Discussion in 'Brixton' started by choochi, Jun 9, 2014.
They also don’t pay business rates.
Yes, how could their execs in Haiti pay for so many hookers without all the hours that volunteers put in ?
I'm not sure if you are saying that my pointing out that it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer is, amounts to "right wing bollox".
I'm not criticising what the Living Wage Foundation does; I'm saying there's limitations to what the accreditation can tell you. Yes it's good to set a figure on some kind of rational basis that is higher than the minimum wage, and it's good to give companies an incentive to pay that.
I see that Lidl isn't accredited by the way. Why's that - is it because of other employment policies they apply? The knowledge that they pay the living wage influences your decision to shop with them, but is it at the expense of other aspects of their employees' employment deals?
Earlier today I was looking at a website where employees rate their employers. Tesco for example gets a better rating than Lidl.
Lidl Reviews | Glassdoor.co.uk
I don't know really if these ratings are representative. But it's always a problem if you pick out one aspect of something; focus on that can distract from other questions. I'm sure the Living Wage Foundation are very aware of this and do what they can to mitigate it. Doesn't mean it's not a problem though.
Full on Morris Dancing action around Herne Hill tonight!
Tonight! Brixton Tatterjacks Morris dancers on the loose in Herne Hill from 7.30pm, Thurs 5th July
Im not at all clear what you want me to support.
I often get the impression I get seen here as some kind of out of touch leftie ( not how I see myself) . So I support Living Wage Foundation moderate demands and now I'm not at radical enough.
See your banned so will leave it at this.
I don't see you as an out of touch leftie....
Most of this LLW debate, interesting as it, is isn't about Herne Hill.
I have shopped local in Herne Hill and Brixton whenever I can. Yes I shop in Lidl, but I also shop in Sainsburys just because its nearby. I purposely avoid shopping with Amazon and I dislike shopping on line in general.
For years - even when I've had very little money, I made sure I did my best to support local small shops and businesses. There were more empty shops than not in Herne Hill when I first moved here and it was quiet, dull and bleak, with very sense of community or stuff going on. Now all the units are full, there's a market, there's a film festival and life on the street. I've never been able to drive and I value having places near by where I can shop easily, where I might see people I know and bump into my neighbours, it helps me feel at home here.
and I'm looking forward to some quality ice cream soon.
On Lidl. Appears they are paying Living Wage. According to Living Wage Foundation website. It does appear they haven't gone through the whole accreditation process.
Lidl to become first supermarket to pay Living Wage | Living Wage Foundation
Interesting YouGov article on how there reputation has gone up. So paying Living Wage can do company good.
YouGov | Lidl’s pay increase should play well with consumers
Not being "accredited" is an issue. Looks like Lidl didn't go through whole process.
The LLW page has a whole heap of business economic arguments for paying LLW or the regional equivalent. Intentionally their campaign focus is on FTSE 250 companies and large employers like local authorities.
Despite the stupid tabloid oxfam bashing posted earlier, third sector orgs are over represented on the current accredited list here: Living Wage Employers by Region | Living Wage Foundation compared to smes or big corps / public bodies.
They don’t lobby cottage industries like the one which prompted this sudden interest in HH. When I last spoke to them (my employer pays LLW and I only take grant funding from people who do too), they were clear that start up businesses should aim for LLW but as a mid term goal, not a reason to not to start or employ anyone at all. That’s a more strategic, experienced campaigners approach based on what works to deliver system change over glib soundbites.
We shouldn’t confuse LLW accreditation as a wider sign of ethical business - there’s a whole bunch of LLW payers who I wouldn’t touch with a barge pole; from the likes of top 4 management consultancies (KPMG etc) to big pharma like GSK. They amongst other people I wouldn’t share a pint with sit on the LLW advisory board as I think I’ve said before.
So as usual, we’ve focussed on one small new cottage business and not asked why our loacal authority, the shops we frequent or the pubs promoted on this site don’t even meet the salary he’s offering.
I've started a Living Wage thread in politics if anyone is interested. Can we stop the debate here unless its Herne Hill related.
Lambeth does and it makes sure its contractors do as far as I know. The Brixton Rec is managed by GLL/ Better and it does in Lambeth. Including cleaners.
This is the "whataboutery" argument.
I never have.
What I say is that Living Wage is straightforward issue.
People work they should get living wage.
That's not glib.
Its not about being ethical. Its about real life.
It might be ok for you to go on about KMPG etc and complain. But back in the real world having LLW as ones hourly rate means a big deal.
Oxfam warned it could lose European funding over scandal
"Stupid tabloid bashing"
So you don't think it's serious issue?
According to this report half accredited Living Wage business are SMEs
AFAIAC ‘the whataboutery’ is not an unreasonable or invalid line of discussion at all. The only possible reason in my view to mention that an incoming business does not pay the LLW is surely to highlight that fact as a negative, and suggest to prospective customers who read this forum that they could consider spending their money elsewhere. That’s not something I have a problem with btw.
But if in the same forum other businesses that also are said to fail to pay the LLW are given a free ride if not actually promoted on a regular basis, then questioning the consistency of such behaviour is more than perfectly valid, and by no means necessarily motivated by agendas, beef or anything suchlike.
I think most of us have so much of a good time in pubs, bars and clubs we are prepared to cut those who don’t pay the LLW far more slack than we would to other businesses. Therefore I don’t think it’s very fair to highlight the fact that a certain business like the ice cream guys moving into HH does not pay the LLW while others that are also guilty of it are constantly given a free ride here.
In fact, one could argue that chain pubs and bars that are part of big breweries/ companies that have far more capital and financial security than the likes of small ice cream companies should be the first target of any LLW campaigns, before small businesses could me too the spotlight .
Ive covered this issue in post 2220.
Living wage thread is here, Living Wage
Can we not have this thread descend into a bunfight as well?
Was this advice from the London Living Wage Foundation themselves?
Separate names with a comma.