetic, and ignorant and reactionary to boot.
Yossarian said:
Even by your own consistently high standards, this is a remarkably accomplished piece of ignorant drivel. You know nothing of any religion, as you have demonstrated on these boards many times. Therefore, you should keep quiet until you have learned something. For me, that's just obvious.
thanks class war
youve just alienated yourself from every young muslim boy under the boot of the old bill in bradford, every palestian whose just seen their house bulldozed, every iraqi whos seen their village carpet bombed
please do not presume to argue that you represent the anarchist movement in any way
freedom of belief is pretty important in my view, all organised/personal religion can be challenged, tattacked, satirised, why pick islam why now?
you stupid fucking wankers, would you consider yourselves anti-semetic?
well done class war for once again alienating the working class completely, you silly people
youve just alienated yourself from every young muslim boy under the boot of the old bill in bradford, every palestian whose just seen their house bulldozed, every iraqi whos seen their village carpet bombed
please do not presume to argue that you represent the anarchist movement in any way
freedom of belief is pretty important in my view, all organised/personal religion can be challenged, tattacked, satirised, why pick islam why now?
you stupid fucking wankers, would you consider yourselves anti-semetic?
well done class war for once again alienating the working class completely, you silly people
phildwyer said:
I can't understand why you so frequently feel it necessary to act like a bloody fool.
JoePolitix
Gone
bluestreak said:
Fair enough. When I refer to Islamophobia I mean anti-muslim racism rather than reasoned criticism of Islam consistant with other criticism of other doctrines.
It is a cause of concern for me that Muslims are regularly demonised in the mainstream press, targeted by fascists and suffer acts of violence and discrimination in this country.
I think that Islamophobia Watch is often a useful tool in understanding, countering and documenting this worrying trend although I don't agree with it's over the top attacks on Outrage! or it's attempts to defend the reactionary cleric Qaradawi, but on the whole a useful resource.
I also think that Darren RedParty has finally taken leave of his tiny little mind, but I guess that's a manditory requirement for membership of Class War.
likesfish
You can't park here sir
fair does hating all religions orgainsied or not lets face it
rowan actinson and peter tachtell are not beating people up if its a choice between the likes of them and some religous type
pass me one of mrs miggins meat pies
think class war has ther irght idea for once
rowan actinson and peter tachtell are not beating people up if its a choice between the likes of them and some religous type
pass me one of mrs miggins meat pies
think class war has ther irght idea for once
Paul Marsh
NeitherWashingtonNorMecca
Nigel said:
Yes I am Executive Officer, Office Services (Elastic Bands and Paper Clips)
so everyone religous is a twat ffs
can you define religion, does it include anyone who has any kind of belief that isnt based in western empiricist, rationalist logic
you know the scientific atheist rationalists, the vivesectors, biological waepons manufacturers, gm bods
some religious people are twats, some athiests are twats, some muslims are twats, some christians are twats
why make a point of attacking islam right now when islamic people face dangerous levels of prejudice in this country, and lethal levels of prejudice abroad
this is a real fuck up for class war, and shows a dangerous mentality imo, theres a very scary undercurrent of left and hard right forces joining up to have a go at muslims right now
something similar happened once before
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Lock&Light said:I can't understand why you so frequently feel it necessary to act like a bloody fool.
That'd be because he doesn't see his acts as foolish.
He's a bit dim like that.
la ressistance
aesthete
smokedout said:
it's precisely now that islam should be challenged.it's gaining more and more support around the world.
more and more young people are being dragged into it's way of thinking and so it should be challenged.
It's a good post from the original poster if perhaps badly worded.
sites like islamaphobe need to be told that there are many who do hate islam and what it stands for.
A definition from Tariq Ramadan which seems to fit with what some of the more sane contributors on this thread are saying:
'To criticise the religion and Muslims is not Islamophobia; a critical attitude towards religion must be accepted. But to criticise someone or discriminate against them only because they are Muslim—this is what we can call Islamophobia, this is a kind of racism.'
