Hammers To Sign Tevez And Mascherano!??!?!??!?!

[tommers]

It's not the signings you should be upset about. As I've already said they're great signings for West Ham and they should do very well for you. It's the fact that there is clearly more going on here than just two normal transfers.

probably. BUT WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT IS. So to start slinging terms around like "feeder club" is a bit premature.

anyway this seems to make everything clear. They're west ham fans.

What on earth are you ranting about?

Those deals had their terms announced and were all pretty obvious and straightforward transfers. This is like that in no way.

I am "ranting" because G Force put up a possible deal which involved us having to sell these players to anybody who placed a bid of £10 million + and only getting 5% of the fee. when I asked what the problem would be with this you replied that "people" don't want feeder clubs.

How would selling a player to "anybody" make us a feeder club?

Perhaps if West Ham want to stop the speculation then they can release some of the details of the transfers like the rest of the clubs in the premier league. If they don't then you can't blame people for talking about it. It’s two of the strangest transfers I can ever remember and if your club want to keep people in the dark over them then that’s their right but you can’t get all angry with people speculating when it’s the fault of your club that they’re doing so.

blimey. some sense. yes. you're right.

however, I can get angry when people start stating things as fact without ANY FACTS WHATSOEVER purely because "something smells fishy."

And no-one is blaming West Ham for the downfall of football your just making things up.

really?

But in that situation, you'd have to point the finger towards West Ham's board for allowing that kind of thing to gain a foothold in the English game.

Look. It IS fishy. It's as fishy as fuck, believe me I'm in as much shock as you. Yesterday when i saw the newspaper I thought it might be something like we pay £10 million up front and then Corinthians / MSI get 50% or whatever of any future transfer. Why is that any less plausible than any of the other explanations we have heard so far?

Why didn't chelsea just sign them? why go to all this bother? why not farm them out to an italian team? or a spanish team?

More to the point there is absolutely no way that West Ham would stand being the feeder club for Chelsea. If it ever came out that that was what was going on then the place would be burned down and Mr Brown's head would be paraded along green street on a spike.

 

[kained&able]

Umm this pains me to say but im pretty sure west ham have been a feeder club for ages. Its just now instead of youth team players its two world class argies!

But im kinda hopefull that we have just pulled off something ridicuolous.


dave

 

[tommers]

Umm this pains me to say but im pretty sure west ham have been a feeder club for ages. Its just now instead of youth team players its two world class argies!

But im kinda hopefull that we have just pulled off something ridicuolous.


dave

wash your mouth out! we have been a selling club. not a feeder club. there's a world of difference.

anyway.... this seems to give a plausible explanation.

 

[Neva]

I suppose if nothing else I can laugh at Jermain Defoe. Warming the bench at Spurs instead of playing upfront with Tevez? You made the right call there mate

West Ham fans must be pretty confident of finishing above Tottenham now right?

 

[tommers]

West Ham fans must be pretty confident of finishing above Tottenham now right?

spurs are a really, really, big club.

we're only a little tin pot premiership team.

 

[chieftain]

I suppose if nothing else I can laugh at Jermain Defoe. Warming the bench at Spurs instead of playing upfront with Tevez? You made the right call there mate

you still hung up on that one.... its worse that us and Campbellend

West Ham fans must be pretty confident of finishing above Tottenham now right?

you might... lets wait and see how it goes at cardboard towers... good luck

 

[Neva]

I don't support West Ham chieftain.

 

[chieftain]

I don't support West Ham chieftain.

sorry.. I Assumed which is wrong

 

[Balbi]

Nowt wrong with Super Sol now He fucked off Arsenal and all

 

[Diamond]

wash your mouth out! we have been a selling club. not a feeder club. there's a world of difference.

anyway.... this seems to give a plausible explanation.

That's an excellent article and it says everything I suspected might be true about the transfer. Of course it's all still rumour but it's definitely plausible.

The interesting thing to think about is how football would change if this kind of deal became the norm.

In a way it might benefit everyone because a new structure would be introduced for the career of an exceptional player who is not brought up within the academy system of a Big Club.

The investors who would retain the player's registration, or a majority stake in it, would want to see the maximum possible profit from a player. Therefore up to the age of say 28, their interests would lie in seeing the player transferred as many times as possible for maximum profit.

It could lead to a very fluid transfer market whereby players turn out for a succession of ever larger clubs until they finally make the already inevitable transfer to, say, Real Madrid.

If you think about that in a wider context the ramifications would generally favour the smaller clubs. They would pay nominal fees for the right to field an exceptional player for a season or two, which on the face of it presents a far smaller risk both competitively and financially than investing 2.5 million in Steed Malbranque or some other such talented but inconsistent and unexceptional player.

This would break the monopoly the big clubs already have on world-class talent and, over time, would lead to more competitive football.

Ironically despite all the cries of foul play and Chelsea domination, this deal may represent the best chance to undermine the stranglehold of the very biggest clubs. Laying aside any fears over change in football, there's no denying that it is an ingenious transfer. It's brilliantly simple and looks like it'll be fantastically effective.

