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Germany: Elections 2017

Discussion in 'world politics, current affairs and news' started by Idris2002, Aug 16, 2017.

  1. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    I don't the comparison really stands on any level: (1) The political system is different in the UK to Germany meaning coalitions are less common/accepted here, (2) I think it's highly unlikely that Labour would even try to form a coalition with three other parties, they'd be far more likely to try a govern as a minority government (as they said they would after 2017 if they had the chance), (3) besides both being scum I don't think the LDs are equivalent to the FDP, nor DL to the SNP.

    EDIT: If the FDP and Greens couldn't come to a agreement under a CDU-led coalition, why would they be able to under a SDP one? And how could DL form a coalition with the FDP when red-red-green coalitions have been hard to form and/or unstable?
     
    yield and Slo-mo like this.
  2. Slo-mo

    Slo-mo Well-Known Member

    Thanks. That makes it a bit clearer!

    I wasn't trying to make a direct comparison between SNP and DL btw. Just picking three parties out of thin air really.
     
  3. otzenpunk

    otzenpunk Well-Known Member

    Yes, kind of. The FDP is a radical free market party and campaigns heavily for privatization, small government and tax reductions for rich people, which is their main focus predominating classic liberal topics like civil rights. Die Linke on the other hand is a straight socialist party. There's just no base at all in terms of economic policy for these two parties to work together in any form.

    Apart from that, the relation between Die Linke and the Greens and SPD isn't without problems as well. This is partly based on historical reasons. While Die Linke is successor of the former Eastern German state party SED, both the western Greens and the SPD back in the days joined with parts of the civil rights movement of the disintegrating GDR. Then this former SED, renamed as PDS after the German reunion, joined with a movement of SPD renegades under the leadership of former SPD and later Die Linke chaiman Oskar Lafontaine, after Gerhard Schröder forced the SPD to a strict Blairist course, and they formed Die Linke. So there's a lot of personal hostilities ongoing especially between left-wing SPD members and those "traitors" who left them out in the rain.

    Also, Die Linke embraces some radical Anti-NATO, anti-western and communist activists, which is a reason for SPD and Greens to state, that they won't find common ground with Die Linke on foreign policy. At least, this was the main official reason why the SPD joined into the last "grand coalition" with the CDU, although they would have had a majority of seats together with Greens and Die Linke at the time.
     
  4. Slo-mo

    Slo-mo Well-Known Member

    Thank you for that very clear explanation. Really does explain things better.
     
  5. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    SDP youth wing vote on grand coalition today.
    Because nothing says social democracy like pimping yourselves out to form a neo-liberal coalition.
     
    sealion likes this.
  6. mather

    mather Well-Known Member

    Like all the European social democratic parties, the SPD is on the way out as a serious political force and looks set to join the French 'Socialist' Party and PASOK in political irrelevancy. Hopefully the German Greens are also heading in the same direction.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2018
    Idris2002 likes this.
  7. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    Schultz get's over the line with 56%
     
  8. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    Schulz really has put the final nail in the SPD coffin.
    They only got 20.5% in the last election so this probably leaves the rightwing AfD as the 2nd party in Germany now.
    Will be interesting to see where the 44% who defied the party line go now. Die Linke? form a new Momentum like party?
     
  9. Idris2002

    Idris2002 A kick up the Arás

    For a lot of people, Die Linke will always be tainted by their roots in the GDR.

    So geht's die Sozialistische gang. . .
     
  10. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    What's really mad is that they are so chained to neo-liberalism that they can't even break with it to save themselves.
     
    gawkrodger, sealion and mather like this.
  11. mather

    mather Well-Known Member

    Which is why they deserve to lose support and become politically irrelevant, good riddance to them.
     
    sealion likes this.
  12. mather

    mather Well-Known Member

    Less so as time passes. The GDR is history whereas the crap neo-liberal politics of the SPD affect people and their job/living standards in the here and now and that is what is driving people away from the SPD. If Die Linke fails to benefit from this then it would be down to other factors related to todays politics rather than old history.
     
    NoXion likes this.
  13. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    Its a double whammy for the AfD.
    Schulz has show himself to be so politically incompetent since taking over the SPD that a lot of observers are questioning how the fuck he managed to hold down his job in the Eu so long and advance to be president of the European Parliament.
    Hardy a ringing endorsement for the quality of representatives in Brussels.
    More fuel for euroscepticism in germany
     
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  14. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    I'm not so sure tbf. I wouldn't underestimate the distrust of Die Linke in the west just because of their associations with the DDR.
    They really struggle to get seats in western Länder outside of Lafountaines Saarbrücken (with the exception of one in Bremen I think).
    The swing of their vote is something like 20% in the East vs about 5% in the West.
     
  15. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

  16. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    German politics are in total disarray.
    Within a week of handing the leaders post to his deputy so he could take up the foreign minister position, Schulz has now given up an that too - after the incumbent Sigmar Gabriel gave him a public bollocking for constantly going back on his word. So now he's left empty handed and completely out of the picture.
    I can't see him ever being able to show his face after the political ineptitude he's shown over the last couple of months. But then again, there's always Brussels I suppose.
    Opinion polls are showing that SPD voters want the grand coalition but I haven't seen any specific to the members who will actually be doing the voting.
    oh, and Merkel's also coming under fire from her own party for being associated with this shambles.
    If the SPD members vote against the grand coalition, I assume it's back to a general election.
     
  17. Mordi

    Mordi Nihilist against nothing

    Any idea what the likely outcome would be in an another election? Does the AfD vote look stable?
     
  18. pocketscience

    pocketscience Well-Known Member

    The opinion polls (whatever they're worth now days) aren't showing any major changes for any party, from the results of the last election. So yes, they're at the very least stable.
    It will be interesting to see the outcome of the complete capitulation of Schultz within his own party over the last week.
    There could be a slight swing back to SPD or it could push more voters to AfD.
    The main polls are published on Sundays so there should be some clearer indicators by next weekend.
     
    Mordi likes this.

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