Greetings from Israel

[rachamim18]

G: "His attitude controls over 200 nukes..." Again, you have not even read the Israeli Basic Law, have you? IF you want to sound silly, go right ahead. If you notice though, even those here who argue Israel is evil merely for existing do not maintainy our position. Israel was one step from communism until 1986. In fact, it was actually a true example of communism if you examine United Kibbutz and various other forms of collectiveism.

It disdained anything religious and the reason I lost my religion was because in our army it was not tolerated at the time. I am amzed at how little you know and this is not really meant as a putdown but a sincere comment.

Nosos: No, it is someone with a nonsensical sceenname throwing pseudo-clever one liners,and using drugs to denigrate a person a drug oriented board....so intelligent. Perhaps you too mighty consider confronting issues and not people whom you have never met. Internet tough guys and girls, I love it.

Spion: The term "ethnic" is universally accepted as a calssification of a group as a whole in the face of a larger majority. So, if English were being threatened by intermarriage in say Argentina, and indeed some there claim it to be so, you would have a point. However, in England they are the vast majority so it would be non-sensical to describe them as an ethnic group.


The Jews have a double edged razor in that they have a unified culture with 4500 years of shared history and they also have a shared (most) religion. Intermarriage is not only threatening their culture, but it is directly against our religion (without prior conversion of a non-Jewish spouse).

"KACH Party member..." And cirrent Kadimah Party member, so what is your point then? Is Kadimah now a fascist group? Although I must be honest nd state that I do believe that it is highly unlikely that you have even ever read the Kadimah Platform...and obviously you have never read the KACH Platform or anything about the group aside from oppositional media sources. Try reading the words of Kahane before making judgements.

If you do, you might realise what that fist means.

Idaho: We are NOT a race. As for embracing others, we actually do. We just believe that our path is the right one for us and when we intermarry we tend to stray from said path. It is not about the genome although that too is certainly directly threatened (do not know though if that is so bad). My wish is that the Jewish Culture survives, and hopefully flourish.

Lobster: And yet those Jews from India and S. Africa share a closely related genetic structure. This is a fact. It is neither good nor bad in my view but it IS a fact. We have absorbed racial characteristics from just about every group on Earth and yet we have retained our core make up, our core cultural values, and core outlook.

 

[rachamim18]

Keyboard: It is not that we welcomed them but that we did not push them away as we do now. There were also cases of conversion by sword, as was usually the case in Islam. Most do not know but there have been several independant Jewish Nations throughout history. At least 2 of them were the result of Jewish military action and focred conversion. This of course is anthema to our faith as a whole but it does show the issue to be far from black and white.

Nosos: "Define my terms." Yes, humans and chimps have very closely related DNA. Obviously my statement describes a much closer realtionshiop, as in all Jews being a tribal people although we have largely thrown off our distinct tribal identities.

After the Roman Exile we dissolved our tribal structures although we do sometimes, as in my family, maintain clan associations. You can use Y Chromosmal Modalities to ascertain just when most Jews went into the Disaporah and that most Jews today are the direct descendants of the Biblical Jews, soemthing oftenb dismissed by Arabs and supporters of Arabs. The idea that white skinned Jews are Europeans is preposterous and scientifically disporven. That is my point.

 

[KeyboardJockey]

Keyboard: It is not that we welcomed them but that we did not push them away as we do now. There were also cases of conversion by sword, as was usually the case in Islam. Most do not know but there have been several independant Jewish Nations throughout history. At least 2 of them were the result of Jewish military action and focred conversion. This of course is anthema to our faith as a whole but it does show the issue to be far from black and white.
.

There were less forced conversions to Judaism from what my reading of (esp post biblical ) history when compared to Christianity and Islam.

 

[rachamim18]

You are correct, MUCH less. Since the faith was codified it has taken the stance that it wil accept all comers but that such people must be truly decicated to the path. It is an onus to be Jew. We must adhere to 613 Commandments. All others need only follow the 7 Noahide Commandments.

A Jew who dose not follow the 613 to the best of their ability is delaying the Messianic Advent thus it is far better that only truly motivated people follow our path.

Since the Talmud was codified in the few centuries after Roman Exile we have had a rule of thumb that a prospective convert must be turned away, harshly, and less harshly as they keep trying. If they come a 4th time, then they must be warmly recieved because most people will lose interest when getting a very cold shoulder 3 times.

 

[nosos]

Yes, humans and chimps have very closely related DNA. Obviously my statement describes a much closer realtionshiop, as in all Jews being a tribal people although we have largely thrown off our distinct tribal identities.

