I want a new job - public sector

[sojourner]

cheers for the handy links...I'm going to be out of work as of the end of september (as the CRE, EOC and DRC merge to the equalities "super"body the CEHR) so I really need to get cracking with job hunting.

Out of interest, who has switched from public sector to private and enjoyed it more/been better off? The majority of my working life has been spent in the public sector, the last 4/5 years working as a Programme and Policy Officer and managing grants. What sort of private sector jobs would I have the skills for?

Oi cheeky, get yer own thread (sorry to hear you'll be out of work)

Thanks all for the replies. Will check out those two main links and see what I can find

 

[stat]

Will check out those two main links and see what I can find

if you're interested in local government jobs, you could do worse then check out local government jobs.com

http://www.lgjobs.com/

general public sector jobs:
http://public.monster.co.uk/

london public sector jobs:
http://www.yourlondon.gov.uk/jobs/

 

[pootle]

Oi cheeky, get yer own thread (sorry to hear you'll be out of work)

Soz...was just following up on a few comments people had made about you making the move to the private sector and was interested how viable/likely this is if you've mostly worked in the public sector...that's all!

*backs away from thread*

 

[mrsfran]

Out of interest, who has switched from public sector to private and enjoyed it more/been better off?

Me. I worked in the public sector for the first 6 years of my working life, and switched to private 5 months ago. I am astonished at how much better it is. Having been in public sector so long I thought that was just what work was like, beaurocracy and resistance to change was how it was. I come to the private sector and suddenly.. I can get things done! People are receptive to my ideas! I don't have to spend my life in meetings! I never knew there was such beauty in life! Well, that's going too far, but let's just say that being provided with flapjacks in meetings felt like an absolute luxury.

Also, I earn £3K more than I did in my last job, which isn't an enormous leap but makes a difference to me.

It may be that I work for a particularly good company, but I actually enjoy my job now and it's made me determined never to go back.

 

[kyser_soze]

My 3 experiences of working pubic sector (County Council, nat gov and for a London PCT where I am now) are very similar to Miss Fran's, and I'd also add that the variation in both competency and motivation to work is far, far greater in the public sector than private - the IT skills deficit at the PCT I work for across ALL roles, not just clinical (where you'd maybe expect less because it's only recently that they've started using these new fangled computer things) but administrative as well. Couple that with a fucking appalling work ethic from many staff (I've actually had someone say to me 'I want to work in the NHS because I could never do as little in the private sector), and it's IMPOSSIBLE to get anything moving - I'm running what amounts to a fire fighting operation on a major update to the IT system we're implementing because the relevant department, despite having A YEAR of lead in time has done fuck all to prepare for it.

Well, that's that off my chest

 

[marty21]

i work for a charity and i am paid well and so are my colleagues. it's a myth that the public/third sector doesn't pay well - i earn more than a number of my friends working in the private sector. granted, they're not investment bankers, but they do work for marketing/PR agencies and the likes, which are highly competitive industries.

i work in the not for profit sector - we are a charitable trust (a housing association) and the pay is not too bad, not sure what the op is looking for but a good place to look for my sector is insidehousing, or the guardian, although the guardian doesn't seem to get as many job ads as it used to, so maybe some are now advertising in the times and indie

 

[kyser_soze]

No, it's the time of year - there's always a drop off in recruitment ads over summer.

A quick check on the Guardian's recruitment ad sales bumpf shows that they're still growing their share of public sector recruitment ads (along with the Time and Daily Hate, the Gruaniad is the biggest paper for recruitment ads by column centimeters...)

 

[Guineveretoo]

Ah, good point about the Guardian job pages, and you can access it on line and do quite a clever search, too, iirc.

 

[Looby]

Me and Magic Sam are civil servants and are paid less than those doing the same job in the private sector. Civil Service payrises this year are less than 2% I believe this is the same for NHS and teachers too. If you find some well paid jobs let me know!

 

[Gromit]

I've realised that I reach the top of my pay scale next year.

When that happens in real terms I take a pay cut each year as my cost of living rise will always be lower than inflation.

Time to start applying for promotions i guess.
Its the only way to prevent what has happened to colleagues whose cost of living has gone up and up and their pay hasn't kept up and they end up on the bones of their arse.

 

[han]

i work for a charity and i am paid well and so are my colleagues. it's a myth that the public/third sector doesn't pay well - i earn more than a number of my friends working in the private sector. granted, they're not investment bankers, but they do work for marketing/PR agencies and the likes, which are highly competitive industries.

