How do you feel about cycle lanes?

[fredfelt]

Yes, they often look like that in Holland. But they only work as the bike gets priority. Making cycle lanes on roundabouts like that in England is just stupid until the law changes giving bikes priority over cars (or I think it works in Holland as the driver has assumed responsibility in the event of an accident - this effectively means bikes have priority)

 

[beeboo]

that's how they look here. However, car drivers have to give priority to cyclists. It's engrained in their mindsets when on the road.

Well in the example of a roundabout this priority is already established - drivers entering the roundabout should give priority to anyone - car or bike - already on the roundabout.

However, the risk is always that the driver is blind to the cyclist being there. Or that the driver exiting the roundabout doesn't see the cyclist to their left in a blind spot.

It's not about the "rules of the road" (who has priority over whom) - it's that drivers aren't perfect and cycles are easy to miss.

As a cyclist you therefore need to make yourself visible, particularly at times when you're most vulnerable, and meekly trundling along the bit of road that has a bit of green paint on it often isn't the best way to do it.

 

[gentlegreen]

As a cyclist you therefore need to make yourself visible, particularly at times when you're most vulnerable, and meekly trundling along the bit of road that has a bit of green paint on it often isn't the best way to do it.

There's a mini roundabout on the way home where some moron actually clipped me once - so I tend to ride right over the raised bump to make myself more noticeable.

It's been very difficult to stop myself doing that when I've been driving a car....

http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=7490331&postcount=609

 

[teuchter]

Having done a bit of cycling in the Netherlands, I found them quite good there. I think segregated ones work well alongside busy, fast roads. In areas without space for proper segregated bike lines then I'd agree with the comments that it's better if everyone shares the roadspace, rather than cyclists being forced into narrow lanes at the side.

The mindset of car drivers is certainly significant; this varies from country to country and that's why what works in one place won't necessarily work in another.

 

[beeboo]

Yes, they often look like that in Holland. But they only work as the bike gets priority. Making cycle lanes on roundabouts like that in England is just stupid until the law changes giving bikes priority over cars (or I think it works in Holland as the driver has assumed responsibility in the event of an accident - this effectively means bikes have priority)

But in the kind of accidents I'm talking about, the car driver would be responsible under current UK law anyway. But that's not much comfort when you're knocked off your bike.

I don't think it's to do with the rules/laws as much as the fact that in Holland you have so many cyclists that the chance of encountering a cyclist must always be front of mind for Dutch drivers. Whereas I think here the big problem is that car drivers just tend not to factor cyclists into their driving.

 

[lighterthief]

I like cycle lanes and prefer to use them - as long as they are clearly marked, well maintained and thoughtfully implemented, with the safety of cyclists in mind. Unfortunately a lot in the UK are implemented in a very slapdash fashion and motorists seem to poorly understand this; there is an expectation that if there is a cycle lane then cyclists must use it, which can often be more dangerous.

 

[Upchuck]

Cycle lanes are good but ffs cyclists ride in them, not on the outside next to me on my scooter. You get in the fucking way!

 

[ATOMIC SUPLEX]

The only truly good one in london i can think of is on blackfriar's bridge. nice and wide.

Gets a bit mucky at the end but better than the old one that funneled you into a killing zone.

 

[Boris Sprinkler]

Short (part 1) documentary about cycling here and the policy towards cycling and improving conditions for cyclists.

 

[teuchter]

You get in the fucking way!

Exemplary approach here.

 

[gentlegreen]

Short (part 1) documentary about cycling here and the policy towards cycling and improving conditions for cyclists.

*gives up French and starts learning Danish*

 

[Crispy]

Cycle lanes are good but ffs cyclists ride in them, not on the outside next to me on my scooter. You get in the fucking way!

I find that most cycle lanes are barely wider than the actual bike. If I ride in them, cars treat the white line as the edge of the road and woosh past with inches to spare. Therefore, I will not ride in most cycle lanes, but instead ride a safe distance from the kerb. Sorry if this makes you 30 seconds late for your emergency organ donor delivery.

 

[snowy_again]

Cycle lanes are good but ffs cyclists ride in them, not on the outside next to me on my scooter. You get in the fucking way!

No! They're not compulsory and they're full of the shit that gets washed off the road. And there's a heap of other constructive criticisms outlined above (bad planning, doors etc. that you appear to have ignored).

You get in the way more than I do. Just cos you've bought a hairdryer on wheels, it doesn't give you priority does it?!

 

[gentlegreen]

hairdryer on wheels,

I'm more and more bemused by people always wanting to attach motors to a near-perfect machine. Several electric bikes have started appearing at work.

I'm guessing Upchuck is old (over 90), infirm, or has to commute over 5 miles ... (??)

