FC United of Manchester

[revol68]

firstly i'm making presumptions about business models not about you.

The point is that you will see a rise in commericialism, they will get entangled with allsorts of contracts and sponsorship deals, their will be a need for professsional business managers, PR people, directors and this will undercut the internal democracy, eventually making it little more than a mechanism for choosing between different sections of the clubs directors.

And if it's just a matter of the money going into the club that's fair enough but remember the reason for wanting the money to go into a club is so they can suceed and at present Man Utd are doing pretty alright (and yes paying the Glazers mortgage is distinctly worrying). If Man Utd get left fucked over ala Leeds by the Glazers dealings I will continue to support them, the heart of football is that irrational passion of supporting a team as a child until you die.

 

[Chorlton]

firstly i'm making presumptions about business models not about you.

<sighs>

I suppouse your one of those people who thinks...

The point is that you will see a rise in commericialism, they will get entangled with allsorts of contracts and sponsorship deals, their will be a need for professsional business managers, PR people, directors and this will undercut the internal democracy, eventually making it little more than a mechanism for choosing between different sections of the clubs directors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_and_provident_society

I will continue to support them, the heart of football is that irrational passion of supporting a team as a child until you die.

you do make me laugh you stupid hoor - Fair play, Your continued support from the pub is a constant source of pride to all in M16

 

[revol68]

you do make me laugh you stupid hoor - Fair play, Your continued support from the pub is a constant source of pride to all in M16

What way do you want it? Either I become a rich day tripping (afterall short of a lottery win i won't be able to afford more than at very very most three games a season at the moment) prawn sandwhich eater so maligned for ruining the atmosphere at OT and allowing the Glazers to pay off their debt by continuously rising ticket prices or i'm a pub plastic.

And I suppouse you think all those people crammed into pubs to watch teams they care passionately about but can't afford to go to games are just plastics, afterall it's not like the team can hear their support? What about all the fenians that were dancing down the Falls Rd after youse lifted the title?

 

[Chorlton]

no... lets be clear about this, you are a pub plastic, there is no debate on this

 

[revol68]

no... lets be clear about this, you are a pub plastic, there is no debate on this

and no doubt when i get the funds together to see them next season I can be promoted to a Glazer rimming day tripper.

face it OT holds 76,000 yet Man United have millions of fans, the vast majority of which have to watch them in the pub. FFS there are manc kids who have to watch their local heroes in a Witherspoons thanks to the ridiculous price of Premiership football!

 

[Chorlton]

What about all the fenians that were dancing down the Falls Rd after youse lifted the title?

right, another thread has been revolled so i see no need to carry it any further, but for the third time could you stop using that term - now i don't want to hear that how as the son of a rangers fan you can use that term or whatever the fuck your excuse is, i just want you to stop throwing it around when an argument isn't going your way

 

[revol68]

right, another thread has been revolled so i see no need to carry it any further, but for the third time could you stop using that term - now i don't want to hear that how as the son of a rangers fan you can use that term or whatever the fuck your excuse is, i just want you to stop throwing it around when an argument isn't going your way

I'll use it if I want, afterall atleast I live in Ireland and was brought up catholic,I might cheer on Man Utd from the pub but I don't sit in Manchester and talk about Huns. So tell me what's worse plastic pub support or plastic pub sectarianism?

 

[g force]

ho ho ho

I was waiting for some joker to post that. I suppouse Barca players earn 300 quid a week and Barcelona aren't a huge business concern with a massive turn over.

That's not what you said though is it? You asserted that once a club becomes big it will just conform to the rest of the teams ways of being run. Of course Barca makes a lot of money - we have 75,000 season ticket holders FFS!

I never said they were on £300 a week. But, owned by approx 150,000 fans, we elect the president (again not perfect, but better than most). This season we've had a shirt sponsor for the first time. But we're giving money to Unicef - percentage of player wages and ticket sales.

