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Fez909 said:
I've not heard any direct allegations, but City players going to Spain for 'treatment' and coming back from injury in half the time it usually takes to recover is so common now that it's a meme
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Clearly not working out well for De Bruyne then.
 
tommers said:
Yeah the PED stuff is just me. That's not linked in any stuff I've seen.

Maybe read the Spiegel guide though



Again, the important bit of this isn't how often City broke FFP rules. It's that the whole thing is corrupt. All of it.
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How far is an article to be trusted that carries an headline calling them the FIFA FFP rules when they are, in fact, the UEFA FFP rules? As for 'systematically violating' any rules, it is still the case that City have been penalised only the once. And have their finances closely scrutinised by the game's governing bodies. Infantino, whetever else he may or may not be guilty of, did not buckle under any kind of undue pressure, but came to a settlement with a business which was doing what any business would in such circumstances, which is apply the maximum pressure to get a result when its strategic goals were under attack (and let us not forget, under attack from a set of rules which would not stand up in a court of law). Perhaps the 'smaller clubs' didn't carry the same weight, but it still remains that City's negotiating method was no different than that of any other business. Plus, the 'smaller clubs' were banned from the CL for entirely different reasons from what City were penalised for, and from each other, if I remember correctly.

It's true that the whole thing is corrupt-as is business on a worldwide scale-how could it not be? But the primary corruption lies in the illegal FFP rules, implemented by a body that stinks of corruption throughout.

It's no accident that the stuff about City and PSG, if nothing else contained there, originates in a German publication, as the whole thing has the whiff of Bayern and the bitter Rummenigge about it.
 
Fez909 said:
That's what happens when you are chemically recovered vs actually fit
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Chemically recovered? He'd been out since August. And the current injury is to the other knee.

This carries about as much weight as the bitter claims from poor losers that Leicester won the league on PEDS.
 
RD2003 said:
City haven't circumvented FFP rules, but, as I said, were penalised once, after the rules were altered contrary to what the club was previously told by UEFA, and negotiated a settlement. This is not one rule for some but the way the process is conducted with all clubs. All clubs are invited to negotiate a settlement when penalised.
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Have you read the article?. They settled without breaking the rules?
 
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sleaterkinney said:
Have you read the article?
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Yes. With regard to City, the sequence of events described seems to imply that UEFA knew that FFP was illegal and (particularly as they'd moved the goalposts) didn't want to be taken to court, and that if Infantino did anything wrong in UEFAs eyes, then this is a problem for UEFA in the first instance.
 
sleaterkinney said:
The article said champions league winners.

I'm not surprised footballers are doping, I don't think they even have blood testing or profiles. How many positives come up?
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I know the article said that. It wasn't the article I was responding to, but other posts on here.
 
RD2003 said:
Yes. With regard to City, the sequence of events described seems to imply that UEFA knew that FFP was illegal and (particularly as they'd moved the goalposts) didn't want to be taken to court, and that if Infantino did anything wrong in UEFAs eyes, then this is a problem for UEFA in the first instance.
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They did move the goalposts - in City's favour. Do you seriously think that City lived up to the spirit of the FFP rules?

More on he FFP here:
ManCity and Paris Saint-Germain: How Oil Money Distorts Global Football - SPIEGEL ONLINE - International

This is charming:
One day before Soriano signed the settlement on behalf of Manchester City, Jean-Luc Dehaene, who had led the Investigatory Chamber until falling ill in early 2014, died.

"1 down, 6 to go," Cliff wrote to a Manchester City employee who had informed him of Dehaene's death.
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sleaterkinney said:
They did move the goalposts - in City's favour. Do you seriously think that City lived up to the spirit of the FFP rules?

More on he FFP here:
ManCity and Paris Saint-Germain: How Oil Money Distorts Global Football - SPIEGEL ONLINE - International

This is charming:
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Moving the goalposts is a reference to the way City were led to believe by UEFA that they had complied in 2014, only for the goalposts to be moved at the last minute (look it up.) In the case of the subsequent settlement, in which City were fined and had a reduced CL squad imposed, it was negotiated under existing rules-and no goalposts moved. Without me having to read the article again, remind me if it's the one that gives a spuriously different set of justifications for FFP than those originally claimed by UEFA. As for the headline, it isn't only oil money that distorts football, but all money beyond a certain level. That's why we had an uncompetitive PL for so long-with City's oil money actually opening it up a bit more. Five or even six clubs with a chance of winning it this season-when could that have last been said?

Somebody connected to a football club says something derogatory about somebody else in football-now this clearly needs investigating, as it may never have happened before.
 
