I'm in shock, fiftyone bloody quid.

[Seeker]

I need to use my car for work because I physically can't walk that far. Other than work I do about 20-30 miles a week, mainly to go to the market. So, yes, I do. The issue here is the naked greed of the chancellor and the oil industry.

yup.. the tax take from motorists is appalling. there's road tax, tax when you buy the car, horrendous tax on petrol, congestion charging.. charges to park, charges to use some roads, the list goes on...
its fucking ridiculous. The incentives to go green are half arsed and public transport is useless for all but simple journeys to set places

 

[Sasaferrato]

That is quite alot for a car like that. Even filling up our little Fiat that Pig is now using for work, that has been over £30 quid a go. Fuck knows what our petrol bill will be like when I get my new Lexus in a few weeks' time. Still, I am sure I can live with it!

 

[interpol]

>>>Here<<< ..Time for direct action...>>>>Here<<<<

Interpol...

 

[Sasaferrato]

yup.. the tax take from motorists is appalling. there's road tax, tax when you buy the car, horrendous tax on petrol, congestion charging.. charges to park, charges to use some roads, the list goes on...
its fucking ridiculous. The incentives to go green are half arsed and public transport is useless for all but simple journeys to set places

I'm going to meet some fellow Urbanites in Dundee, by car, because the last train back is at 7:30pm. If there was a train I would gladly use it.


< Still seething >

 

[MarkMark]

Get out there and walk to your local paper shop..
- you'll feel a *lot* better for it afterwards

 

[Sasaferrato]

Crude is gonna hit $102 a barrel before the end of the year, so we're looking at £1.80 a litre . Hopefully Brown will hold firm on duty and people will start to have to reconsider their car use before it's too late.

Every time the price goes up the one eyed fat fucking troll rakes in even more VAT. Bastard.

< Shakes fist and seethes some more >

 

[Sasaferrato]

>>>Here<<< ..Time for direct action...>>>>Here<<<<

Interpol...

An absolute blockade is the answer. People power. Wonder if I can whip up support to blockade Grangemouth.

< Seethe downgraded to simmer >

 

[chooch]

yup.. the tax take from motorists is appalling. there's road tax, tax when you buy the car, horrendous tax on petrol, congestion charging.. charges to park, charges to use some roads, the list goes on..

 

[comstock]

Do you think you should pay less to pollute the atmosphere and burn up more non renewable resources, then?

Modern cars create very little pollution

 

[chooch]

Modern cars create very little pollution

Ignoring CO2, yes. Including CO2, no.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Modern cars create very little pollution

Modern cars create loads of pollution and other environmental damage, when compared to pretty much any other mode of personal transport apart from a private jet.

 

[Seeker]

Chooch - Im curious why you feel the need to equate disposable income with the price of petrol

One does not necessarily have to follow the other...

 

[RaverDrew]

WOW !!! That's a weeel pwetty lil gwaff

Can I borrow your cwayons one day ???

 

[chooch]

Chooch - Im curious why you feel the need to equate disposable income with the price of petrol

Not equating anything with anything. It's a graph. You read the key, the two axes and the plots and it tells you things. Just for information's sake, like.

WOW !!! That's a weeel pwetty lil gwaff. Can I borrow your cwayons one day ???

Ask Defra, DfT and the National Statistics Office- it's their graph.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Chooch - Im curious why you feel the need to equate disposable income with the price of petrol

One does not necessarily have to follow the other...

I'd assume the graph is there to say that the price index of the cost of motoring hasn't changed much since 1974, as opposed to rail and bus.

 

[Nemo]

Not equating anything with anything. It's a graph. You read the key the two axes and the plot and it tells you things. Just for information's sake, like.

Things like that cunt Branson's making even more out of mugs like me than he would have done 30 years ago. Him and his fucking 10% fare rises.

 

[Seeker]

I'd assume the graph is there to say that the price index of the cost of motoring hasn't changed much since 1974, as opposed to rail and bus.

that being the case, it supports motoring over the use of public transport.

 

[comstock]

Modern cars create loads of pollution and other environmental damage, when compared to pretty much any other mode of personal transport apart from a private jet.

Simply *not* true. Catalytic converters have taken most of the sh*t of the exhaust.

Lets say we wanted to reduce car use by 50%. How many buses would we need to do that? F*cking thousands. And how many of those would half empty? Bus engines kick out loads of particulates so the result would be more pollution, not less

 

[Dilzybhoy]

A guy up my way made some kind of diesel fuel out of used cooking oil. He converted his motor for it and all. It worked too. That was a couple of years ago and then I seen something about someone applying for permission or something to open up a plant to convert used chippie oil to fuel.
I know I didn't dream it up.
Did I?

 

[tangerinedream]

I manage without a car. So it means living in leafy suburbia or the countryside is out of bounds but that's my choice. If i was chancellor i'd make it imposible to run anything that didn't do about 55 mpg. Everything i earnt i'd put into making cycle lanes, lowering bus fares, increasing frequencies and new routes etc. I'd introduce congestion charges in every major town centre. Their are very few excuses to drive into the middle of cities beyond practical needs i.e - a builders van. Most people have access to a bus or train for at least getting to the nearest municipal centre for shopping etc.

