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Is Brexit actually going to happen?

Discussion in 'UK politics, current affairs and news' started by Kaka Tim, Jun 27, 2016.

?

Will we have a brexit?

  1. Yes - A fully independant Britain making its own way in the world (apart from scotland).

    18.9%
  2. A Semi-Detached Norway type deal

    34.7%
  3. No - 2nd referendum and/or face saving fudge to let us slink back in feeling a bit fucking stupid

    46.3%
  1. gosub

    gosub ~#

  2. Riklet

    Riklet procrastinación

    This stingy cold vicious blablabla Germany is perhaps one of the European countries that had the most organised working class and Comunist party etc.

    I mean fair enough criticising German economic policy in Europe but it's far too easy to read too deeply into national traits and characteristics. Are my British 'traits' responsible for colonialism the slave trade and imperial slaughter? It is never anywhere near as black and white...
     
    Yossarian and JimW like this.
  3. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    From my experience, it's those very working class Germans that for the decades since the war have done the most soul searching about how their ancestors caused the atrocities of ww2.

    For some posters here it's apparently not a matter of lookung too deeply into national traits or characteristics, rather simply recognising oo acknowledging any such traits or characteristics.

    I wonder how say Bill Bryson is thought of in this respect. In his travel books like 'Tales from a small Island' or 'down under' he constantly refers to national stereotypes of the Brits and aussies in his own humourous way. It'd be hard to label him racist though.
    Maybe it's just that I used those negative attributes for germany.
    For example, one of the characteristics if germans that I most love is their honesty. They often cant help themselves telling the brutal truth, sometimes in the most sensitive of situations, when it would have probably been best just to keep their thoughts to themselves (not far different to how I've described them above). Ironic isn't it.
    Then there's that old chestnut of their brilliant social organisation, which enables them such great engineering. Racist stereotype?
     
  4. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model The word of Sin is Restriction

    Perhaps you have it arse over tit and empire responsible for British traits than the other way round - and to which British traits do you refer?
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2017
    pocketscience likes this.
  5. J Ed

    J Ed I remember the future

    Productive discussion. Let's do interpreting European politics and sociology through phrenology next!
     
    SpackleFrog, Chz, NoXion and 9 others like this.
  6. bimble

    bimble noisy but small

    But also they are very 'crafty'. ok. :facepalm:
     
    teuchter likes this.
  7. A380

    A380 How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?

    Most of the Germans I know identify themselves as being from their regigion/land/old state first then as Germans.

    So they will say they are Bavarian or from Saxony then German. In a similar way to people who say they are English, Welsh or Scottish before they are British.

    The exception to this is people I know from Prussia*who all seem quite negative about their Prussioness.

    My sample size isn’t huge c 25 people. I wonder if any German Urbs or people with other links to Germany could share their views.

    I think being ‘German’ is a slightly different concept than that of perhaps being ‘French’ or being ‘American’.

    This might, might, be a reason many German people are so committed to the EU?

    (* One chap who’s family was so distrusted by the DDR regime that, before they let him go to medical school, they made him do FIVE years compulsory military service, most in the old USSR. Mind you he got to command a katyusha rocket unit. So not all bad then...)
     
  8. JimW

    JimW 支那暗杀团

    Neither Holy or Roman
     
    mojo pixy and A380 like this.
  9. A380

    A380 How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?

    Not really an empire either...
     
    mojo pixy likes this.
  10. Yossarian

    Yossarian free shrugs

    Have you lost your mind? Describing negative or "unsavoury" characteristics as being "deeply ingrained" into a population is almost the dictionary definition of racism. So please stop doing it.

    I know a lot of German people, including my mother-in-law, and they're all different, it's almost as if they came from a country of 80 million individuals with their own characteristics.
     
    oryx, paolo, teuchter and 4 others like this.
  11. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model The word of Sin is Restriction

    You missed out clinical, efficient and bastards with the sunbeds
     
  12. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    pocketscience

    What about Germans that follow Judaism? Or Islam?

    Do they have a subsection of characteristics from the broader German traits you have described?

    Germans whose parents were born in Turkey or Poland?

    What about the Germans whose parents were born in Africa?

    Are they all the same or little differences between the wider groups based where there parents were born and/or lived?

    I need to know.
     
  13. butchersapron

    butchersapron blood on the walls

    Interesting - placing traits/characteristics/assumptions on huge swathes of people is only acceptable to you when done on the basis of class.
     
    mather, B.I.G and A380 like this.
  14. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    Nope. Just voting. I am working class. Maybe my upbringing wasn't working class enough for you though.
     
  15. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    For example. If you are working class and you vote tory you have to be thick.
     
  16. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist my world is fire and blood

    oh sweet jesus of nazareth
     
    Chz, mather, sealion and 1 other person like this.
  17. gosub

    gosub ~#

    Out of curiosity who do you vote for if you are working class? What with Labour turning itself into the party of the impoverished graduate.
     
  18. J Ed

    J Ed I remember the future

    So you can't be an 'impoverished' graduate and working-class then?
     
  19. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    My understanding from urban is that a lot of people don't vote either because they are all the same or because real change can't come about through the ballot box.

    But as an impoverished graduate I vote for labour. I encourage others to vote for whoever they believe will improve their situation.
     
  20. sealion

    sealion Marilise Legijuana

  21. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

  22. sealion

    sealion Marilise Legijuana

    Not the point. Anyway you have form on here for digging out the working class. Thick and racist you cry, so fuck off.
     
  23. gosub

    gosub ~#

    I suppose theorically but a bit of a waste of a degree, chances are your average poultry plucker or warehouse night shifter is going to think you're at least lower middle class by the time you graduate.

    Anyway, was not an original observation by me, was a comment on stress fractures to come by Prof Curtice last week
     
  24. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    I disagree with some of my fellow working class views. Oh no!
     
  25. J Ed

    J Ed I remember the future

    Surprised you didn't go with the example of chimney sweep. You think there aren't any graduates working in warehouses?
     
  26. mather

    mather Well-Known Member

    Yeah, it was much more than mere disagreement though wasn't it you disingenuous twat.
     
  27. Dogsauce

    Dogsauce Lord of the Dance Settee

    Anyway, blue passports - is that just something they've thrown out to distract/delight the nuttier brexitters while May backpedals on hard Brexit? Does that mean 'soft Brexit' is winning? The twitter lot seem pointlessly cross about it.
     
  28. B.I.G

    B.I.G Well-Known Member

    Was it. More than a disagreement between people on the internet. Not for me?
     
  29. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    or:
    …your typical northern working class Brexit voter is:
     
  30. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model The word of Sin is Restriction

    They're not as good as the auld blue passports
     

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