 

[chieftain]

Steed Malbranque or some other such talented but inconsistent and unexceptional player.

Nice dig...

 

[Neva]

<words>

Your going to have to run that by me again because I think you said that a situation in which clubs can lose all their best players without any say in the matter to whoever has the money is a good thing for the smaller clubs...

 

[Diamond]

Your going to have to run that by me again because I think you said that a situation in which clubs can lose all their best players without any say in the matter to whoever has the money is a good thing for the smaller clubs...

I'm just imagining where this might lead to, but the important thing to concentrate on here is not club's ownership of players, rather it's the fluidity of the transfer market which would benefit the smaller club.

Le Tissier aside I can't think of a situation since the premiership's inception when a smaller club has been able to hold onto players of Tevez' or Mascherano's quality. The transfer to a big club is inevitable sooner or later and at the moment it is definitely sooner.

What this kind of deal introduces is a third party that acts as a sort of kingmaker whose only interests are profit. That could go horribly wrong if it merely becomes a conveyor belt system to extract talent from small clubs and deliver it straight to big clubs, but that looks unlikey because such a scenario would not maximise profit.

Take Wayne Rooney for example. Everyone knew when he emerged on the scene that he was an exceptional young prospect but then, as now, there are lingering doubts over his temper along with the normal questions in any young player's future that revolve around how money will effect him, injuries, motivation etc...

Put simply there's a lot of risk in sinking a lot of money in a young Rooney. When the third part comes in and acquires his registration their sole aim is to eliminate this risk so that he becomes a more valuable asset.

The only way to do this is to prove to potential buyers that he will not be diminished by injury (recurring metatarsals for instance), affected by wealth or become a loose cannon on the pitch.

This translates in Rooney proving, in a professional manner, that he can consistently perform at every level and provide a return for the final buyer.

In effect he would be transferred up the premiership ladder until his worth reaches a pitch, around the age of 26-27, when he would be sold for a massive amount of money to a Big Club. In effect more clubs would get a piece of the Rooney action as he moves up that ladder, and they would tend not to be big four clubs.

 

[Iam]

In a way it might benefit everyone

Holy blinkers, batman.

It'll benefit the businessmen who own the players and that's all.

As you'll soon find out.

 

[jodal]

MSI are gonna buy West Ham according to SkySPorts website:

Here

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

That's an excellent article and it says everything I suspected might be true about the transfer. Of course it's all still rumour but it's definitely plausible.

The interesting thing to think about is how football would change if this kind of deal became the norm.

In a way it might benefit everyone because a new structure would be introduced for the career of an exceptional player who is not brought up within the academy system of a Big Club.

The investors who would retain the player's registration, or a majority stake in it, would want to see the maximum possible profit from a player. Therefore up to the age of say 28, their interests would lie in seeing the player transferred as many times as possible for maximum profit.

It could lead to a very fluid transfer market whereby players turn out for a succession of ever larger clubs until they finally make the already inevitable transfer to, say, Real Madrid.

If you think about that in a wider context the ramifications would generally favour the smaller clubs. They would pay nominal fees for the right to field an exceptional player for a season or two, which on the face of it presents a far smaller risk both competitively and financially than investing 2.5 million in Steed Malbranque or some other such talented but inconsistent and unexceptional player.

This would break the monopoly the big clubs already have on world-class talent and, over time, would lead to more competitive football.

Ironically despite all the cries of foul play and Chelsea domination, this deal may represent the best chance to undermine the stranglehold of the very biggest clubs. Laying aside any fears over change in football, there's no denying that it is an ingenious transfer. It's brilliantly simple and looks like it'll be fantastically effective.

Agreed, good post.

 

[1927]

There is one major benefit of this new type of player ownership.

Usually a team would sign a quality player on a long term contract on mega wages. If they get relegated they are stuck with the sky high wages or have to sell at bargain prices because other teams know they need to offload, like happened to WHU when they got relegated three years ago.In the new scenario relegated teams will be able to just hand the players back, also there will be major savings as the cost of obtaining a world class player for a year or two will be far below the outright cost of buying.

 

[kained&able]

GOOD TO SEE YOUR OPTIMISTIC. sign tevez and machereno start talking about getting relegated


dave

 

[1927]

GOOD TO SEE YOUR OPTIMISTIC. sign tevez and machereno start talking about getting relegated


dave

I wasn't saying it was gonna happen to us tho! Just talking generalities.

 

[1927]

can't wait to watch the Barzil v argies game this afternoon. Gonn abe muisc to my ears to hear Motty say "Tevez, the west ham striker"

 

[Diamond]

I know that everyone here is in agreement on how excellent Tevez is, but if your only experience of seeing him play was in the world cup then I can guarantee you that he is much better than he was in Germany.

Trust me, this player has the potential to be one of the greats.

