hard-fi crap/not crap

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

They sound like they've been listening to a lot of Clash records. I'm sure there are a few bands out there (maybe GYBE/Mogwai/Sigur Ros but even they have retro elements) but I cannot think of one genuinely inventive guitar band at the mo. They make the same old sounds with their instruments, so ALL guitar bands are retro really, cos it's a retro instrument.

I can see what you're saying, although maybe in that case 99% of music is retro...dance music is retro because it uses beats and synthesizers whose lineage goes back to the '70s...and grime is also retro as it's heavily reliant on vocals and rhyming. To me, retro is something that actively attempts to imitate a distinctive style from a bygone period; merely to recreate while bringing nothing new to the table.

Hard-Fi and Maximo Park don't seem to be attempting to imitate anyone or anything in particular - yes, they have their influences but they're essentially classic guitar bands with inspired songs. When the Manics started, and despite my liking their early stuff, every move was meticulously half-inched from The Clash and Guns'n'Roses. Now, Kings Of Leon seem convinced that they're Blue Oyster Cult, pining for sessions on 'The Whistle Test'. Ditto all those bands in the last few years (e.g. Starsailor and the post-'britrock' fallout) who made a point of citing Neil Young's 'After The Goldrush' as their favourite album. A tad suspicious...

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

what, and it's clearly the case that Maximo Park and Hard Fi are the best guitar bands to come out of last year?


Have Arcade Fire, 65 Days of Static and the Books just washed over you then?

Actually, I love The Arcade Fire. And while not wishing to compartmentalise things, they don't strike me as a guitar band per se.

Oh, and they actually released their first EP in 2003.

 

[MysteryGuest]

Idance music is retro because it uses beats and synthesizers whose lineage goes back to the '70s

Don't really agree with that because the way the synths (and filtering etc) are used isn't at all 70s - heavy repetition for example. Plus there are continual refinements to the sounds - you can spot 70s retro sounds, but there are new squiggles and blips being invented and refined all the time in dance music.

so ALL guitar bands are retro really, cos it's a retro instrument.

I mostly agree with that, though have you heard Glenn Branca's Symphony No 3? It's not exactly traditional use of guitars there though - sounds like a universe exploding.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

Don't really agree with that because the way the synths (and filtering etc) are used isn't at all 70s - heavy repetition for example. Plus there are continual refinements to the sounds - you can spot 70s retro sounds, but there are new squiggles and blips being invented and refined all the time in dance music.

To an extent yes, but there's also an awful lot that hasn't really moved on since 1992.

 

[poului]

I mostly agree with that, though have you heard Glenn Branca's Symphony No 3? It's not exactly traditional use of guitars there though - sounds like a universe exploding.

guitars can still be used in an interesting way IMO.

An example is Howard Shore's score for Crash (the Cronenberg film) for seven electric guitars.

Hardly rock, but that's what makes it interesting.

 

[poului]

To an extent yes, but there's also an awful lot that hasn't really moved on since 1992.

small matter of the rise of personal computers and software, mate.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

small matter of the rise of personal computers and software, mate.

That doesn't make it any better though.

 

[Orang Utan]

I mostly agree with that, though have you heard Glenn Branca's Symphony No 3? It's not exactly traditional use of guitars there though - sounds like a universe exploding.

I haven't though I am aware there are many examples of using guitars in an innovative way, the point is that none of these bands do!

 

[PacificOcean]

I haven't though I am aware there are many examples of using guitars in an innovative way,

Such as an unusual occasional table?

 

[aylee]

I really like the Hard-Fi album .... I certainly agree that it's not original but the songs are well crafted and at least there is some variety of mood, timbre and influence on the album.

I think it's unreasonable to reject music on the ground that it's derivative .... at this stage of the development of popular music, every act you hear can be traced back to something that went before.

Sometimes I just want to listen to some good songs and "Stars of CCTV" has quite a few of those.

 

[MysteryGuest]

I saw this LP by Rhys Chatham in Rough Trade years ago where he'd attached an extractor fan to an electric guitar. Really wish I'd bought it now, just to heard what it sounded like.

 

[Orang Utan]

I think it's unreasonable to reject music on the ground that it's derivative .... at this stage of the development of popular music, every act you hear can be traced back to something that went before.

I think it's entirely reasonable if there is little to distinguish it from anything else.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

Sometimes I just want to listen to some good songs and "Stars of CCTV" has quite a few of those.

Quite so...but I'll be surprised if as many as one of the detractors on this thread has actually heard the album.

 

[MysteryGuest]

All these samey guitar bands actually make me feel kind of itchy in my mind, like a prickly jumper or something. I find it really uncomfortable to hear any of their music.

 

[aylee]

Don't really agree with that because the way the synths (and filtering etc) are used isn't at all 70s - heavy repetition for example. Plus there are continual refinements to the sounds - you can spot 70s retro sounds, but there are new squiggles and blips being invented and refined all the time in dance music.