 

[Upchuck]

I am sick of finding cyclists on my outside when I am riding the scooter. It's dangerous. Regardless of what you think you are not a motorised vehicle. I have respect for cyclists on the road but know your place. I never ride up the inside as I know that's where the cyclists belong. Having them next to me at traffic lights is unnerving, particuarly when there are some on the inside and some on the outside. You can't have all the road.

 

[Wolveryeti]

I am sick of finding cyclists on my outside when I am riding the scooter. It's dangerous. Regardless of what you think you are not a motorised vehicle. I have respect for cyclists on the road but know your place. I never ride up the inside as I know that's where the cyclists belong. Having them next to me at traffic lights is unnerving, particuarly when there are some on the inside and some on the outside. You can't have all the road.

Sorry to break it to you but the road is for everyone. You don't get to reserve a place. You may think the outside lane is 'yours'. But you'd be wrong.

 

[Upchuck]

I don't 'think the outside lane is mine' but you must agree that it is dangerous to have a cyslist in the middle of the road in traffic. The worst is when I come across from Eldershot St (?) at Euston Rd crossing to the start of Southampton Row. I find cyclists palnted on the middle white line next to me on the outside. There are two lanes but they merge into one on the otherside. So you can have cyclists-bus-scoter/car-cyclists. It is dangerous and arrogant.

 

[cybertect]

Having them next to me at traffic lights is unnerving, particuarly when there are some on the inside and some on the outside.

Well, you shouldn't have plonked your scooter in the middle of an Advance Stop Box, then

 

[gentlegreen]

I am sick of finding cyclists on my outside when I am riding the scooter. It's dangerous. Regardless of what you think you are not a motorised vehicle. I have respect for cyclists on the road but know your place. I never ride up the inside as I know that's where the cyclists belong. Having them next to me at traffic lights is unnerving, particuarly when there are some on the inside and some on the outside. You can't have all the road.

You're slower than a cyclist ?

 

[Wolveryeti]

Maybe your experience is different to mine, Upchuck. Mostly I find cyclists *do* stick to the left hand side of the road. Its just that when traffic is snarled up, a few (as is their right, imo) overtake on the right as they become the fastest moving vehicle. Then when the traffic starts up again they are stuck there for a bit.

 

[Upchuck]

Well, you shouldn't have plonked your scooter in the middle of an Advance Stop Box, then

There's no advance box at Euston Rd.

 

[cybertect]

You posted that later.

Anyhow, I had my tongue firmly in my cheek.

 

[snowy_again]

I have respect for cyclists on the road but know your place.

lolz etc.

 

[roryer]

You can see the standards to which the LCN+ lanes are designed in this wonderful document: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/businessandpartners/lcds_chapter4.pdf

IMO the design standards in the UK are poor, and the implementation usually even worse.

What we need on major busy roads is a completely segregated cycling network with priority at junctions in the same way as in Holland or Denmark. We need traffic calmed residential streets which make 10-15mph an effective maximum speed and a pan urban 20mph limit.

We need shared space in all shopping streets which make 5mph an effective limit for all traffic other than bus lanes which would be the only segregated mode.

 

[teuchter]

I don't 'think the outside lane is mine' but you must agree that it is dangerous to have a cyslist in the middle of the road in traffic. The worst is when I come across from Eldershot St (?) at Euston Rd crossing to the start of Southampton Row. I find cyclists palnted on the middle white line next to me on the outside. There are two lanes but they merge into one on the otherside. So you can have cyclists-bus-scoter/car-cyclists. It is dangerous and arrogant.

I don't understand why a bike in any particular position is any more or less dangerous than a scooter in that position.

 

[snowy_again]

Its probably cos Upchuck can't see whilst riding in the rain with thier visor down...

 

[teuchter]

Its probably cos Upchuck can't see whilst riding in the rain with thier visor down...

 

[Upchuck]

That's not funny

 

[mauvais]

I don't 'think the outside lane is mine' but you must agree that it is dangerous to have a cyslist in the middle of the road in traffic. The worst is when I come across from Eldershot St (?) at Euston Rd crossing to the start of Southampton Row. I find cyclists palnted on the middle white line next to me on the outside. There are two lanes but they merge into one on the otherside. So you can have cyclists-bus-scoter/car-cyclists. It is dangerous and arrogant.

Sorry but this is total cock.

Cyclists have just as much right to take primary position and filter in traffic as you do, if not more so. If they're considerably slower than you whilst preventing you overtaking on the right, then perhaps you have a point, but only then.

 

[Upchuck]

Tbf they should make up their minds. Ride in the cycle lane, ride in the traffic, or ride on the outside. You can't have everything. If they are the cycle lane or general traffic than you know where to look for and where to expect them. Filtering on the outside is not what's expected and is dangerous and I imagine quite a few are knocked off.