How many things are there?

[fudgefactorfive]

I think it's Vikram Seth's "A Suitable Boy" where one of the characters is wandering around a party peopled by slightly pompous philosophers, and they each in turn inform him that the nature of the universe is four-fold, three-fold, dual, unity and nothingness, in turn.

What's your take? Gotta be One for me.

("Hrair" is a term used by English rabbits, meaning "more than four" or "uncountable").

 

[JHE]

2.6

 

[danny la rouge]

It doesn't make sense to me, sorry.

In a forced choice situation I'd say the nature of the universe is like a leveret at play, while the shepherd drinks new wine under a banyan tree.

 

[yield]

I like danny la rouge's answer.

It's a complicated question. Not sure if it's reducible to arithmetic.

Take the example of Christianity it's Monotheistic based on Dualistic philosophy (good & evil, body & soul, matter & spirit, object & subject) but with reverence for a Holy Trinity.

 

[gentlegreen]

Two - happy and sad - though mostly I can only manage "OK".

 

[ricbake]

Two - happy and sad - though mostly I can only manage "OK".

Well perhaps thats 3 then....................

 

[ricbake]

I'm with the rabbits

 

[bluestreak]

one.

when it comes down to it absolutely everything can be identified as unified matter, commonly known as 'stuff'.

 

[Flavour]

The answer's obvious:

3.14159 26535 89793 23846 26433 83279 50288 41971 69399 37510 58209 74944 59230 78164 06286 20899 86280 34825 34211 70679 82148 08651 32823 06647 09384 46095 50582 23172 53594 08128 48111 74502 84102 70193 85211 05559 64462 29489 54930 38196 44288 10975 66593 34461 28475 64823 37867 83165 27120 19091 45648 56692 34603 48610 45432 66482 13393 60726 02491 41273 72458 70066 06315 58817 48815 20920 96282 92540 91715 36436 78925 90360 01133 05305 48820 46652 13841 46951 94151 16094 33057 27036 57595 91953 09218 61173 81932 61179 31051 18548 07446 23799 62749 56735 18857 52724 89122 79381 83011 94912 98336 73362 44065 66430 86021 39494 63952 24737 19070 21798 60943 70277 05392 17176 29317 67523 84674 81846 76694 05132 00056 81271 45263 56082 77857 71342 75778 96091 73637 17872 14684 40901 22495 34301 46549 58537 10507 92279 68925 89235 42019 95611 21290 21960 86403 44181 59813 62977 47713 09960 51870 72113 49999 99837 29780 49951 05973 17328 16096 31859 50244 59455 34690 83026 42522 30825 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and so on

 

[8ball]

That may be right.

I'd say you need at least 3 things.

1) The 'thing'
2) The 'stuff' the 'thing' is in.
3) The code determining how the different unfoldings of the 'thing' interact with each other, and how their behaviour is determined by their configuration in the 'stuff'.

The .14159 . . . is probably the stuff it all comes packed in.

 

[CNT36]

Yeah and it tastes good.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

42

 

[samk]

The more you look, the more you find

 

[frogwoman]

there's an infinite number of things. whats a thing anyway?

 

[8ball]

there's an infinite number of things.?

Don't be silly.

whats a thing anyway?

This is where it gets tricky.

 

[kyser_soze]

One - Everything

You can't have nothing cos that implies an absence of anything.

 

[8ball]

Is an 'absence' not a 'thing' now?

 

[118118]

Nothing is not a "thing". That would lead to intractable philosophical difficulties inclusing "God being better than a ham sandhwich" or something like that. Sartre believed in two mutually defining things anyway.

Believe me.

 

[kyser_soze]

God being better than a ham sandhwich

At this moment in time a ham sandwich would be better than God...

 

[guinnessdrinker]

At this moment in time a ham sandwich would be better than God...

it definitely has more practical uses

 

[8ball]

Hence nothing is a thing.

QED.

<vanishes in puff of logic>

 

[fudgefactorfive]

there's more than one kind of nothing, but they are both ultimately still the same Thing - ie. stuff

 

[Flavour]

the word thing loses its meaning then..., if nothing is a thing

 

[118118]

Do you means how many categories of substances there are? As far as I can tell (I'm trying to work out what a category error is) erm a category is the fundamental way of dividing some subject matter. Whereas a substance is that which makes a subject matter real (substance is unchanging). So there are no substances means that nothing is real and nothing subsists. Which seems like a conundrum because unreality would subsist wouldn't it?

If I've defined these wrong then someone should say.

 

[118118]

And no you can't deny that you exist

 

[bluestreak]

the word thing loses its meaning then..., if nothing is a thing

not at all.

"what have you got there?"

"nothing"

the above exchange is clearly logical, and shows how the absence of something is itself a thing, as understood even by small children.

 

[118118]

If the meaning of being is movement into presence then something can be nothing. But nothing can't be something.

 

[Flavour]

it isn't that logical an answer... if you take it literally. except in mathematics when people say nothing they don't really mean nothing

what is it?

nothing.

WRONG

 

[fudgefactorfive]

there's the kind of nothing you have when there isn't anything there in a specified place - we haven't got that kind, because there IS always something no matter where you look - in fact, especially where you look

there's also the kind of nothing you have when there isn't any place for there to be nothing in - but there never has been any kind of nothing like that because there has always been a place for things to be in, or indeed not be in

so you're left with just one thing - the stuff

 

[fudgefactorfive]

Take the example of Christianity it's Monotheistic based on Dualistic philosophy (good & evil, body & soul, matter & spirit, object & subject) but with reverence for a Holy Trinity.

yes ... but but but

there is One God, but he is Three in One, a bit like the Hindu Trinity except not

however presumably the essence of each of the three is spirit, it can't be matter - the Son may have been clothed in matter for a while but it's a temporary thing like putting on a hat

some fringe Christians do definitely speak in terms of human spirit (soul) being a piece or aspect of the One God

so for Christians, and I stand to be corrected on this but I presume Jews and Muslims as well, the fundamental division is really dualist - spirit and matter