Yes - I've only ever worked in the public sector and for charities (except for a brief 3-month stint at a hellish web design agency - never again!). And I would wholeheardedly say that the charity sector is much more chillin and less stressy than say, the NHS or local government. Same kind of salaries, too.

Charities rock!

 

[Gromit]

I work with a woman who is currently on secondment from a charity.
She said the pay there is even worse than here.

I knew another girl who worked for the blind institute and they paid a pittance.

Those in well paid charity jobs are imo really lucky. In wales the volluntary sector is pretty much very poorly paid. You are okay if you are lucky enough to be funded by Objective One money because then your organisation will claim going rates for you.

Otherwise unless you are lucky enough to be in an organisation that does really really well from donations its shoestring time.

 

[northernhord]

Title says it all. I have been back at work for 3.5 hours and hate it to fucking death already.

I'm sick of the daily grind for pennies, not being paid what I'm worth, and would like to do something more worthwhile.

Point me in the direction of public sector vacancy boards please, Northern ones, not fussy which ones as I just want to see what's out there for now


Ta all

www.jobs-nw.co.uk

 

[Guineveretoo]

Yes - I've only ever worked in the public sector and for charities (except for a brief 3-month stint at a hellish web design agency - never again!). And I would wholeheardedly say that the charity sector is much more chillin and less stressy than say, the NHS or local government. Same kind of salaries, too.

Charities rock!

In my experience as a trade unionist with members working in charities, a lot of them not only pay very badly, but treat their workers really badly, too!

I have always thought that charities were amongst the worst employers in the country, in many ways, alongside trade unions, who also treat their workers really badly!

I theorise that it is partly because both organisations are run by volunteer do-gooders who don't really know what they are doing, but also because there is
a belief that working for a charity or a trade union is a vocation, not a job, so money is less important, and terms and conditions are crap

 

[han]

In my experience as a trade unionist with members working in charities, a lot of them not only pay very badly, but treat their workers really badly, too!

I have always thought that charities were amongst the worst employers in the country, in many ways, alongside trade unions, who also treat their workers really badly!

I theorise that it is partly because both organisations are run by volunteer do-gooders who don't really know what they are doing, but also because there is
a belief that working for a charity or a trade union is a vocation, not a job, so money is less important, and terms and conditions are crap

Really?! Well obviously you have more experience in the charity sector than me then, but from my experience working in charities I've found them to be very good and caring employers. I've only worked in v small charities though. I have heard that large charities are much like corporations in the way they treat their staff - ie - shite.

I wonder if your negative experience of charities could be due to the fact that people only tend to join unions when they start to get pissed off with work and want to sort something out? People don't tend to contact unions when they're having a grand time, do they!

 

[marty21]

Me and Magic Sam are civil servants and are paid less than those doing the same job in the private sector. Civil Service payrises this year are less than 2% I believe this is the same for NHS and teachers too. If you find some well paid jobs let me know!

i was lucky with a pay rise this year, got 5% but i have no guaranteed pay rise, they only give me a pay rise if the average wage for my role has increased in the sector, making it very possible for the big housing associations to have a cosy cartel and keep down the salaries ( i have no evidence that they actually do this and i have only been in this role a year) i also got a 5% performance related bonus - some people here get up to 12.5%

 

[Guineveretoo]

Really?! Well obviously you have more experience in the charity sector than me then, but from my experience working in charities I've found them to be very good and caring employers. I've only worked in v small charities though. I have heard that large charities are much like corporations in the way they treat their staff - ie - shite.

I wonder if your negative experience of charities could be due to the fact that people only tend to join unions when they start to get pissed off with work and want to sort something out? People don't tend to contact unions when they're having a grand time, do they!

This is, of course, true, but it is not simply based on what members have told me, but also based on my experience of dealing with charities as employers when things have gone wrong.

Perhaps you have been in the fortunate position of never having had things go wrong for you. Do you have any experience of charities dealing with disciplinary or grievance matters?

My experience is from small charities. The larger ones would tend to employ personnel specialists, who at least know the rules, regulations and laws as they relate to employees!

 

[ymu]

Yeh I know Guin - think you've misunderstood what I was saying. I meant I have already talked to people who I know, who work in the public sector and they say different to people who have replied on HERE that are in the public sector

I've been public sector all but the first 6 months of my working life, and a brief break filling in at a pizza place (still one of my fave jobs ever).