So all Jews have how much genetic similarity? Presumably you're saying that genetic variation within the in-group is massively outstripped by genetic variation between the in-group and the out-group? Could you substantiate this?

 

[nosos]

You can use Y Chromosmal Modalities to ascertain just when most Jews went into the Disaporah

You can use changes in the Y Chromosone to determine when a hsitorical event took place? Apologies if I'm misinterpreting you.

and that most Jews today are the direct descendants of the Biblical Jews

How exactly can you ascertain that Jews today are the "direct descendents" of the Jews written about in the bible?

 

[Gmart]

Again, "The Bible has an aswer for everything..." WHAT??? When have I EVER used the Bible for anything here?

A better example of how little you read my posts could not be found.

 

[warren]

In the case of Judaism it is documented that is WAS more welcoming of converts before oppression by Christianity and Islam (although the deal that the Jews got in areas like Spain was far better under Islam than under the murderous regime after the Reconquista)

That's a sweeping generalization if ever I heard one. The North African Muslim regimes which crossed over to Spain had some of the worst oppression of Jews in Islamic history.

 

[Idaho]

You can use Y Chromosmal Modalities to ascertain just when most Jews went into the Disaporah and that most Jews today are the direct descendants of the Biblical Jews, soemthing oftenb dismissed by Arabs and supporters of Arabs. The idea that white skinned Jews are Europeans is preposterous and scientifically disporven. That is my point.

I have a 'jewish' Y chromasome and yet my jewish relatives will not recognise me as a jew, and indeed disowned my father for marrying out. That's straight up racism.

 

[KeyboardJockey]

You are correct, MUCH less. Since the faith was codified it has taken the stance that it wil accept all comers but that such people must be truly decicated to the path. It is an onus to be Jew. We must adhere to 613 Commandments. All others need only follow the 7 Noahide Commandments.

A Jew who dose not follow the 613 to the best of their ability is delaying the Messianic Advent thus it is far better that only truly motivated people follow our path.

Since the Talmud was codified in the few centuries after Roman Exile we have had a rule of thumb that a prospective convert must be turned away, harshly, and less harshly as they keep trying. If they come a 4th time, then they must be warmly recieved because most people will lose interest when getting a very cold shoulder 3 times.

That adherence to the 613 Mitzvot really applies in my understanding to Orthodoxy (not all the 613 can be performed anyway as the Temple has gone) but the Reform and Liberal movements do have stringencies as regards converts including the 'turning away' and the requirement to have an examinied body of Jewish knowledge. The Liberal movement has 'suspended' the commandments regarding Temple practice as they believe tha thte synagogue has permanently replace the Temple.

 

[rachamim18]

Keyboard:"613 Commandments may not be performed because of a lack of the Temple." Nope, by living within the historical boundries of the ancient nations of Judea and Israel we can indeed perform all 3. This was dcodified by the Rabbinate after the fall of the 2nd Temple.We substitue specific actions for the acts of Sacrafice.


"613 is an Orthadox thing." First, there is no such thing as "orthadox, Conservative, or any other label. the only thing is, Observant and NonObservant. That various categorised strains of the religion have taken it upon themselves to make these decisons is ridiculous.

We believe that while Scripture can and should be interprative, we also beleave that it should be but within a set of well defined parameters. We know that the 613 are not up for debate because they (we believe) are laws handed from G-D directly to Moses.

One can never observe even close to all 613 (and of course those of us in the Disaporah could not even if it were humanly possible) but the Blessing is in the action, the striving .

"Liberals have placed low importantce on observing the Commandments because there is Temple.": No they do so because when the movement began , in Germany, it was the era of Haskalah (Enlightenment). At the same time Germany and a couple of other nations slightly relaxed their anti-Jewish laws.

Many Jews began to mix more freely with non-Jews and then naturally wanted even more acceptance. This caused a few outspoken people to push for most physical assimilation, even unto conversion to Christianity. Some very liberal Rabbis saw that unless more acceptance was offered to these assimilating Jews, they and their offspring would be lost forever.

Others simply believed that it was no longer neccessary to observe the Law because we no longer lived in camel hair tents, bathed in camel urine, and were poylgamous. Together their pushing together resulted in what is now alterantively known as the Reform and the Liberal movements within Judaisim.

Idaho: It is not racism when one does not accept a family member. Jews is not a distinct race so it could not be in any regard. It is prejudiced, obviously it is. However, if you familiarise yourself with our religion you will see that the rationale behind it has nothing to do with supremacy or subjugation.