But surely "new squiggles and blips" of themselves don't make for original-sounding music, any more than adding an extra effect to a guitar sound doesn't usually make a Dave Gilmour-style solo sound new and different. I am no expert on dance music and I'm certainly not going to come up with the usual "it all sounds the same" stuff that many thirty-something rock fans repeat, but when someone plays me an example of a current dance music genre I struggle to hear the distinctions that the person playing it insists are present.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

I saw this LP by Rhys Chatham in Rough Trade years ago where he'd attached an extractor fan to an electric guitar. Really wish I'd bought it now, just to heard what it sounded like.

There's a track on 'Stars Of CCTV' that uses that very technique. Possibly.

 

[MysteryGuest]

But surely "new squiggles and blips" of themselves don't make for original-sounding music, any more than adding an extra effect to a guitar sound doesn't usually make a Dave Gilmour-style solo sound new and different. I am no expert on dance music and I'm certainly not going to come up with the usual "it all sounds the same" stuff that many thirty-something rock fans repeat, but when someone plays me an example of a current dance music genre I struggle to hear the distinctions that the person playing it insists are present.

Well there's a much greater tonal pallette involved with dance, precisely because it's not tied to one particular instrument, ie the guitar.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

But surely "new squiggles and blips" of themselves don't make for original-sounding music, any more than adding an extra effect to a guitar sound doesn't usually make a Dave Gilmour-style solo sound new and different. I am no expert on dance music and I'm certainly not going to come up with the usual "it all sounds the same" stuff that many thirty-something rock fans repeat, but when someone plays me an example of a current dance music genre I struggle to hear the distinctions that the person playing it insists are present.

I think there's a lot of truth in what you've said there about thirtysomethings dismissing everything as sounding the same...not the same hunger or the same passion to become acquainted with the music. I think there are a number of bands who do sound alike (haircut indie; most of the The... bands) but HF and MP - and The Futureheads for that matter - stick out as being markedly different with a sense of creativity often lacking in their ilk. And I say that as a thirtysomething myself.

 

[Tank Girl]

Quite so...but I'll be surprised if as many as one of the detractors on this thread has actually heard the album.

well I haven't, purely because I find his voice irritating and listening to the album would be a stupid thing for me to do.

<protects ears>

please don't hate me acid priest

 

[spanglechick]

Marginally talented guitar pap-pop with irritating singalong bits that increasingly grate with airplay. They're like a McFly for kidults who believe that they're older and more discerning than they actually are.

Give it a year and you'll be hard pressed to remember who they are.

But I'm 31...

Well - I really like them, and while that won't persuade anyone that they've misjudged the band, I thought I should add my voice to the throng. I'm not saying they're the best "indie rock and roll" band around - but if you like pop-flavoured guitar music, I don't really see what the problem is. There are crap bands - I don't see how, having listened to Stars of CCTV and without writing off the whole genre, this is one of them.

 

[BadlyDrawnGirl]

Well there's a much greater tonal pallette involved with dance, precisely because it's not tied to one particular instrument, ie the guitar.

I agree. It's tied to the synthesizer instead.

 

[Orang Utan]

I think there's a lot of truth in what you've said there about thirtysomethings dismissing everything as sounding the same...not the same hunger or the same passion to become acquainted with the music. I think there are a number of bands who do sound alike (haircut indie; most of the The... bands) but HF and MP - and The Futureheads for that matter - stick out as being markedly different with a sense of creativity often lacking in their ilk. And I say that as a thirtysomething myself.

Nah, they all sound the same to me.
Oh, aaah, err

 

[Dubversion]

erm..

the album isn't that bad, i'm ashamed to admit.

 

[MysteryGuest]

I agree. It's tied to the synthesizer instead.

Which has a much great variety of sound...

 

[milesy]

erm..

the album isn't that bad, i'm ashamed to admit.

happy fucking birthday cunt

 

[poului]

erm..

the album isn't that bad, i'm ashamed to admit.

WHAT!?


are you for real?

It sounds like one of the product of one of the losing finalists from a student battle of the bands competition.

 

[Dubversion]

.

:d

 

[rosa]

happy fucking birthday cunt

I'd copyright that slogan before Hallmark nick it.

 

[blamblam]

ccccccccccccccrap!

 

[milesy]

well i've just been listening to clips of all of the album tracks online.

still think they're shit.

and they're definitley trying too hard to sound like the clash on some songs - especailly that "middle eastern" one.

they are far too blokeyshoutyboozy for my liking. i can imagine big gangs of beer-boys down the front at their gigs jumping up and down, pushing everyone over, not liking it when they get pushed back and generally being obnoxious. taht's the sort of image hard-fi put in my head.

i don't like it.

<screws face up and spits like a cat eating lemon>