I never claimed it was perfect, but neither would any FCUM fan about their club. But it's a damn site better than selling out to a fat Yank and his debt wheeler dealing

 

[revol68]

That's not what you said though is it? You asserted that once a club becomes big it will just conform to the rest of the teams ways of being run. Of course Barca makes a lot of money - we have 75,000 season ticket holders FFS!

I never said they were on £300 a week. But, owned by approx 150,000 fans, we elect the president (again not perfect, but better than most). This season we've had a shirt sponsor for the first time. But we're giving money to Unicef - percentage of player wages and ticket sales.

I never claimed it was perfect, but neither would any FCUM fan about their club. But it's a damn site better than selling out to a fat Yank and his debt wheeler dealing

It's essentially the same, afterall I'm a communist so I don't particularly see anything more in Barcelona than capitalism with a friendlier face. The only issue then becomes what is better for the club as a footballing team, how much does the business management interfere with that, their success and the experiance of the teams fans.

There are certainly reasons to oppose Glazer and his mental mortgage but the whole point of opposing him is because he's jeopardising the team you support, so I don't see what's gained by giving up your support for that team, and as far as I'm aware most FCUM fans and members are still strong supporters of Man Utd.

 

[moose]

The point is that you will see a rise in commericialism, they will get entangled with allsorts of contracts and sponsorship deals, their will be a need for professsional business managers, PR people, directors and this will undercut the internal democracy, eventually making it little more than a mechanism for choosing between different sections of the clubs directors.

Only if the majority of members vote for it.

If Man Utd get left fucked over ala Leeds by the Glazers dealings I will continue to support them, the heart of football is that irrational passion of supporting a team as a child until you die.

As will I, and the majority of FC fans, except my support no longer extends to putting money in the club's pocket.

 

[revol68]

Only if the majority of members vote for it.


As will I, and the majority of FC fans, except my support no longer extends to putting money in the club's pocket.

Yes but the simple fact is that if FCUM want big success then the logical outcome will be in favour of specialisation and the development of a professional caste. It's shit but it's the reality of the economic system we live in.

On the matter of paying off Glazers mortgage, well no point telling me, i've only travelled over to see man utd once away at Portsmouth, as a few posters have mentioned just a few times. Like I said earlier, if I give the Glazers the ticket money I'm day tripping bastard responsible for the lose of atmosphere and the exclusion of youngsters from overpriced games and if I keep what little money i have i can be a plastic pub fan.

it's a shitty position to be in.

 

[moose]

The majority of FC fans I speak to are just enjoying the ride. I think a lot of us have revised our ideas about what constitutes 'big success' over the last couple of years.

As for you, why are you bothered what people think? If you want to go to OT, go, and enjoy it. My dad and sister, still go (for now), and I don't hold it against them.

 

[revol68]

The majority of FC fans I speak to are just enjoying the ride. I think a lot of us have revised our ideas about what constitutes 'big success' over the last couple of years.

As for you, why are you bothered what people think? If you want to go to OT, go, and enjoy it. My dad and sister, still go (for now), and I don't hold it against them.

yeah i'll be pleased if FCUM do well but I think some people (mostly those more interested in the politics of FCUM than the football) need to have a more realistic perspective on the possibilities and limits of such a set up within capitalism.

Wasn't being entirely serious on that last point, was just making a point to some people on here. As it is I'll probably try and head to two or three matches depending on how flush I am.

 

[Chorlton]

Yes but the simple fact is that if FCUM want big success then the logical outcome will be in favour of specialisation and the development of a professional caste. It's shit but it's the reality of the economic system we live in.
.

i'm really struggling to see what the point you are trying to make is - 'as FC get bigger they will have to employ more people to do specific jobs' - is this the point you are trying to make?

 

[revol68]

i'm really struggling to see what the point you are trying to make is - 'as FC get bigger they will have to employ more people to do specific jobs' - is this the point you are trying to make?

well it's abit more than that, perhaps if you use some inductive reason you can draw it out yourself, of course I did draw out the point earlier.