 

[rachamim18]

Nosos: "Can Rachamim substantiate that Jews as a group have much more genetic similarity than compared to the non-Jews?" It has already ben verifed in many,many genome studies. It can aslo be dedcuted by the more than 4000 gentic disroders that affect Jews more than non-Jews, and almost 2000 paticular to Jews alone.

"Can Y Chromosomal Modalities show us when a historical event took place?" No. It can however tell us where the Jews as a People were when a documented historical event took place. For exampe, there is a specific date attributed to the Exodus if in fact the Exodus actually took place.

Aaron is listed as the brother of Aaraon, Aaron is also said to be the progenitor of the Priestly tribe. By testing those Jews considered to be from that tribe (full tribal structure virtually ended when the 2nd Temple was destroyed, we see that they shared a direct common ancestor, male, from the Exodus era.

"How does one ascertain that today's Jews are the direct descendants of the Biblical Jews?": Y Chromosomal showed that direct common ancestor among Jews of every physical type and every geographical locale.

There also have been DNA comparisons taken from Jewish corpses predating the Roman Exile, in Israel .

Lastly, an extremely rare congentical deafness is found only among two familes on Earth, one Ashkenaz (European) and the other "Palestinian" Arab. Finally,the genome can be used to trace migratory pattenrs and this has also shown migration via two routes, one up into Centrral Asia and then meandering towards China in the east and Eastern Europe in the west. the other went through N. Africa and up into Iberia and then heading east.

 

[KeyboardJockey]

Keyboard:"613 Commandments may not be performed because of a lack of the Temple." Nope, by living within the historical boundries of the ancient nations of Judea and Israel we can indeed perform all 3. This was dcodified by the Rabbinate after the fall of the 2nd Temple.We substitue specific actions for the acts of Sacrafice.

Agree that there are substitutes for the animal and other sacrifices.

"613 is an Orthadox thing." First, there is no such thing as "orthadox, Conservative, or any other label. the only thing is, Observant and NonObservant. That various categorised strains of the religion have taken it upon themselves to make these decisons is ridiculous.

OK we will have to agree to disagree on this definition.

We believe that while Scripture can and should be interprative, we also beleave that it should be but within a set of well defined parameters. We know that the 613 are not up for debate because they (we believe) are laws handed from G-D directly to Moses.

I can see your point from what I would call an Orthodox POV and what you would call observant. Other branches of Judaism would disagree about the completeness and divine origin of the 613 but I will not push this matter too far with yhou if it will cause offence however, I happen to believe that although there is only one G-d there are many hands evident in the writing of scripture (I dont' believe G-d dictated scripture) and that how scripture was written down may well have been infulenced by political and spiritual movements within the faith. It cannot be denied that there is a huge difference is style and power between the Torah and the rest of the Tanakh.

One can never observe even close to all 613 (and of course those of us in the Disaporah could not even if it were humanly possible) but the Blessing is in the action, the striving .

Now that is something I agree with. Sometimes the act of trying is as good as the action itself.

"Liberals have placed low importantce on observing the Commandments because there is Temple.": No they do so because when the movement began , in Germany, it was the era of Haskalah (Enlightenment). At the same time Germany and a couple of other nations slightly relaxed their anti-Jewish laws.

No disagreement there about the Reform movement starting in Germany and the conditions that attended assimilliation.

Many Jews began to mix more freely with non-Jews and then naturally wanted even more acceptance. This caused a few outspoken people to push for most physical assimilation, even unto conversion to Christianity. Some very liberal Rabbis saw that unless more acceptance was offered to these assimilating Jews, they and their offspring would be lost forever.

Up to a point I agree with you. I understand that there was even a movement in Germany who wanted to move Shabat to a Sunday to fit in better.

Others simply believed that it was no longer neccessary to observe the Law because we no longer lived in camel hair tents, bathed in camel urine, and were poylgamous. Together their pushing together resulted in what is now alterantively known as the Reform and the Liberal movements within Judaisim.

As I understand it from a Liberal perspective the commandments must be interpreteted in the context of the times in which we are living. Although all movements within Judaism have done this Liberals make the biggest point about it.

 

[rachamim18]

Keyboard: Man cannot change religion to suit man. Man must change to suit religion. Those groups pigeonholing themselves into neat little boxes like "Reform," "Liberal," Comservative," "Humanist," and "Reconstructionist" are only folling themselves and of course some non-Jews.