I'm sure Islamaphobiawatch will inore the tinny sound of Class War shouting 'yeah but we REALLY hate the prophet - go on, have a go, I dare ya'
A bit like the Black Night in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.
'To criticise the religion and Muslims is not Islamophobia; a critical attitude towards religion must be accepted. But to criticise someone or discriminate against them only because they are Muslim—this is what we can call Islamophobia, this is a kind of racism.'
I'm sure Islamaphobiawatch will inore the tinny sound of Class War shouting 'yeah but we REALLY hate the prophet - go on, have a go, I dare ya'
A bit like the Black Night in Monty Python and the Holy Grail.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Amazingly exactly the same difference between having a go at Zionists and being anti-semitic.
However, subtle distnctions, and a habit of making the religious identity merge into the personal means that as with some Jews, criticism of the religion is bigotry because it becomes an attack on the person not the insitution.
But what do you expect from sky-pixie worshippers?
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
I think the key words there are 'kind of...' since it's prejudiced behaviour based solely around a person being a muslim (as opposed to them simply being a twat)
However, that doesn't work either since if you criticise someone for holding say, conservative religious beliefs your criticism is entirely based around their being muslim/Xtian etc and that makes you XXX-phobic.
Load of bollocks frankly - if I discriminate on the basis of something people ultimately have a choice in (i.e. their religion) I'm not being racist, just a bigot.
However, that doesn't work either since if you criticise someone for holding say, conservative religious beliefs your criticism is entirely based around their being muslim/Xtian etc and that makes you XXX-phobic.
Load of bollocks frankly - if I discriminate on the basis of something people ultimately have a choice in (i.e. their religion) I'm not being racist, just a bigot.
In Bloom said:
Since when was 'immigrant' a race? Since when was 'Asylum Seeker' a race? Racism isn't a set of beliefs that is scientific or particularly honest is it? Racism hides behind ideas of culture not just skin colour. 'Those dark skinned people are ok provided they change their beliefs and culture to that which I find acceptable' is a racist position to hold.
Since Muslims are being targeted by racists of all hues the priority is to defend Muslims. Joining in the attack but masking it behind a supposed progressive opposition to all religion is inexcusable. Perhaps certain leftists and Anarchists would have prioritised opposition to Judaism had they found themselves in 1930s Germany?
Religion is not in of itself the enemy, and supression of religious belief (as opposed to criticism) is never progressive. The mainstream pro-capitalist, pro-Globalisation ideas in our society are just as unscientific at root as any religion. Muslims are among the poorest and most oppressed people inm our society.
Luther Blissett
Nomadologist
Would people find Xenophobia be a more appropriate and inclusive word?
For example, if Max Horkheimer were reincarnated in Luther Blissett, he would most certainly be saying this today:
*Horkheimer in a letter to Lowenthal of July 1946 used the term anti-Semitism
For example, if Max Horkheimer were reincarnated in Luther Blissett, he would most certainly be saying this today:
*Horkheimer in a letter to Lowenthal of July 1946 used the term anti-Semitism
Luther Blissett
Nomadologist
Always remember, "years from now, in Guantanamo or in a refugee relocation "Enterprise Zone" on 'workfare', your kids will ask you, "What did you do in the Class War, daddy?"
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
And I'll say 'The same as everyone else little Johnny - absolutely sweet FA because no one could agree on what class they were, most of the left had by that point successfully alienated most of their natural support so all that was left were the facists and the statist-democrats. Which is why everything is so completely FUCKED for you'
Luther Blissett
Nomadologist
Are you saying that an open discussion on how Derogatory Class and Race Rhetoric feeds the class-war is not relevant to Class War ?llantwit said:
That's not racism, it's xenophobia. They're two different things with different underlying causes and treating them as the same is not helpful.Groucho said:
The priority is to stand in solidarity with other working class people against racism. I'd no more "defend" some biggotted nutter cleric than I would Nick fucking Griffin.
Nonsense. Capitalism and globilisation are rational ideologies, as long as you're ruling class.
Communitarian wank.
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