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Hamas Win so what now

Joe said:
Your debating skills revolve around ad hominem... focus on what I'm saying not on your misguided preconceptions of my character.

Rubbish. You have demonstrated on previous occasions that you have little desire to debate but to tell us how 'wrong' we are.

Aren't you going to suggest that I'm anti-semitic? I'd love that...then I could really go to town on you.
 
Joe said:
Are you suggesting that hamas recognise Israel's right to exist?

Are you putting words into my mouth? You're a fine one to talk about "debating styles". :rolleyes:

Funny how you dismissed the Sinn Fein/IRA analogy...but I know why you do that.
 
nino_savatte said:
Rubbish. You have demonstrated on previous occasions that you have little desire to debate but to tell us how 'wrong' we are.

Aren't you going to suggest that I'm anti-semitic? I'd love that...then I could really go to town on you.
why would you wish to go to town on me?

I'm asking for your views on hamas and you seem hell-bent on trying to belittle me :confused:
 
Joe said:
why would you wish to go to town on me?

I'm asking for your views on hamas and you seem hell-bent on trying to belittle me :confused:

No, you're trying to paint me into a corner. Next, you'll be asking me whether I believe Israel has a right to exist.

You understand the definition of the word "occupation" I presume.

It is you who belittles and patronises others. I've seen your work on the other thread btw.
 
nino_savatte said:
Am I anti-semitic, Joe?

Are all Jews white Europeans?
The IDF Morality thread was put to sleep a long time ago, I am still of the mind that there was some obvious anti-semitism posted in it, but we couldn't agree then - we wont agree now... why dig up the past? deal with the debate in hand.

As for white europeans, what the hell you talkin' bout willus?
 
nino_savatte said:
No, you're trying to paint me into a corner. Next, you'll be asking me whether I believe Israel has a right to exist.

You understand the definition of the word "occupation" I presume.

It is you who belittles and patronises others. I've seen your work on the other thread btw.
What on earth are you talking about?

I asked you 3 questions about hamas and all you seem to do is squirm :confused:
 
Joe said:
What on earth are you talking about?

I asked you 3 questions about hamas and all you seem to do is squirm :confused:

That's right, pretend that you don't know what I'm talking about but that is one of your wee tricks to confuse things.

No one is squirming but it is clear that you have an agenda.

Like the moral high ground - do you?
 
Joe said:
The IDF Morality thread was put to sleep a long time ago, I am still of the mind that there was some obvious anti-semitism posted in it, but we couldn't agree then - we wont agree now... why dig up the past? deal with the debate in hand.

As for white europeans, what the hell you talkin' bout willus?

I get the feeling that you only see one type of Jew: the Israeli of European extraction (Ashkenazi).
 
nino_savatte said:
That's right, pretend that you don't know what I'm talking about but that is one of your wee tricks to confuse things.

No one is squirming but it is clear that you have an agenda.

Like the moral high ground - do you?
An agenda?

I asked your views on hamas?

forget I asked....
 
Joe said:
*bangs head off*

I give up.

Good. Because you don't actually want to debate and there is plenty of evidence on this thread.

You have an agenda and you denied it. You have stopped short of pronouncing everyone as "anti-semitic" but the subext is there.

Does the word "occupation" mean anything to you? No, of course it doesn't; to you, Israel's continued occupation of the West Bank is 'god-given'. :rolleyes:

I hope your head isn't a bloody pulp after all that banging. :D
 
Joe said:
Are Hamas a respectable organisation?
A ridiculous question to ask unless you supply information as to what you consider "respectable".
In its current manifestation do you believe Hamas to have interests in peace?
Yes, no more so or less so than the state of Israel has "interests in peace" with Hamas.
Do you agree with the Hamas stance when it comes to Israels right to exist?
No, but I'm optimistic that now Hamas have nailed their colours to the mast in terms of engaging in democratic politics, that they will "re-negotiate" that stance.
 
ViolentPanda said:
Yes, no more so or less so than the state of Israel has "interests in peace" with Hamas.
I believe you've hit the nail on the head, in its current manifestation Israel has no desire to make peace with hamas... However Israel do want peace with Palestine and recognise its right to exist (both fatah and hamas don't share this view - with regards to Israel).

ViolentPanda said:
No, but I'm optimistic that now Hamas have nailed their colours to the mast in terms of engaging in democratic politics, that they will "re-negotiate" that stance.
I wouldn't go as far as saying I'm optimistic, but I'm certainly hopeful.
 
U.S. Policy Seen as Big Loser in Palestinian Vote.