Observant Jews do not call themselves Orthadox as a rule. They describe themselves simply as "Observant" (Frum,etc).

"Causing offence." I think you have soemthing confused. I am not Observant. I fell from that path around my 16th birthday. I am simply employing common sense.

Reform and all those other groups show great reverence when they handle the Torah. They all hold it in awe. If they do hold it in awe, why? Because even they say it is the Word. IF it is the Word, how can you pick and choose different aspects of it to follow, and negate ones that make you feel as if it is an onus?


Noone can humanly follow all 613. The idea though is to strive. The striving is what makes us closer to G-D. I see tht you picked up on this in your subsequent post. Good call.

Yes, Jews in Germany did call for a change of Sabbath, and many other shocking (to look back) things.


I too do not belive Moses took dictation. However, Observant Jews do.

Yes, Liberals say that Commandments must be interpreted through the prism of today's world. Basically all Jews say this. The difference, as I said before, is that Observant Jews say that it is truly possible without negating core values or ignoring some Commandments altogether.

 

[KeyboardJockey]

Keyboard: Man cannot change religion to suit man. Man must change to suit religion. Those groups pigeonholing themselves into neat little boxes like "Reform," "Liberal," Comservative," "Humanist," and "Reconstructionist" are only folling themselves and of course some non-Jews.

I can see where you are coming from but it if Religion is unchanging then it means that to a large extent that humanity is unchanging and that doesn't fit well with my view of free will. We were given free will and g-d could have created robots but didn't He created humanity with the ability to make choices and this ability to make choices means that there should be some acceptance of progressive revelation. I don't believe that the writings in the Tanakh are the end rather than they are the means by which we can grow as humans. All religions change and sometimes the changes are hidden or lost or censored. With Christianity for example the fact that the early Christians trolled round the near east picking up other peoples stories and ideas and appropriating them is a case in point - a lot of the Nativity story is borrowed from Mithraism.

Observant Jews do not call themselves Orthadox as a rule. They describe themselves simply as "Observant" (Frum,etc).

Agreed.

"Causing offence." I think you have soemthing confused. I am not Observant. I fell from that path around my 16th birthday. I am simply employing common sense.

OK point taken.

Reform and all those other groups show great reverence when they handle the Torah. They all hold it in awe. If they do hold it in awe, why? Because even they say it is the Word. IF it is the Word, how can you pick and choose different aspects of it to follow, and negate ones that make you feel as if it is an onus?

This I'm afraid I disagree with. I think that you can show reverance for The Torah but accept that it was written by humans over a very long period. IMO G-d is still in The Torah but the way we look at G-d changes due to progressive revelation where we learn more about the world and ourselves and that is reflected on how we view religion. Some will use this progressive revelation to reject religion but some don't and use it to gain deeper meaning from religion.

Noone can humanly follow all 613. The idea though is to strive. The striving is what makes us closer to G-D. I see tht you picked up on this in your subsequent post. Good call.

The striving especially in areas like Tzdakah is what brings us closer to G-d IMO.

Yes, Jews in Germany did call for a change of Sabbath, and many other shocking (to look back) things.

Agreed.

I too do not belive Moses took dictation. However, Observant Jews do.

True

Yes, Liberals say that Commandments must be interpreted through the prism of today's world. Basically all Jews say this. The difference, as I said before, is that Observant Jews say that it is truly possible without negating core values or ignoring some Commandments altogether.

Hmmmm. Not sure I can agree with you totally there. The big example I would give is in the area of sexuality. Some of the Commandments such as those relating to incest, forced sex etc are relevant but adherance to some other commandments such as those relating to same sex relationships (and don't forget loving equitable same sex relationships were unknown at the time the Torah was written) appears to me to be wrong when there is evidence to prove that adherence to such commandments is damaging to individuals and society.

There is another thread about homophobia in the black community which shows that blind adherence to Levitical and Pauline Christian views on same sex activity is heartbreak and in some cases death.

 

[goldenecitrone]

Humans and chimps share very closely related genetics. Could you define your terms?

I think he must mean the big hooter and dark, curly hair genes.

 

[nino_savatte]

Nosos: "Can Rachamim substantiate that Jews as a group have much more genetic similarity than compared to the non-Jews?" It has already ben verifed in many,many genome studies. It can aslo be dedcuted by the more than 4000 gentic disroders that affect Jews more than non-Jews, and almost 2000 paticular to Jews alone.