 

[Chorlton]

well it's abit more than that, perhaps if you use some inductive reason you can draw it out yourself, of course I did draw out the point earlier.

so... as the club gets bigger they need to employ more people and this will ultimately lead to their collapse due to the nature of capitalism.



Revol do you have a team of monkeys helping you type this shit?

 

[revol68]

so... as the club gets bigger they need to employ more people and this will ultimately lead to their collapse due to the nature of capitalism.



Revol do you have a team of monkeys helping you type this shit?

oh please do keep up you simple minded mick.

it's not a matter of size but that if they wish to grow to compete with the really successful teams they will have to develop specailist layers to run the club day to day, to negotiate contracts, tv rights, sponsorship, they will essentially have to people in the cut and thrust of capitalism, and this will lead to a widening of a gap between ordinary club members and those running it, so it becomes less about direct democracy and more about voting for a certain set of management and directors.

 

[moose]

you simple minded mick.

Cut that out.

 

[tarannau]

y'see Moose. Look at the plastic gobshites your team attracts. You must be so proud to have him as a ringpiece, I mean spokesman, for your team.

All mouth, no local connections- he's the perfect plastic fan for the Sky TV generation. Specialising in disseminating unoriginal, odious little soundbites on bulletin boards and talking shit over tv coverage rather than going to see games.

Revol's great isn't he - like a little amusing facsimile of a real fan, desperately trying to be accepted as genuine by throwing himself into insults on behalf of his adopted team. Love it - you should see his invective when he gets behind his oher favoured teams, dear to his heart yet geographically far away and strangely successful. You should see him on Golf forums for example, where he'll stick up for his buddy Tiger Woods with vigour, slagging off Parnevik's trousers and telling 'youse' lot in the chasing pack to to fuck off. Precious.

<pats Revol on head>

"Calm down dear, you're only a plastic fan'

 

[revol68]

Cut that out.

the joke is he wishes he was still a mick, whilst i am.

 

[revol68]

All mouth, no local connections- he's the perfect plastic fan for the Sky TV generation. Specialising in disseminating unoriginal, odious little soundbites on bulletin boards and talking shit over tv coverage rather than going to see games.

And what local connection do the Celtic fans in Ireland have, or the Rangers ones? But I bet if I was to come out and say I supported one of the old firm it'd be accepted as perfectly legitimate, no?

 

[tarannau]

And what local connection do the Celtic fans in Ireland have, or the Rangers ones? But I bet if I was to come out and say I supported one of the old firm it'd be accepted as perfectly legitimate, no?

They're numbnut irrational religious types. Whereas you're just a (plastic) numbnut.

 

[revol68]

They're numbnut irrational religious types. Whereas you're just a (plastic) numbnut.

well it's more ethno nationalism than simply religion but aye. Still I'd rather be a plastic numbnut with the wit to follow a team in a decent league than be one of the Old Firm muppets who pretends to themselves it means anything to win that league. Thankfully aged 7 I had more wit than many in this country, or more honestly my da prefered me to support an English side to aovid the sectarian baggage, well I suppouse I had the wit to reject Everton.

 

[Chorlton]

the joke is he wishes he was still a mick, whilst i am.

what in fuck are you wittering about now you tiresome cunt?

 

[revol68]

what in fuck are you wittering about now you tiresome cunt?

your plastic paddiness, another dull lil celt in exile, it's funny though even prods can get infected with it once they move to England, all of a sudden they start to care about being Oirish.

 

[Chorlton]

your plastic paddiness, another dull lil celt in exile, it's funny though even prods can get infected with it once they move to England, all of a sudden they start to care about being Oirish.

what fucking plastic paddiness?

i don't even support a national fucken team

would it be better for you if i sat in the fucken bot with a shiny man utd shirt on? clearly.

seriously is there a fucking book out there on how to be MmMSkyscraper that i missed on a best seller list or what the fuck is attracting these fucken cretins to these boards?