Some of the stuff he did in the 2002 Boca team alongside Riquelme was unbelievable. I just hope we get to see some of his brilliance today.

 

[linerider]

can't wait to watch the Barzil v argies game this afternoon. Gonn abe muisc to my ears to hear Motty say "Tevez, the west ham striker"

When they said Tevez of West Ham United it took me 10 minutes to stop laughing.
I was glad they both got subbed as i had a terrible feeling one or both was going to get injured in the same way we lost Deano to injury on international duty.

 

[muser]

I'm just imagining where this might lead to, but the important thing to concentrate on here is not club's ownership of players, rather it's the fluidity of the transfer market which would benefit the smaller club.

Le Tissier aside I can't think of a situation since the premiership's inception when a smaller club has been able to hold onto players of Tevez' or Mascherano's quality. The transfer to a big club is inevitable sooner or later and at the moment it is definitely sooner.

What this kind of deal introduces is a third party that acts as a sort of kingmaker whose only interests are profit. That could go horribly wrong if it merely becomes a conveyor belt system to extract talent from small clubs and deliver it straight to big clubs, but that looks unlikey because such a scenario would not maximise profit.



Take Wayne Rooney for example. Everyone knew when he emerged on the scene that he was an exceptional young prospect but then, as now, there are lingering doubts over his temper along with the normal questions in any young player's future that revolve around how money will effect him, injuries, motivation etc...

Put simply there's a lot of risk in sinking a lot of money in a young Rooney. When the third part comes in and acquires his registration their sole aim is to eliminate this risk so that he becomes a more valuable asset.

The only way to do this is to prove to potential buyers that he will not be diminished by injury (recurring metatarsals for instance), affected by wealth or become a loose cannon on the pitch.

This translates in Rooney proving, in a professional manner, that he can consistently perform at every level and provide a return for the final buyer.

In effect he would be transferred up the premiership ladder until his worth reaches a pitch, around the age of 26-27, when he would be sold for a massive amount of money to a Big Club. In effect more clubs would get a piece of the Rooney action as he moves up that ladder, and they would tend not to be big four clubs.

Great post. The independent did a table on transfers over the career of top premiership players. Anelka heads the list on 70.3m. Though for me Anelka is an aberration, not the norm, he is consistently good and always brings something to the team he plays for. The only problem I see is that a top club might not wait around until a mascherano or tevez becomes available, bucking the trend by either owning share in these registration right owners or tapping up said player before he puts pen to paper (whilst belonging to a club).

 

[Diamond]

That's an excellent article and it says everything I suspected might be true about the transfer. Of course it's all still rumour but it's definitely plausible.

The interesting thing to think about is how football would change if this kind of deal became the norm.

In a way it might benefit everyone because a new structure would be introduced for the career of an exceptional player who is not brought up within the academy system of a Big Club.

The investors who would retain the player's registration, or a majority stake in it, would want to see the maximum possible profit from a player. Therefore up to the age of say 28, their interests would lie in seeing the player transferred as many times as possible for maximum profit.

It could lead to a very fluid transfer market whereby players turn out for a succession of ever larger clubs until they finally make the already inevitable transfer to, say, Real Madrid.

If you think about that in a wider context the ramifications would generally favour the smaller clubs. They would pay nominal fees for the right to field an exceptional player for a season or two, which on the face of it presents a far smaller risk both competitively and financially than investing 2.5 million in Steed Malbranque or some other such talented but inconsistent and unexceptional player.

This would break the monopoly the big clubs already have on world-class talent and, over time, would lead to more competitive football.

Ironically despite all the cries of foul play and Chelsea domination, this deal may represent the best chance to undermine the stranglehold of the very biggest clubs. Laying aside any fears over change in football, there's no denying that it is an ingenious transfer. It's brilliantly simple and looks like it'll be fantastically effective.

Looks like Zahavi's going to head up a 100m fund to deal in investments of exactly this nature. 100m doesn't actually sound like a huge amount so I reckon it's just some investors testing the water until they set up a far larger fund, very interesting all the same tho.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/5332044.stm

 

[1927]

What's that old adage about judging the quality of a team by the quality of its bench?

West Ham
Substitutes
21 R Green, 11 M Etherington, 12 C Cole, 16 J Mascherano, 32 C Tevez

 

[Balbi]

What's that old adage about judging the quality of a team by the quality of its bench?

West Ham
Substitutes
21 R Green, 11 M Etherington, 12 C Cole, 16 J Mascherano, 32 C Tevez

personally, i judge the quality of a team by the points they take home innit

 

[1927]

personally, i judge the quality of a team by the points they take home innit

That's not the quality tho! that's the success, or the ability to convert quality into results!!

 

[Balbi]

That's not the quality tho! that's the success, or the ability to convert quality into results!!

aye, but you could have a squad with Joe Cole, Defoe, Dave James, Glen Johnson and still get relegated

 

[tommers]

aye, but you could have a squad with Joe Cole, Defoe, Dave James, Glen Johnson and still get relegated

and michael carrick.