(i know some people don't - the majority do)

People make millions of unnecasary journeys every year. Where I work there are 3 cyclists and me (a bus user) out of a staff of 160. As far as I know, only one set of people fill their car to capacity to get home.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Simply *not* true. Catalytic converters have taken most of the sh*t of the exhaust.

Lets say we wanted to reduce car use by 50%. How many buses would we need to do that? F*cking thousands. And how many of those would half empty? Bus engines kick out loads of particulates so the result would be more pollution, not less

Right, so a decent public transport system is less environmentally damaging per person-mile than going by car is it? Do me a favour.

Proper transport systems don't rest on just replacing cars with buses, that would be daft.

 

[RaverDrew]

Not equating anything with anything. It's a graph. You read the key, the two axes and the plots and it tells you things. Just for information's sake, like.
Ask Defra, DfT and the National Statistics Office- it's their graph.

But It means fuck all tbf, it doesn't take into account the costs of other things that have risen since then, such as rent, food, beer, i-pods, crayons etc.

 

[Shirl]

I drive a company car. Until a couple of years ago, people like me were encouraged to make unnecessary journeys because the more miles you did, the less tax you paid. At least that's not the case anymore.
and now that I've bought a bike, I'm even more eco friendly
actually, I'm not because I can't pedal as far as the shop yet

 

[Seeker]

I manage without a car. So it means living in leafy suburbia or the countryside is out of bounds but that's my choice. If i was chancellor i'd make it imposible to run anything that didn't do about 55 mpg. Everything i earnt i'd put into making cycle lanes, lowering bus fares, increasing frequencies and new routes etc. I'd introduce congestion charges in every major town centre. Their are very few excuses to drive into the middle of cities beyond practical needs i.e - a builders van. Most people have access to a bus or train for at least getting to the nearest municipal centre for shopping etc.

(i know some people don't - the majority do)

People make millions of unnecasary journeys every year. Where I work there are 3 cyclists and me (a bus user) out of a staff of 160. As far as I know, only one set of people fill their car to capacity to get home.

thankfully we're not all transport nazis like you. I agree there are many unnecessary journeys, but a hell of a lot of people need cars. Even if many of us could get by without one it would lead to a lower quality of life.

 

[RaverDrew]

Right, so a decent public transport system is less environmentally damaging per person-mile than going by car is it? Do me a favour.

Proper transport systems don't rest on just replacing cars with buses, that would be daft.

Look until hover boards are invented thats's just not a fair argument now is it !!!

 

[comstock]

A guy up my way made some kind of diesel fuel out of used cooking oil. He converted his motor for it and all. It worked too. That was a couple of years ago and then I seen something about someone applying for permission or something to open up a plant to convert used chippie oil to fuel.
I know I didn't dream it up.
Did I?

No you didn't http://www.dieselveg.com/faq's.htm

Trouble is you have to pay tax on it....how strict they are I don't know.

 

[Dilzybhoy]

Ha knew I never dreamt it. Here's something
Edit---Ah sorry just seen the above.

 

[chooch]

But It means fuck all tbf, it doesn't take into account the costs of other things that have risen since then, such as rent, food, beer, i-pods, crayons etc.

It means what it means- and it's adjusted for inflation. Because it's a national statistic, the methodology for it should be fairly easily available if you want to clarify how it's calculated, and what 'real terms' and 'disposable income' mean.

Simply *not* true. Catalytic converters have taken most of the sh*t of the exhaust...Bus engines kick out loads of particulates so the result would be more pollution, not less

Again, pollution carefully defined to ignore CO2- John Redwood's a big fan of that one. Catalytic converters incidentally reduce the overall efficiency of the engine- more CO2 per unit of work done.

Motorists: score extra points by using the words hard pressed

 

[comstock]

Right, so a decent public transport system is less environmentally damaging per person-mile than going by car is it? Do me a favour.

Only if the buses are fairly full. In order to compete with the car you have to offer frequencies of every 5 minutes or so. That may work on routes from the suburbs to the centre at peak times but having loads of empty buses running around would cause more pollution than cars. When I'm out and about walking the city streets, I smell diesel fumes far more often than I smell car exhausts

Proper transport systems don't rest on just replacing cars with buses, that would be daft.

OK so what do you replace them with then?

 

[tangerinedream]

Simply *not* true. Catalytic converters have taken most of the sh*t of the exhaust.

Lets say we wanted to reduce car use by 50%. How many buses would we need to do that? F*cking thousands. And how many of those would half empty? Bus engines kick out loads of particulates so the result would be more pollution, not less

Not if we actually thought creatively and invested in environmentally sound forms of public transport - e.g. tramways, new busses, community 'taxis buses' for rural areas. Invested in staff to make public transport a more pleasant atmosphere. But that would be 'greedy' acording to some people on this thread and an example of 'socialist madness' probably.
The reason busses are unreliable 95% of the time is because congestion makes it impossible for them to get anywhere. The reason busses run empty are most people who drive cars use excuses like convinience to make a hell of a lot of journeys.
Yes - *some* people need a car. If you live in the middle of the yorkshire dales for example. However I'd suggest these people are in the minority.