Upsides are good holidays (some places auto-shut down for a period over Crimbo and Easter), probably more flexibility over working hours, no dress code unless you deal with the public (saves a fortune), and even if you're earning fuck all you can feel good about what you do. Used to be good pensions, but if you didn't sign up 10-15 years ago, no chance of that now.

Downsides are stultifying bureaucracy which cares only about process, whilst you and your colleagues only care about outcomes. Middle management can be very good, but they're totally powerless to change pay or grades or anything else much so they either have to find ways around it, or get ground down themselves. (The best ones say "take all the training you can get, ask us and we'll pay for it if we can, then go off and get a decent salary somewhere else").

I hate the bureaucracy so much that I'm now quasi-self-employed but doing the same job - it insulates me from them quite nicely. I'm ridiculously lucky though - I've had some brilliantly creative managers over the years and the cards just fell right.

I'd definitely recommend going into an area where the outcomes-oriented staff have goals they care about and special expertise to achieve them. Not only will you learn more and get great opportunities to develop a career, you'll find a lot more willingness to circumvent the bureaucrats.

Whatever you do, don't join the bureaucracy!

 

[han]

Perhaps you have been in the fortunate position of never having had things go wrong for you. Do you have any experience of charities dealing with disciplinary or grievance matters?

Yes, I guess I have been fortunate in that respect, and no I haven't had any experience of disciplinary/grievance procedures. Have you found the smaller charities to do things that are against the law in that respect?

 

[sojourner]

Just to add another thank you to all the helpful links and info posted - am planning a good sift through them all at the weekend

 

[Guineveretoo]

Yes, I guess I have been fortunate in that respect, and no I haven't had any experience of disciplinary/grievance procedures. Have you found the smaller charities to do things that are against the law in that respect?

I have found that many of the smaller charities are ignorant of the law, and believe they can't afford to seek specialist advice when they want to act against a member of staff, so end up doing things which are illegal.

Other ones, who do get advice, are simply too harsh on their employees, believing that they cannot afford to allow any leeway, and seek to dismiss people on a first offence rather than provide training and support, or find out why the problems are occurring etc.

 

[ICB]

My experience is basically the opposite of missfran's, I moved from the private sector to public and although I'm paid a lot less and don't have things like a company car I am much more appreciated, work much shorter hours, have more job satisfaction, a great quality of life for the kids, flexibility around Shmu's career, etc. etc.

However, my recruitment was part of a drive to bring private sector middle managers in to make a difference to the culture and practices; I joined at the same time as a shit-hot HR manager from the banking sector and we run rings around the executive having changed just about every policy and every major system in the last 3 years. Also, this is a small authority, I went for an interview at a CBC and decided it looked fucking miserable.

In general you get less money but shorter hours and more of a "work to rule" mentality (the mantra "it's not in my job description" can drive me mad sometimes) and more consciousness of unions, etc. Personally I greatly prefer public service to adding shareholder value.

My, and Shmu's, experience of the 3rd sector would back up Guineveretoo's comments, unfortunately.

 

[Prince Rhyus]

We're going through a HR transformation process at the moment - infact a departmental one.

I'm about to transfer into it after my first placement in a policy area (that seems to have put me in touch with lots of people departmentwise.)

I've found myself in the fortunate position of being an in-service fast-streamer with a strong background in both the unions (former branch organiser before my transfer to London) and nearly 3 years as an admin officer. (I.e. with a structured career path with quite steep pay increases towards senior management but enough of a grounding to know what the effects of badly formulated policy can be.)

I'm in the process of making a big push on "effective management" as this is something that my department is currently not very good at but something that but is something that I've been developing lots of ideas about and have been bouncing them off of people of all grades and backgrounds.

As for wanting to move into the public sector, I agree with what lots of other people have said - there are large areas that are poorly paid and where staff are badly treated - and this reflects badly on the organisation and doesn't help those who depend on them.

There are also other areas where people are simply not qualified to do the senior management jobs that they are paid to do, or where the organisation structure is so dysfunctional it stops the organisation from delivering what it is there to deliver.

As the public sector is massive, depending on what your skills are, try to be selective in where you go for. Look for something that is a developing or growing area (Olympics) and stay away from backwaters or things that appear to be scaling down (Regional assemblies).