Is there a "we're utterly f*cked, and this just goes to show it" thread?

[Puddy_Tat]

And it was also said that the advent of the home video player would lead to the death of the book.

i thought it was the death of the radio star

 

[Fozzie Bear]

We're fucked, right?

It’s much much worse than that.

Everything is still to play for.

We can still, with our serotonin depleted brains and creaky bones, DO things.

The sweet embrace of nihilistic certainty is some way off, comrades.

 

[RD2003]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

 

[Pickman's model]

humanities time is up

Not to mention the arts - all the money's going to stem these days

 

[Pickman's model]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

What, it was always going to come to you abandoning miserabilism for a few minutes as you crow prematurely over the situation?

 

[Ax^]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

a recent picture of RD

 

[RD2003]

What, it was always going to come to you abandoning miserabilism for a few minutes as you crow prematurely over the situation?

The only thing I'm crowing about is my own, hardly unique, prescience.

I'm simply unsurprised at the world we live in given that the fall of Communist rule was always going to make it more difficult for any form of left radicalism. The kind of society and world we see around us was hardly difficult to predict.

 

[PTK]

The only thing I'm crowing about is my own, hardly unique, prescience.

I'm simply unsurprised at the world we live in given that the fall of Communist rule was always going to make it more difficult for any form of left radicalism. The kind of society and world we see around us was hardly difficult to predict.

Did you predict it, though?

 

[Dystopiary]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

Great solidarity there! Besides, over half the population now weren't around then for you give it "told you so" now.

 

[Dystopiary]

If you're materially affected by stuff that's in the news, whether you ignore it or not, it's hard to shut off.

 

[RD2003]

Did you predict it, though?

Probably more accurate to say that even the worst predictions of the most pessimistic elements of the redical left were too optimistic for me.

 

[RD2003]

Great solidarity there! Besides, over half the population now weren't around then for you give it "told you so" now.

I'm in favour of whatever solidarity working class people can presently muster.

 

[Dystopiary]

I'm in favour of whatever solidarity working class people can presently muster.

Good, same. That's why I don't understand you finding the news amusing, but I guess we all deal with stuff in different ways. (Not being sarcastic.)

 

[RD2003]

Good, same. That's why I don't understand you finding the news amusing, but I guess we all deal with stuff in different ways. (Not being sarcastic.)

Entertaining, I said, not amusing. You can be highly entertained by a horror film.

 

[Dystopiary]

Entertaining, I said, not amusing. You can be highly entertained by a horror film.

Ah, fair dos, sorry for misunderstanding and misinterpreting you.

 

[Sweet FA]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

There you are, brain the size of a planet, and does anyone listen?

 

[RD2003]

There you are, brain the size of a planet, and does anyone listen?

I'm not asking for anybody to listen, let alone agree with me. Maybe you should say what your brain has come up with?

 

[bris]

Yes, there have been many labour saving devices, where is all the time they freed up?

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

I've been watching livestreams of a wildlife rescuer handling and feeding milk formula to orphaned baby grey squirrels as a distraction.

Did you know it's illegal to release rescued grey squirrels into the wild? It's because they're not an indigenous species.

 

[Boo Radley75]

Yeah! Lets die and have a fucking great time!!!

 

[RD2003]

''Cos I think we need one!

As a reasonablly clued up 50something year old the News is relentless 'end times" shizzle.

We're fucked, right?

It depends on what you mean by 'we' and 'fucked.'

Most of the human race would not include themselves in the 'we' as understood by most people on these boards.

The news is not 'end times schizzle', but a reflection of how we appear to be heading towards rule by untouchable oligarchs who have, due to the continuing hegemony of neo-liberalism, the support of many of the poorest in even the minority of societies which have experienced some form of democratic control, however inadequate, in a situation where elections are becoming increasingly meaningless choices between parties that adhere to the neo-liberal agenda. It is now near-impossible to veer away from that agenda and win an election, as we saw with the Corbyn experience, or to fully carry through a programme of reforms if you do win, as we've seen elsewhere. It seems that only the so-called culure wars offer a veneer of choice. In most of the world rule by untouchable elites has always been the norm, and we could be headed towards joining them.