"Can Y Chromosomal Modalities show us when a historical event took place?" No. It can however tell us where the Jews as a People were when a documented historical event took place. For exampe, there is a specific date attributed to the Exodus if in fact the Exodus actually took place.

Aaron is listed as the brother of Aaraon, Aaron is also said to be the progenitor of the Priestly tribe. By testing those Jews considered to be from that tribe (full tribal structure virtually ended when the 2nd Temple was destroyed, we see that they shared a direct common ancestor, male, from the Exodus era.

"How does one ascertain that today's Jews are the direct descendants of the Biblical Jews?": Y Chromosomal showed that direct common ancestor among Jews of every physical type and every geographical locale.

There also have been DNA comparisons taken from Jewish corpses predating the Roman Exile, in Israel .

Lastly, an extremely rare congentical deafness is found only among two familes on Earth, one Ashkenaz (European) and the other "Palestinian" Arab. Finally,the genome can be used to trace migratory pattenrs and this has also shown migration via two routes, one up into Centrral Asia and then meandering towards China in the east and Eastern Europe in the west. the other went through N. Africa and up into Iberia and then heading east.

More faux scientific (infused with superstition) justifications for racism. It's inexcusable.

I'm sure the Turks have a valid claim to the steppes of Central Asia...as do the Mongols.

 

[cemertyone]

Calva: On a serious note though, intermarriage ismaking us extinct. ).

Fuck me any else notice the similarity between our mate Rack and the nation of islam....all this inte-breeding is no good.....fuck off you cunt....

 

[rachamim18]

Keyboard: "If religion is unchanging that means that humanity is unchanging.": Nooooo. For example, Jews are forbidden to ride in vehichles with engines on the Sabbath because the engine works via combustion. Combustion works via fire (well tine explosions but I believe most know what I mean). So we are able to discern whether or not riding in an engine powered means of transportation is kosher or not.

By this same token we are able to interpret everything in the modernity. We ackowledge that humanity is ever changing and yet we cannot help but admit that some facets of existence are never changing. We will always love, grow old (if allowed), and die.

These commonalities allow us to reinterpret but also us to ackowledge those unchanging parameters.

"G-D gave us Freewill." ABSOLUTELY. We explain it along these lines usually: It is like performing a well documented chain reaction. We have the ability to change porportions, skip steps, etc. but G-D still knows the ultimate result.

"Tanach is not the end." Jews do not belive it is either. We do belive that it sets acceptable parameters though. In other words, it can do us no harm. Accepting whatever sounds nice though can certainly harm us ALOT.

I do not know if I have ever said this on this site but religion is just humankind's inability to fathom creation. None is "right," all are "right." This si why we say as long as one follows the 7 Noahide Commandments (meaning someone other than those born Jewish), they will sahre in the Glory to come. One need not convert to our faith to find favour in HIS eyes.

"Religions pick up other elements." VERY true. The whole concept of Heavena nd Hell is pure Greek mythology! Sulphur? Underground? All one really need do is examine the Apocrypha and their histories with regard to their inclusion or exlusion during codification of both Judaisim and Christianity.



Judiasim is no different. We absorbed many elements from many (now extinct) faiths.

Of course it is true that you can consider Scipture to have been created by humans and still hold it in reverence. The Sikh do so with their holiest book. However the Jewish Groups mentioned, excluding the Humanists, do belive Scipture to emanate from HIM. They do this without examing the hypocrisy of it.

"Progressive revelation." No, no Jewish group that "I am aware of looks at it in this manner. All believe that the Word is complete and sancrosanct.

"Same sex relationships on an open and mature level were unknown at the time of the compiling of the Torah.": Nope, not at all. Many ancient socieities fully accepted it. In Mesopotamia we know that the Temple Prostitutes engaged in same sex dalliances,etc. Jews though were nomadic and lived in extremely harsh environments.

To allow same sex relations would make the group vulnerable. Relations with all people are well defined so that he individual throws off their individuality. Even in the present Jews (Observant) do not belive in love. We marry to reproduce and build in strength.

At the time of the Bible we married our brothers' wives if our brothers died. This was so that noone would be left vulnerable, so that the unit as a whole would remain steadfast.

If you negate love between heterosexuals, how can you allow it among those of the same sex? It would weaken the group as a whole.

Also, we do not belive being homosexual,etc. is a sin. We DO believe the actions of fufillment, with relation to this urge IS.
"Blacks and homosexuality in relation to Christain values." Most if not all African tribes (certainly those of NW Africa where almost all slaves in the Western Hemisphere emanate from) abhor the practice as well. This predates even the beginning of Christianity. Certainly being immersed in Christianity has only served to reinfocr this.