 

[revol68]

what fucking plastic paddiness?

i don't even support a national fucken team

would it be better for you if i sat in the fucken bot with a shiny man utd shirt on? clearly.

seriously is there a fucking book out there on how to be MmMSkyscraper that i missed on a best seller list or what the fuck is attracting these fucken cretins to these boards?

oh come now Chorlton you are clearly a chuck. You take offence at me using fenian whilst you bandy about hun, typical blinkered approach from a celtic fan.

Anyway whilst you've been sitting there calling me a plastic for supporting Man Utd since I was 7, you've never told me why you support Celtic?

 

[tarannau]

well it's more ethno nationalism than simply religion but aye. Still I'd rather be a plastic numbnut with the wit to follow a team in a decent league than be one of the Old Firm muppets who pretends to themselves it means anything to win that league. Thankfully aged 7 I had more wit than many in this country, or more honestly my da prefered me to support an English side to aovid the sectarian baggage, well I suppouse I had the wit to reject Everton.

Cor blimey, an Oirishman with the 'wit' and originality to support one of the highest profile glory teams in the world, Man Utd. Never heard the likes of that before. I mean really. You'll be telling me you can butter bread next. Cor blimey, stone the crows - what a strikingly original fellow you are.

Are you always this delusional fella? I'd get a grip - you're just another one of those hundreds of thousands of gobshite plastic fans.

 

[revol68]

Cor blimey, an Oirishman with the 'wit' and originality to support one of the highest profile glory teams in the world, Man Utd. Never heard the likes of that before. I mean really. You'll be telling me you can butter bread next. Cor blimey, stone the crows - what a strikingly original fellow you are.

Are you always this delusional fella? I'd get a grip - you're just another one of those hundreds of thousands of gobshite plastic fans.

were Man Utd one of the biggest glory teams in 1987?

Note I've never claimed to be original, i'm just pointing out that if i'd supported one of the Old Firm no one would bat an eyelid. So fuck it, rather a plastic red than a muppet pretending a sectarian sideshow in league of nobodies has anything to do with football.

 

[Chorlton]

oh come now Chorlton you are clearly a chuck. You take offence at me using fenian whilst you bandy about hun, typical blinkered approach from a celtic fan.

Until you mentioned it i never equated the term hun with anything other than a rangers fan, in fact judging by robert mckie in the observer i was not the only one:

Why this hun's on the run
Robert McKie
Sunday May 18, 2003
The Observer

They say Tierra del Fuego is pleasant at the moment - as are Ulan Bator,
Antarctica, Pitcairn Island, Mount Everest and the Galapagos archipelago. I
know because I checked them all out last week.
Then I remembered hearing about Boulby, in Yorkshire: the home of Britain's
Underground Laboratory for Dark Matter Research (honestly). And I knew
straight away where I would be heading this week - for the Boulby laboratory
has been built in an old mine where delicate instruments, stored deep
underground, monitor rare cosmic particles in an atmosphere of blessed
silence and complete darkness.

For a hun - a Rangers fan - it is this week's dream location, a sanctuary
where there might actually be a chance of escaping the gibbering hordes of
sombrero-hatted, chanting, triumphalist, banner-waving green-and-white
bedecked Celtic-supporting lunatics who have been wrecking my life and
driving me mad ever since their team limped past Boavista last month and
slinked their way into the Uefa Cup final. Cash-strapped boffins could make
a fortune for British science by renting out that mine to equally desperate
Rangers fans, I reckon.

now, if you tell me that it is now used as a blanket term to insult 'protestants' then fair enough i will stop using it, but thats certainly news to me and robert here.

now could you stop calling me a fenian and a mick?

Anyway whilst you've been sitting there calling me a plastic for supporting Man Utd since I was 7, you've never told me why you support Celtic?

i call you a plastic because your support does not extend beyond the interent and the pub - i couldn't give a fuck what your reasons for your support or non-support are you don't go to games - you are a plastic, as your man says, with no link to the town or to the club.