Feminism and a world designed for men

Discussion in 'theory, philosophy & history' started by friendofdorothy, Apr 28, 2019.

  1. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    Last time I asked a Battersea resident friend - a couple of yrs ago - it was £6 for an "all day pass", and that for an APG with no adventure in it.
     
  2. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    No-one has said it's irrelevant, they've said it's not the be all and end all, which is a perfectly fair comment. Engels himself acknowledged (in "The Condition of the Working Class in England") that working class women bore a double burden - that of productive AND reproductive labour. It's about class AND sex AND race.
     
  3. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    I'm finding it hard to be lectured on this by a Green Party supporter.
     
  4. Manter

    Manter Lunch Mob

    Play the ball not the man ffs
     
  5. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Oh please.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  6. Manter

    Manter Lunch Mob

    There are two pages of men bitching at each other, and now you’ve made it personal so we face more of the same. It’s quite, quite ridiculous. This is a thread about feminism not individual’s personal issues with one another
     
    spanglechick, Sweet FA and weepiper like this.
  7. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    This thread is littered with personally driven beef and has many play the man not the ball instances. Your request to me to play the ball not the man as if I was the first is quite something.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  8. friendofdorothy

    friendofdorothy it is so much worse than Thatcherism now

    Basic equality might be a start.

    But I don't think we are anywhere near yet. Could it achieve some change in culture that would be beneficial for women if we achieved this, maybe, maybe not, who can say as we are not there yet. I'd be interested to see any stats on just how represented/paid women are at every level, I suspect it's nowhere near 50/50.

    I would argue its only as increasing numbers of women have made inroads to jobs/trades/professions over the last 100yrs, that the changes have happened. Would we have 'equal pay', maternity benefits at all if women hadn't pushed for it? These things wasn't on the patriachal male agenda til women demanded them.

    You seem to diss what Winot and spanglechick said as the 'trickle down effect' - I thought they were talking about a change in cultural understanding. Wasn't the 'trickle down effect' Tory speak for it didn't matter if some people got rich, that wealth would trickle down to others? I don't believe it ever existed.
     
    mango5 likes this.
  9. Sweet FA

    Sweet FA ✪ Three rounds Lord, in my .44 ✪

    Ah come on. VP's picked you up here; I'm interested in your answer to him; not how well you can swerve it. Who cares who's said what beforehand?
     
    TopCat likes this.
  10. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Not trying to swerve. Can see why it might come across like that. It was more just digging a poster who has a very good knowledge of history and class struggle and then votes Green.
    But not fair and apols to VP. Will answer when I finish work.
     
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  11. friendofdorothy

    friendofdorothy it is so much worse than Thatcherism now

    Any ideas on feminism?
     
  12. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    More that by freeing up the rich (or more properly capital) - by reducing tax, regulations, union power etc - you would have an overall increase in wealth, the benefits which would be felt across society.
     
  13. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Ok so how do potential and actual female CEO's fit into this? I think Engels would have said they are the class enemy and that they oppress far more than are oppressed as a result of their sex.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  14. friendofdorothy

    friendofdorothy it is so much worse than Thatcherism now

    yes. like I said a Tory idea with nothing to do with women or changing patriachal culture
     
  15. redsquirrel

    redsquirrel This Machine Kills Progressives

    Well I think Gramsci is trying to draw the analogy between the trickle down wealth and a trickle down of social capital, i.e. just as freeing the up ability of capital/bosses to gain economic capital didn't help most people, ensuring a gender equality of bosses won't see a trickle down of gender equality for most people.

    Note I'm not saying I agree with the analogy, or that I think it is a good one, just how (I think) it is connected to the recent discussion.
     
    Pickman's model and Gramsci like this.
  16. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    It's certainly worthy of inclusion and debate.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  17. friendofdorothy

    friendofdorothy it is so much worse than Thatcherism now

    Thanks I know what he said and I disagreed with it. He has used the 'trickle down' argument on threads about women before, I disagreed then too.
     
    Poot likes this.
  18. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Why do you disagree? If you have posted on this please signpost me.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  19. scifisam

    scifisam feck! arse! girls! drink!

    Oh FFS. :facepalm: Do you even know what you're doing here?

    Women, know your place!
     
    Manter, friendofdorothy and Poot like this.
  20. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Please elucidate?
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  21. weepiper

    weepiper Jock under the bed

    Anyone who does is looking at this and seeing it's turned into the TopCat show and thinking what's the point.
     
  22. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Leave you to it then. Save you running to Mummy (FM) and screaming ban him again.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  23. Sweet FA

    Sweet FA ✪ Three rounds Lord, in my .44 ✪

    I respect your politics and I generally rate your posts. I don't get you on feminist threads though. Is this all re certain women posters and their views re trans? Manter asked you about the post first and I was kind of just repeating what she said really. You didn't reply to her though.
     
    scifisam likes this.
  24. TopCat

    TopCat Zap it!

    Discuss elsewhere?
     
    Pickman's model and Sweet FA like this.
  25. friendofdorothy

    friendofdorothy it is so much worse than Thatcherism now

    #428
    Stop wasting our time. This thread isn't about class issues, isn't about you and you don't listen. You sucking all the air out of this good discussion.
    I'm feeling polite. Now fuck off.
     
    scifisam likes this.
  26. Poot

    Poot Everyone's a superhero, everyone's a Captain Kirk

    This is excruciating.

    TopCat another poster brought up a similar argument several pages back. We discussed it at length then. Please feel free to read it at your leisure.

    And stop spouting Engels. It's really not helpful here.
     
    Manter and scifisam like this.
  27. Manter

    Manter Lunch Mob

    The women trying to debate on here have a very wide range of views on trans issues, so I suspect this is just about women.
     
    spanglechick, Sweet FA and Poot like this.
  28. Gramsci

    Gramsci Well-Known Member

    If your referring to my posts of my three recent examples one has been from the workplace and two not (adventure playground and my old housing Coop).

    So in practice most of my (limited) political activity has not been challenging capitalism in the workplace.

    To repeat in my old housing Coop , I and a few others, did manage to argue for and achieve equal numbers of men and women in the housing Coop. It had been disproportionately male and run by men. Some of them somewhat macho.

    This was a cultural change for the better. Which took time.

    On adventure playgrounds. This is about campaigning for childcare. This imo is just as important as workplace struggles. As childcare does still fall on women more as a responsibility trying to keep adventure playground open is going to help local women.
     
    Pickman's model likes this.
  29. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    I'm a Green Anarcho-Communist. You got a problem with that?
     
    friendofdorothy likes this.
  30. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    I have no beef with you. I corrected you, and mentioned Engels' position. If you disagree, then elucidate your disagreement. Don't make snide remarks. It doesn't suit you.
     

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