I'm thinking of joining the AWL...
- Thread starter neyronal2
- Start date
cockneyrebel
New Member
Tokyo I wouldn't waste your time having a debate about Workers Power with Chuck Wilson. He has an utter obsession with WP (at one point before I put him on ignore 15 out of his last 25 posts were about WP). This has even progressed to him wiling away his free time inventing mock posts about WP. A bit sad, but if it keeps him happy, why not.
Touchy....and 'severely mistaken'.
silentNate
1.618 xakep
They all looked quite youngsihhi said:
Crib sheets.
Is that for young members?
No, they were their chants for the StWC march, all dressed the same, all singing from the same hymn sheet...
Literally...
tangentlama
Nameless voices crying
neyronal2 said:
you are Nick Cohen and i claim my £5!
Idris2002 said:
very droll but oh-so apt
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
silentNate said:They all looked quite young
No, they were their chants for the StWC march, all dressed the same, all singing from the same hymn sheet...
Literally...
I think handing around sheets with the words on them is a good idea. Those contingents sing the Internationale and some other socialist songs as well as chanting and unfortunately most young people these days don't actually arrive on a demonstration knowing the lyrics.
cockneyrebel
New Member
Ultra left madness. They'll be chanting about revolution and stuff if you're not careful.
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
As everyone knows CR, chanting "One Solution! Revolution!" is the mark of the absolute prick. I will be proud to move the expulsion of any Socialist Party member I see doing it.
It means that new people can join in much more easily. Also the contingent can sing things which are a bit more complex than a basic chant without risking one of those moments where only two people can remember the lyrics and are left singing while everyone else mumbles for a couple of lines.
The matching t-shirts is an idea pinched from some of our continental sister organisations in places like Belgium where every group does it. It makes a contingent much more visible and impressive looking. On the other hand I don't fancy our chances of convincing our members to do it here in Ireland.
knopf said:
It means that new people can join in much more easily. Also the contingent can sing things which are a bit more complex than a basic chant without risking one of those moments where only two people can remember the lyrics and are left singing while everyone else mumbles for a couple of lines.
The matching t-shirts is an idea pinched from some of our continental sister organisations in places like Belgium where every group does it. It makes a contingent much more visible and impressive looking. On the other hand I don't fancy our chances of convincing our members to do it here in Ireland.
silentNate
1.618 xakep
Yeah, got to admit that the crib sheet is a good idea and with those t-shirts the SP looked good- nice chants too 
You with them Nigel?
You with them Nigel?
Tokyo said:
I agree that WP are known for making calls that simply do not fit the real World. But you have used an odd example. The SWP and the STWC called for walk-outs and some were achieved.
The AWL paper, Solidarity, was headlined 'Strike against the war.' Yet AWL union reps in the Civil Service did not make any attempts to deliver and argued that it was a non-starter.
cockneyrebel
New Member
Wheras singing the Internationale on a STWC demo is fine of course. I'm sure it had the whole demo joining in as it struck a chord with everyone around.
In fact on my way home from the demo the whole train was talking about how the Internationale would save the human race.
Also I remember the ISR contingent and the line:
seemed to miss the mark a bit. Or do you count people who live in the suburbs as peasants?
cockneyrebel
New Member
It is an odd example, given that Workers Power members did actually organise balloted strikes against the war. Which is more than can be said of the SWP as well as the AWL.
I didn't manage to do so well in my workplace, I only managed to get people to eat buscuits for another five minutes in the tea break. Still little acorns and all that.
october_lost
It's not hip any more...
I simply dont get it, why would any person want to join political party these days 
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
october_lost said:I simply dont get it, why would any person want to join political party these days
All of about two years ago you were in a couple of them yourself. Perhaps you should invent a time machine and go back and ask the younger you.
Perhaps its me but I can't help thinking that pictures of contingents with matching t-shirts and red flags simply reminds me of the Russian CP demos against Yeltzin. More obscurely I can remeber the RCP with red sashes and those banners on long sticks used by chinese athletes/dancers . High of fashion or pure kitsch. Whilst for the proffesional revolutioanries there may be an issue regarding the asthetics of fashion and image on demos but I would suggest that it's the content of working class struggle rather than its appearance that is the priority.
cockneyrebel
New Member
I thought that was a turning point in the workers movement to be honest.....
Taxamo Welf
kebagels pls
well actually appearance is probably a lot more imprtant than people reckon. If you'd be embarassed to be seen with the pople on a demo, you aren't likely to take what they are saying very seriously.Chuck Wilson said:
Taxamo Welf said:
I don't necesasrily disagree with you but I would ask what is the audience? If it is the rest of the revo left fine wear matching t-shirts and wave red flags so that the rest of the left can admire some form of kitsch retro-revo fashion as some form of spectacle.
I went on a schools closure protest last month and tbh I didn't spot anyone with a red flag or matching t-shirt or but I did talk to about fourty very angry but 'mundanely' attired working class parents who had made the effort to lobby the councillors in the rain .
Nigel Irritable
Five, Ten, Fifteen Years
Chuck Wilson said:
Young people going on a march and taking an interest in politics for the most part. These after all are primarily youth contingents. There's nothing wrong with creating a bit of a "spectacle" - by making your contingent more visible and distinctive with flags, t-shirts or whatever you make your politics and message in turn more visible. It really is as simple as that
For obvious reasons I've yet to encounter someone arguing that it's a good idea to start going to every political event wearing matching t-shirts or carrying a flag. But for raising your profile on a large march it makes a lot of sense. It's common practice for groups of all sorts, from unions to political parties to do it in many countries, and it strikes me as a useful idea to steal although not as a particularly important issue either way.
charlie mowbray
The Enforcer
Yes, when I went on some international demos in the 90s there were at least two instances of a large contingent of Belgian carworkers all kitted out in the same T-shirts - Amsterdam and Paris ( by the way, huge contingents of anarchists and anarchosyndicalists on all these demos)
Taxamo Welf
kebagels pls
matching clothes is pushing it IMHO, but flags is a pretty good idea - it all depends on the demo.
PS i know for a fact that some people actually joined Revolution because of the flags!
PS i know for a fact that some people actually joined Revolution because of the flags!
rebel warrior
Soca Warrior
Taxamo Welf said:PS i know for a fact that some people actually joined Revolution because of the flags!
I doubt many people would join them because of their politics...
gawkrodger
Well-Known Member
rebel warrior said:
RW in half amusing post shocker!
Pilgrim said:
And how exactly are you going to win your bet?
Taxamo Welf
kebagels pls
no most join out of a rejection of YOUR politics you silly cuntrebel warrior said:
Chuck Wilson said:
Perhaps by conducting a poll of ex-Swappies, thereby establishing the average time taken for them to become disillusioned and leave for pastures new.
From personal experience, my first Swappie meeting was just after Genoa. At my last Swappie meeting almost none of those present, excluding the local organiser and his clique, were people who had attended the Genoa meeting.
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