Nino: Both the Turks and Mongols were highly nomadic. As such they have claim to no well defined land. Jews though were settled for more than 2 millenia when last Exiled. Bit of a difference.

Cemerty: Why insult a person? Would it not be more gratifying to show how foolish I am in my position? So sad how you have such a meaningless life that would allow you to obsess over the personality of a man you have never met.

Anti Assimilationists are not racists. Many with precarious cultures try to preserve their cultures. Lapps are racist? Native Americans ? Tibetans? You make no sense Nno.

 

[nino_savatte]

Nino: Both the Turks and Mongols were highly nomadic. As such they have claim to no well defined land. Jews though were settled for more than 2 millenia when last Exiled. Bit of a difference.

Almost all ethnic groups are nomadic. That also includes Jews.

No difference.

 

[nino_savatte]

Fuck me any else notice the similarity between our mate Rack and the nation of islam....all this inte-breeding is no good.....fuck off you cunt....

He'd have been at home in the Jim Crow South with its miscegenation laws. There is no difference between him and a hardened southern racist of the likes of Strom Thurmond or Trent Lott.

 

[rachamim18]

Nino: "Almost all ethnic groups are nomadic.": That is just TOO precious. Here I was thinking Nino was only good for sour grapes. Please, please keep tossing off those gems. Yeah, I mean I used to see alot of nomadic Italians walking around the Bronx. Those Albanians used to piss me off setting up their tents in my stairwell and whatnot. You ARE a pisser Nino.

 

[nino_savatte]

Well, well, well, if it isn't my skag-addled friend with another one of his insult-laden posts. How about dealing with the point instead of wriggling?

And you have the cheek to accuse others of "ad hominems"? What a hypocrite!

Maybe we should be thinking of handing back large tracts of land in the Caucasus to anyone who calls themself a "Goth".

If we're lucky we may even find some descendants of the Vandals in Spain.

 

[rachamim18]

It Goths and Vandals have lived there continuously for thousands of years, predating even the existence of who is in majority there now, by all means give it to them. Why would you think otherwise. Oh, by the way, please look up the definition of ad hominem.

 

[nino_savatte]

It Goths and Vandals have lived there continuously for thousands of years, predating even the existence of who is in majority there now, by all means give it to them. Why would you think otherwise. Oh, by the way, please look up the definition of ad hominem.

How about you look up the definition of the word "truth"?

Oh, where did I engage in an "ad hominem"? You chuck that phrase around as though it means something but it is clear that these are nothing but empty words that are thrown back at someone each time they try and get you to be honest. You're a drama queen and no mistake.

 

[rachamim18]

Nino: I will only engage you to prove a point this one time. Cali8ng me "skag addled" is not the "truth." I neither do heroin nor am I addled. Ergo, it is an ad hom. In fact, even if it were true, it would be ad hom because you used the wording merely in an attempt to denigrate me.

Better though than the time you actually suggested I am a pedophile (as in my presence in Cambodia).

 

[Lock&Light]

Nino: I will only engage you to prove a point this one time. Cali8ng me "skag addled" is not the "truth." I neither do heroin nor am I addled. Ergo, it is an ad hom. In fact, even if it were true, it would be ad hom because you used the wording merely in an attempt to denigrate me.

A clearer example of an 'ad hominem' attack can hardly be envisioned.

 

[Grandma Death]

See rach is peddling the 'ad hom' defence (for a change ). Wheeled out when the pressure is on to provide evidence...standard defence mechanism.

 

[nino_savatte]

Nino: I will only engage you to prove a point this one time. Cali8ng me "skag addled" is not the "truth." I neither do heroin nor am I addled. Ergo, it is an ad hom. In fact, even if it were true, it would be ad hom because you used the wording merely in an attempt to denigrate me.

Better though than the time you actually suggested I am a pedophile (as in my presence in Cambodia).

I never suggested that you were a "paedophile", you lying sack of shite. I said that people only go to Cambodia "for one of two reasons". It is obvious why you went to Cambodia because you're a skaghead.

I neither do heroin nor am I addled.

You're a bad liar; the drugs forum has many posts where you claim to be a heroin addict and now you're telling me that you're not? You're not even consistent with your lies.

You're a pathetic little man who thinks he's something more than he really is.

 

[nino_savatte]

See rach is peddling the 'ad hom' defence (for a change ). Wheeled out when the pressure is on to provide evidence...standard defence mechanism.

He has nothing else.