Help with a dissertation! What is art?

[Santino]

Its easy for a scientist to say science is the only thing- and its equally fashionable for the artist to say art is the only thing. Maybe it is only the only thing, when art is all things. It may feel like a Nothing word in when we see how far it can reach- but thats an more of a verbal illusion. Art, like most things still means something, as well as nothing.

Those fridge magnet poetry kits are great, aren't they?

 

[fractionMan]

I can see you cruising all the way to a 3rd if you try and write any of that shit down and submit it iam.

 

[ohmyliver]

What do you think about art?

Well, I like it, I some times create it, I sometimes write about it

What is an exhibition space?

a space that is used to display artwork. There is too much variation in exibition spaces for anyother definition to work


What makes something art?

when the right people call it art. I don't mean 'right' in an eliteist sence, more that when people in the artworld define something as 'art' then thats what makes it 'art', compare block of bricks left by builders on a building site to Equivalent VIII by Carl Andre, essentially the same object/structure but one is high art and the other isn't. There is nothing inherant within a piece of 'art' that makes it 'art' see Dickie's institutional theory of art http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_theory_of_art http://www9.georgetown.edu/faculty/irvinem/visualarts/Institutional-theory-artworld.html


Is everything in art galeries art?

yes


Can anyone make art?

yes, of course.

Can anything become art?

yes, of course

What is the most intrestering/innovate object/sound/thing/experience yoyu have occoured recently?

Thats a good question as I'm getting a bit bored by contempory art. I want art that grabs me like a 3 chord punk riff, or moves me like the power of Aretha's gospel singing, rather than what is the modern equivilant of things you'd see at travelling Victorian Novelty shows,

I've put things inside the quote, as it's easier to answer that way

 

[ohmyliver]

Oh and most aesthetic theories/theories of art tend to be little more than 'why what I think is art, actually is art' or 'why I'm more qualified to decide what art is than you' arguements.

 

[Aldebaran]

I'm art. I'm an artwork of Nature (I would say God, but I respect the sensitivities of the majority on this board). So are you.

salaam.

 

[Dillinger4]

No, go on, say God. I don't mind.

 

[Aldebaran]

Yes, but then it gets derailed to discussions about God=Nature and the likes

salaam.

 

[Cid]

Yes, because I would say that nature is incapable of creating art due to my belief that art is a conscious expression of concept/belief etc. Kind of applies whether you call it nature or God though Alde, so knock yourself out and say God...

 

[i-am-your-idea]

do you have to believe in god to describe a living thing as art?

 

[Cid]

If art implies some kind of conscious thought (and I believe it does), then yes.

 

[i-am-your-idea]

im mostly unconcious when i draw

 

[The Groke]

im mostly unconcious when i draw

You seem to be mostly unconscious when you post on Urban too.

 

[Dillinger4]

mostly.

 

[Santino]

im mostly unconcious when i draw

False.

 

[The Groke]

mostly.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

False.

How so? This seems plausible to me. We can do lots of things without our conscious minds, as long as we are well practised. Playing a musical instrument would be another example. When was the last time you were conscious of what your hand was doing while using a knife and fork?

 

[Santino]

How so? This seems plausible to me. We can do lots of things without our conscious minds, as long as we are well practised. Playing a musical instrument would be another example. When was the last time you were conscious of what your hand was doing while using a knife and fork?

People who are asleep are unconscious.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

People who are asleep are unconscious.

Semantics difference. She's using the word to mean something different.

 

[butchersapron]

Surrealism. Some surrealism.

 

[In Bloom]

How so? This seems plausible to me. We can do lots of things without our conscious minds, as long as we are well practised. Playing a musical instrument would be another example. When was the last time you were conscious of what your hand was doing while using a knife and fork?

Not thinking about the exact mechanics of what you're doing and being unconcious are two different things. I don't need to think about the Kreb cycle in order to breathe in and out, I still wouldn't say that I'm "mostly unconcious when I breathe", because that would be fucking stupid.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Not thinking about the exact mechanics of what you're doing and being unconcious are two different things. I don't need to think about the Kreb cycle in order to breathe in and out, I still wouldn't say that I'm "mostly unconcious when I breathe", because that would be fucking stupid.

You could say that you were mostly unconscious of your breathing, though, and that would not be stupid. I took her meaning to be obvious, that she was mostly unconscious of drawing when she drew. You're nit-picking.

 

[ohmyliver]

Yes, because I would say that nature is incapable of creating art due to my belief that art is a conscious expression of concept/belief etc. Kind of applies whether you call it nature or God though Alde, so knock yourself out and say God...

I'd say that nature is incapable of creating art, because art is only art when humans call it art.

 

[ohmyliver]

Not thinking about the exact mechanics of what you're doing and being unconcious are two different things. I don't need to think about the Kreb cycle in order to breathe in and out, I still wouldn't say that I'm "mostly unconcious when I breathe", because that would be fucking stupid.