RD2003 said:
Moving the goalposts is a reference to the way City were led to believe by UEFA that they had complied in 2014, only for the goalposts to be moved at the last minute (look it up.) In the case of the subsequent settlement, in which City were fined and had a reduced CL squad imposed, it was negotiated under existing rules-and no goalposts moved. Without me having to read the article again, remind me if it's the one that gives a spuriously different set of justifications for FFP than those originally claimed by UEFA. As for the headline, it isn't only oil money that distorts football, but all money beyond a certain level. That's why we had an uncompetitive PL for so long-with City's oil money actually opening it up a bit more. Five or even six clubs with a chance of winning it this season-when could that have last been said?

Somebody connected to a football club says something derogatory about somebody else in football-now this clearly needs investigating, as it may never have happened before.
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The article says how City inflated income and then used backroom dealings to get around FFP.
 
sleaterkinney said:
I can't seriously believe that someone thinks City is all above board.
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Maybe you can't (perhaps because you support a club that's had it nose put out of joint by City's rise), but the football authorities who scrutinise goings-on at the club clearly do, as City have only been penalised the once, and even then only because of a snidey rule change at the last minute.
 
RD2003 said:
Maybe you can't (perhaps because you support a club that's had it nose put out of joint by City's rise), but the football authorities who scrutinise goings-on at the club clearly do, as City have only been penalised the once, and even then only because of a snidey rule change at the last minute.
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Genuine LOL.

You remind me of me when I used to argue about the Tevez deal.
 
sleaterkinney said:
The article says how City inflated income and then used backroom dealings to get around FFP.
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Surely for the last time-the backroom dealings are what happens when UEFA invites the penalised club to come to an agreement. All penalised clubs do this and will obviously try to work things out to their best advantage.

The key is in the words 'the article says.' Do you believe everything every article you read claims, or only when you desperately want to?
 
RD2003 said:
Maybe you can't (perhaps because you support a club that's had it nose put out of joint by City's rise), but the football authorities who scrutinise goings-on at the club clearly do, as City have only been penalised the once, and even then only because of a snidey rule change at the last minute.
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No, I think that it's owners underwrote massive losses in contravention of FFP, do you deny this happened?.
 
The important bit of this isn't the FFP stuff.

Clubs have essentially been blackmailing the governing bodies in order to remove competition and ensure that they remain in the positions of power. They are removing competition except for carefully managed and agreed scenarios.

Whether City spent too much for a few years isn't really what it's about.
 
RD2003 said:
Surely for the last time-the backroom dealings are what happens when UEFA invites the penalised club to come to an agreement. All penalised clubs do this and will obviously try to work things out to their best advantage.
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Fucking hell, did you read the article?

Manchester City leadership was furious. The meeting in Nyon had been "a disgrace," raged the club's chief legal adviser Simon Cliff, and the deal they had hammered out with Infantino, he complained, had been disavowed by the Investigatory Chamber. He sent out a confidential memorandum with the title: "POSSIBLE LEGAL ACTIONS."

Cliff considered overwhelming UEFA with lawsuits. He felt that "UEFA doesn't respond to anything other than aggression" and he wanted to take both Platini and Infantino to court in Switzerland for abuse of office and conflicts of interest. He also had it out for the auditors of PwC. It is possible, he wrote, that a lawsuit "could destroy the entire organization within weeks." He went on: "If PWC was under threat, you could then imagine them suing UEFA for damages and, if they collapsed, all their creditors suing UEFA too."
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tommers said:
You realise that City would have their membership of this "Super League" guaranteed for 20 years no matter what right?

Give it up mate. You're not some force for good disrupting the establishment. You are the establishment. Plucky little multi-billionaires.

FFP is meaningless anyway. At least for some clubs. This all clearly shows that.
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The thing is, though, that the rest of the PL could get together and try to block any English clubs moves towards a breakaway. I doubt if they will, though. Even though the ambitions of most club owners amount to no more than staying in the PL and creaming off whatever money they can. Like turkeys, almost all of them voted for FFP despite the implications for their own clubs.
 
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sleaterkinney said:
Fucking hell, did you read the article?
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Yes, it's what you call a tough business negotiating stance, or ruthlessness. Fuck's sake, how do you imagine the world works?

And laughably, you seem to be under the impression all this must have been one-sided.
 
tommers said:
The important bit of this isn't the FFP stuff.

Clubs have essentially been blackmailing the governing bodies in order to remove competition and ensure that they remain in the positions of power. They are removing competition except for carefully managed and agreed scenarios.

Whether City spent too much for a few years isn't really what it's about.
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I know-City's owners have been merely joining in.
 
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