This can only be challenged by collective action and solidarity, but with the destruction of the old industrial communities and the increased 'atomisation' of society, which is only set to be exacerbated by technoloigical developments, this is infinitely harder to achieve on a mass scale than it was 40-50 years ago. Anybody working in a non-union firm in the private sector (now the majority) would understand the difficulty of establishing even trade union recognition, with younger employees, having no memory of working class or even basic workplace solidarity, used to no workplace rights other than those the company is forced to recognise by law. This largely extends to their, along with most of their elders, attitude towards society as a whole-what they see seems completely normal, and even those who accept what is termed the 'woke agenda' can easily be made hostile to anything that smacks of socialism or 'communism,' if only because understanding of those terms has never been weaker. They may sense that social mobility is being eroded by neo-liberalism, but have been educated/indoctrinated into thinking that they can do anything as long as they continue striving, due to a deliberately engineered lack of basic political understanding.

They are the majority, broadly speaking, and wouldn't regard themselves as fucked. Even in the dire political circumstances in which we find ourselves they will survive, short of some kind of all-engulfing disaster, the threat of which is probably growing. In the absence of viable left alternatives many will end up quietly enthusing over the very political currents that seek to fuck them over.

 

[Orang Utan]

The opening sentence of David Wallace-Wells’ The Uninhabitable Earth puts it succinctly:

 

[seventh bullet]

Did you know it's illegal to release rescued grey squirrels into the wild? It's because they're not an indigenous species.

Well then, it's a good job she's in the US.

 

[LDC]

Might as well put this here as seems relevant to the thread topic... some thoughts from Rob Ray on the current situation. Some good points, although understandably very orientated to what's left of the anarchist scene and what it might do.

Part 1 Anarchism and the New Military Wave (pt.1) - Freedom News
Part 2 Anarchism and the New Military Wave (pt. 2) - Freedom News

 

[hitmouse]

Sadly the news (and its consequences) happens whether you participate or not!

Have said this previously on similar threads, but I think it's worth drawing a distinction between things that you think you might be able to have some impact on, however minor, and things that you can't. If we're talking about things that you may be able to play some role in, then it is worth learning about those things in order to act more effectively. If not, then I'm genuinely not sure if there's any real argument for engaging with them. I know the serenity prayer is a terrible cliche, but unfortunately I do increasingly think it is actually a good guide to how to be in the world. Not that I follow my own advice here a lot of the time, but maybe I'd be better off if we did.

It depends on what you mean by 'we' and 'fucked.'

Most of the human race would not include themselves in the 'we' as understood by most people on these boards.

The news is not 'end times schizzle'...

Depends what bit of the news we're talking about. I reckon this kind of news probably qualifies as end times shit.

South Korea wildfires become biggest on record as disaster chief points to ‘harsh reality’ of climate crisis

Officials point to ultra-dry conditions as death toll reaches 27 and fires threaten Unesco heritage sites

www.theguardian.com

 

[LDC]

Have said this previously on similar threads, but I think it's worth drawing a distinction between things that you think you might be able to have some impact on, however minor, and things that you can't. If we're talking about things that you may be able to play some role in, then it is worth learning about those things in order to act more effectively. If not, then I'm genuinely not sure if there's any real argument for engaging with them. I know the serenity prayer is a terrible cliche, but unfortunately I do increasingly think it is actually a good guide to how to be in the world. Not that I follow my own advice here a lot of the time, but maybe I'd be better off if we did.

Depends what bit of the news we're talking about. I reckon this kind of news probably qualifies as end times shit.

South Korea wildfires become biggest on record as disaster chief points to ‘harsh reality’ of climate crisis

Officials point to ultra-dry conditions as death toll reaches 27 and fires threaten Unesco heritage sites

www.theguardian.com

Yeah I think it needs splitting up a bit; global ecology (climate, biodiversity, etc.), politically in the UK/USA/EU/+ and then elsewhere, more specific things like war and AI, and maybe something like psychologically as well?

I think we're going to see wild changes the next years, maybe not decades but even just the next decade. Of course ... change ... crisis ... opportunity ... etc cliche.