Indeed, and alot of the practice of abstract expressionism relies on letting the process take over, putting the conscous mind to the back of the creative process. Being lost in the act of creation as it were (which, frankly is the best feeling ever). It's a different form of conciousness.

 

[butchersapron]

This is why i mentioned surrealism -things like automatic writing and drawing were attempts to create something through stripping away as much concious control as possible.

 

[ohmyliver]

This is why i mentioned surrealism -things like automatic writing and drawing were attempts to create something through stripping away as much concious control as possible.

Indeed. It's interesting that people draw from life better when they stop obsessing of the drawing, and concentrate on the looking (if you look at someone who is skilled at drawing, drawing from life, they'll spend about 80% of the time looking at what they are drawing, rather then their drawing)... I guess its part of the same thing.

 

[Jonti]

The Conundrum of the Workshops

Here's a little something from a writer who won the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1907.

When the flush of a newborn sun fell first on Eden’s green and gold,
Our father Adam sat under the Tree and scratched with a stick in the mold;
And the first rude sketch that the world had seen was joy to his mighty heart,
Till the Devil whispered behind the leaves: "It’s pretty, but is it Art?"

Wherefore he called to his wife and fled to fashion his work anew--
The first of his race who cared a fig for the first, most dread review;
And he left his lore to the use of his sons--and that was a glorious gain
When the Devil chuckled: "Is it Art?" in the ear of the branded Cain.

They builded a tower to shiver the sky and wrench the stars apart,
Till the Devil grunted behind the bricks: "It’s striking, but is it Art?"
The stone was dropped by the quarry-side, and the idle derrick swung,
While each man talked of the aims of art, and each in an alien tongue.

They fought and they talked in the north and the south, they talked and they fought in the west,
Till the waters rose on the jabbering land, and the poor Red Clay had rest--
Had rest till the dank blank-canvas dawn when the dove was preened to start,
And the Devil bubbled below the keel: "It’s human, but is it Art?"

The tale is old as the Eden Tree--as new as the new-cut tooth--
For each man knows ere his lip-thatch grows he is master of Art and Truth;
And each man hears as the twilight nears, to the beat of his dying heart,
The Devil drum on the darkened pane: "You did it, but was it Art?"

We have learned to whittle the Eden Tree to the shape of a surplice-peg,
We have learned to bottle our parents twain in the yolk of an addled egg,
We know that the tail must wag the dog, as the horse is drawn by the cart;
But the Devil whoops, as he whooped of old: "It’s clever, but is it Art?"

When the flicker of London’s sun falls faint on the club-room’s green and gold,
The sons of Adam sit them down and scratch with their pens in the mold--
They scratch with their pens in the mold of their graves, and the ink and the anguish start
When the Devil mutters behind the leaves: "It’s pretty, but is it art?"

Now, if we could win to the Eden Tree where the four great rivers flow,
And the wreath of Eve is red on the turf as she left it long ago,
And if we could come when the sentry slept, and softly scurry through,
By the favor of God we might know as much--as our father Adam knew.

 

[i-am-your-idea]

love it! have forwarded it to my flatmate.

shes doing an art project on this subject as well the dissertation now...

 

[Cid]

This is why i mentioned surrealism -things like automatic writing and drawing were attempts to create something through stripping away as much concious control as possible.

This is not a lack of consciousness though, it's more uncontrolled consciousness; hence the language of dreams, catharsis etc... Subconscious, yes, unconscious, definite no.

ohmyliver - that's basically what I was saying; art implies a conscious expression; the only creatures we know of that are capable of that are humans, but that doesn't mean that in some far off galaxy 6gjqelkTTTT4823plrrdd hasn't just taken a fkt7846874hrui3g beast, cut it in half, frozen it and sold it for 18,000,000 tentacles of helium.

 

[Paulie Tandoori]

What do you think about art?

<snip>Can anything become art?

What is the most intrestering/innovate object/sound/thing/experience yoyu have occoured recently?

Or as an investment.

I don't think that's art, I think that's kitsch. Same as for those who do it but for political purposes.

I was refering to the people who make art purely for money and wouldn't bother if they didn't have to earn a living, which makes it 'not art' by your definition.

I start threads and then wander off and ignore them all the time.

I am making a statement about the futility of the human condition.

How so? This seems plausible to me. We can do lots of things without our conscious minds, as long as we are well practised. Playing a musical instrument would be another example. When was the last time you were conscious of what your hand was doing while using a knife and fork?

This is why i mentioned surrealism -things like automatic writing and drawing were attempts to create something through stripping away as much concious control as possible.

love it! have forwarded it to my flatmate.

shes doing an art project on this subject as well the dissertation now...

.