I'd add that in electing their own version of Likud the Palestinians have probably ensured they'll be totally shafted over the occupied territories. Fatah may have been a hopelessly corrupt bunch of thieves latterly in the pay of DC but they had some hope of negotiating the retention of a few scraps of Jerusalem from the Israelis, this bunch of Zealots have no chance.

Peter Berkowitz in, that neocon rag, The Weekly Standard may be silly in his first assertion, Dubya did all he could to stop Hamas winning, but what follows is likely.
In fact, Hamas's victory may strengthen Olmert's hand, and it can paradoxically but plausibly be seen as a vindication of the Bush liberty doctrine. Those Kadima voters who, like my friend, migrated to the party from the left will find in the Palestinian election results irrefutable confirmation of what drove them away from their old party in the first place: the conviction that in the short term Israel is unlikely to find a viable negotiating partner representing the Palestinian people and therefore must act unilaterally to establish defensible borders and separate from the Palestinian people. The danger that Kadima faces is that those who came to its ranks from the Likud may be tempted to return. But, in addition to Olmert, Kadima is led by Foreign and Justice Minister Tzipi Livni and Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz, both ex-Likudniks and familiar faces. Furthermore, there is no good reason to suppose that Likud voters who broke with their party to endorse a two-state solution, based if necessary on unilateral disengagement, will think, as the Likud today does, that the solution to the problem of Hamas involves exercising administrative control over the Palestinian people
 
Sasaferrato said:
It was a couple of weeks,

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/12/30/wmid130.xml

Edited to add:

Why don't you lot who are so in love with the Palestinians use ' Jew Hater ' as your tagline, preferrably in red, it would make you easier to identify and ignore.

From the same article.
The bombing was claimed by the militant group Islamic Jihad, which has refused to join a year-long period of calm announced by other armed factions.

Your last remark is deeply offensive but also betrays your total ignorance of the world's Jewry. Why do I say this? Because you make the usual mistake of totalising the Israeli state with the wide and varied Jewish communities of the world.
 
nino_savatte said:
From the same article.


Your last remark is deeply offensive but also betrays your total ignorance of the world's Jewry.


Do fuck off. One group of murdering scum or another, what's the difference? You'll be telling me next that the Real IRA and PIRA have nothing to do with each other.
 
nino_savatte said:
From the same article.


Your last remark is deeply offensive but also betrays your total ignorance of the world's Jewry. Why do I say this? Because you make the usual mistake of totalising the Israeli state with the wide and varied Jewish communities of the world.


I'm Jewish by blood, you?
 
Sasaferrato said:
Do fuck off. One group of murdering scum or another, what's the difference? You'll be telling me next that the Real IRA and PIRA have nothing to do with each other.

No, you fuck off. When it comes to the world's jews you clearly do not know what you are talking about. Take your "Jew-hater" insult and ram it up your arse, pal.
 
nino_savatte said:
I guess you've never heard of the Bene Israel or the Cameroonian Jews - eh, Sass?

I have indeed. I have also listened to Jew baiters all my life, and still do. Funnily, people feel free to make comments about Jews that they would never make about Black or Asian people, I suppose the fact that they would be prosecuted for such remarks about Black or Asian people has something to do with it. They can slander the Jews with impunity.
 
Sasaferrato said:
I have indeed. I have also listened to Jew baiters all my life, and still do. Funnily, people feel free to make comments about Jews that they would never make about Black or Asian people, I suppose the fact that they would be prosecuted for such remarks about Black or Asian people has something to do with it. They can slander the Jews with impunity.
your comments are falling on deaf ears.

I was told I have a choice in being jewish last time I had this debate with nino :D
 
nino_savatte said:
No, you fuck off. When it comes to the world's jews you clearly do not know what you are talking about. Take your "Jew-hater" insult and ram it up your arse, pal.


Touch a nerve, did I?
 
Joe said:
your comments are falling on deaf ears.

I was told I have a choice in being jewish last time I had this debate with nino :D

Of course you have, why not change your eye colour at the same time. :rolleyes:

Palestinian support is often a thin excuse for Jew baiting. Oh well, it seems to make them happy, silly bastards don't realise that their anti-Semetism is very apparent.
 
nino_savatte said:
I guess you've never heard of the Bene Israel or the Cameroonian Jews - eh, Sass?
I had chosen to ignore you... but I can't myself :(

Please nino, what relevance does this have to the arguement? The bene jews were linked to the Israelites through DNA - that would suggest jewish blood?

No-one would be stupid enough to argue that a jewish race exists (for that matter you couldn't argue a caucasian race exists), but to suggest someone can't have jewish blood is fantasy.
 
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