Was listening to something the other day that talked about how historically things have mostly been locally unstable but globally stable, whereas now it's (mostly) locally stable but globally hugely unstable (very 'developed' world-centric though).

 

[Rimbaud]

It depends on what you mean by 'we' and 'fucked.'

Most of the human race would not include themselves in the 'we' as understood by most people on these boards.

The news is not 'end times schizzle', but a reflection of how we appear to be heading towards rule by untouchable oligarchs who have, due to the continuing hegemony of neo-liberalism, the support of many of the poorest in even the minority of societies which have experienced some form of democratic control, however inadequate, in a situation where elections are becoming increasingly meaningless choices between parties that adhere to the neo-liberal agenda. It is now near-impossible to veer away from that agenda and win an election, as we saw with the Corbyn experience, or to fully carry through a programme of reforms if you do win, as we've seen elsewhere. It seems that only the so-called culure wars offer a veneer of choice. In most of the world rule by untouchable elites has always been the norm, and we could be headed towards joining them.

This can only be challenged by collective action and solidarity, but with the destruction of the old industrial communities and the increased 'atomisation' of society, which is only set to be exacerbated by technoloigical developments, this is infinitely harder to achieve on a mass scale than it was 40-50 years ago. Anybody working in a non-union firm in the private sector (now the majority) would understand the difficulty of establishing even trade union recognition, with younger employees, having no memory of working class or even basic workplace solidarity, used to no workplace rights other than those the company is forced to recognise by law. This largely extends to their, along with most of their elders, attitude towards society as a whole-what they see seems completely normal, and even those who accept what is termed the 'woke agenda' can easily be made hostile to anything that smacks of socialism or 'communism,' if only because understanding of those terms has never been weaker. They may sense that social mobility is being eroded by neo-liberalism, but have been educated/indoctrinated into thinking that they can do anything as long as they continue striving, due to a deliberately engineered lack of basic political understanding.

They are the majority, broadly speaking, and wouldn't regard themselves as fucked. Even in the dire political circumstances in which we find ourselves they will survive, short of some kind of all-engulfing disaster, the threat of which is probably growing. In the absence of viable left alternatives many will end up quietly enthusing over the very political currents that seek to fuck them over.

Hard to fault any of that unfortunately.

The remnants of a socialist left are largely nostalgic, in denial and ideologically stagnant, with little in the way of new approaches. More to the point they are broke.

The best to hope for is to wait for opportunities to arise, but there is also no capacity for action as there are no real organisations of the left powerful enough to seize opportunities.

 

[LDC]

Have said this previously on similar threads, but I think it's worth drawing a distinction between things that you think you might be able to have some impact on, however minor, and things that you can't. If we're talking about things that you may be able to play some role in, then it is worth learning about those things in order to act more effectively. If not, then I'm genuinely not sure if there's any real argument for engaging with them. I know the serenity prayer is a terrible cliche, but unfortunately I do increasingly think it is actually a good guide to how to be in the world. Not that I follow my own advice here a lot of the time, but maybe I'd be better off if we did.

It's just a question of strategy for me; what is our ability to collectively impact something? If we have none then there's nothing to be gained (and plenty lost) by getting too bothered by it. The slightly drunk comment I deleted on the Quaker thread was in part motivated by that, in that I think much of the left is caught up in this emotional rollercoaster of outrage and horror at various (often quite minor) things, and exhausts itself on complaining about things that it can't do anything about and often were also an entirely a predictable consequence of what the people involved did.

 

[ska invita]

I actually find the news quite entertaining, as it unendingly confirms what I used to go about smugly saying to everybody the world would end up looking like once the cold war ended. From November 1989 onwards I couldn't abide the smugness of the liberals of both left and right, with their baseless complacency about their own correctness, nor the lunatic optimism of those Trots and others on the radical left who assumed that the death of what more or less the whole world assumed was communism in practice would somehow eventually lead to some form of communism or socialism.

It was always coming to this.

Gravestone options include
I Told You So
And
I Knew It Would Come To This

The one reason to be cheerful is the likely coming decline of US hegemony... That's a massive step forward if it happens, for the UK as much as anywhere

 

[ska invita]

Tax The Rich campaign is going to have legs this next few years I think