Germany 1940 - Israel 2009. shocking pictures

[tangentlama]

frogwoman - read up on the work of Arnon Soffer, he of 'demographic threat' infamy.

There is an interview with him from 2004:

Let’s view it from a Palestinian perspective. Let’s pretend you and I are Arafat and Yasser Abed Rabbo looking at the map. Look at what the Jews are going to leave us for a state. They’re going to leave us the Gaza Strip - which is no more than a crowded “prison.” Then there’s another “prison” called Hebron, and another, larger one called Samaria. Here there are 1.6 million, here 1 million, and here 1.5 million (soon to be 3 million). Each of these “prisons” is cut off from the rest. The Jews won’t permit us to have an army, while their own powerful army will surround us. They won’t permit us to have an air force, while their own air force will fly over us. They won’t allow us the Right of Return. Why should we make a deal with them? Why should we accept a state from them? Let’s wait patiently for another 10 years, when the Jews will comprise a mere 40 percent of the country, while we will be 60 percent. The world won’t allow a minority to rule over a majority, so Palestine will be ours. The fact that in the meantime Palestinian kids are being killed doesn’t matter; what matters is that Palestine will be ours.

http://jewschool.com/2009/01/06/14707/israel-and-gaza-one-geographers-prediction/

(Except now I understand that Soffer says that Israel must keep the Jordan Valley.)

I think the most we can call this is a real intent to administer ethnic cleansing. Herzl calls it 'transfer'

“We must expropriate gently . . . We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by procuring employment for it in the transit countries, while denying it any employment in our country . . . Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly.” (p41, The complete diaries of Theodor Herzl, I, 88)
Date: said between 1895 - 1904

We're seeing 'liquidation' in either small pogroms or medium-scale massacres', carried out by either settlers or state. (read 'We were given the honor' here: http://www.shovrimshtika.org/testimonies_e.asp?cat=19)

We know there is intent to transfer* Israeli Arabs is there as it was spoken of by Livni recently. We've also heard the term 'purify' and 'purification' used to describe army actions in WB and Gaza.

"I don't know what we're doing here. Purification, maybe. It's dirty here. I don't know why a good Hebrew boy should be here, so far from his home."

 

[frogwoman]

yep.

 

[durruti02]

And you believe them

The Nazis also said they faced an existential threat from the jews. Believe that too did you?

lol you really do behave thick on these issues sometimes spion .. do you really not understand the differrence between understanding what a person says and agreeing with them, agreeing with their solutions and thier tactics? no wonder their is no solution for the palestinians with people like you supporting them

 

[durruti02]

fits right in the "de-development" of the palestinian economy since 1948 and also the whole concept of "they are breeding like rabbits" the so-called demographic threat and the artifically created conditions of poverty and exclusion from the workplace imposed on the palestinians since that time - it also adds to the dehumanisation rhetoric employed against the palestinians, and allows the economic destruction and falling standards of living from what was a relatively equal, prosperous society pre-1948 to be concealed, because of course if the population is increasing, and increasing more than the population of israeli jews then nothing is wrong, is it?

i have never said NOTHING is wrong now have i frogwoman .. what i am saying is IF the strategy is one of pushing out the arab population .. it is NOT happening .. in germany the jewish population was going down immediately the nazis took power and before i suspect

 

[Spion]

lol you really do behave thick on these issues sometimes spion .. do you really not understand the differrence between understanding what a person says and agreeing with them, agreeing with their solutions and thier tactics? no wonder their is no solution for the palestinians with people like you supporting them

What do I support though? In the UK I support a workplace and consumer boycott of Israeli goods and supplies to their armed forces. That is the only practical solution that can be effected from here. Do you support it?

 

[frogwoman]

that's not the point

the point is the POLICIES

 

[tangentlama]

i have never said NOTHING is wrong now have i frogwoman .. what i am saying is IF the strategy is one of pushing out the arab population .. it is NOT happening .. in germany the jewish population was going down immediately the nazis took power and before i suspect

it has already happened! (1947, 48-51, 67, 73, 77, 82, etc)
if Gazans could leave the prison-that-is-Gaza, they would have fled from the IDF onslaught.

you really are amazingly good at the art-of-denial, durruti02.

in the face of all evidences you continue viewing middle east conflicts from the foundation of utterly faulty premisses.

 

[Idris2002]

Here's one thing that should mean the Pals won't face genocide, or the reduction of their community to a pre-modern collection of tribal shreds and patches; the Palestinian diaspora, some of whom are even squirrelled away in places where the IDF can't reasonably get at them.

 

[tangentlama]

Here's one thing that should mean the Pals won't face genocide, or the reduction of their community to a pre-modern collection of tribal shreds and patches; the Palestinian diaspora, some of whom are even squirrelled away in places where the IDF can't reasonably get at them.

Agreed.

 

[ViolentPanda]

israel is not a ghetto? no techinically no .. but as a place where jes went ( fled and weer driven ) for security it has similarities

No it does not. As for "fled and were driven", you mean like the Iraqi Jews?

emotive wank? really? after the holocaust there is a reall fear still to this day .. to me this is emotive .. to most jews israel IS emotive .. i regularly speak with one holocaust survivor .. it is still very real

When I say that what you've written is "emotive wank", I mean that you're using emotional rhetoric rather than any type of reasoned argument, I'm not referring to the emotional content of the subject.

maybe? .. hard to say .. but reading the uk jewish papers papers regularly and seeing the deep emotional support for israel i suspect not

Do you speak to other Jews regularly, besides reading the occasional copy of the Chronicle, maybe belong to a couple of Jewish forums etc?
I ask because I don't see this "deep emotional support for Israel", but rather a deep support for the IDEAL AND IDEA of Israel, which is somewhat of a different thing than what (in your opinion anyway) seems to boil down to "I'm for the state of Israel right or wrong".

 

[ViolentPanda]

every time an israeli or zionist speaks you see it .. maybe you just do not want to hear it .. yes we can agree a million times on the historic mistake of zionism .. but it for the jews is no more a mistake than very other nationalism that destroyed one or more other cultures in its wake

Well, oddly enough I was speaking to an Israeli, in Israel, early this morning (their breakfast time), my cousin Clara, in fact (and her hubby, and her many children ). We talked about what's going on, and a point that she made (without any prompting from me, I might add) was that "the man on the street" tends to exist several notches below the angst-level (her words) of the idiots in the Knesset, who tend to profit from people being wound up and angry. Now she's just an average working class stiff from a working class family living a working class life, but she doesn't feel that she's in the midst of an existential crisis, and she's by no means a peacenik.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Funniest kind of ghetto I ever saw - one that is armed to the teeth and imprisons large numbers of people and strikes at will at them and its neighbours.

The only ghetto that exists in the state of Israel is the ghetto of the mind known as "nationalist Zionism".

 

[Barking_Mad]

Does the Israeli government want to allow a Palestinian State in or next to its own territorial borders?

If your answer is in the negative, what does it do with the people Gaza and the West Bank?