FA Cup Final thread 2019

[The39thStep]

City for me and the first domestic treble. That's an incredible feat when you think that it's something that managers like Ferguson, Mourinho and Wenger and teams like Liverpool never achieved it despite their dominance .

 

[1927]

City for me and the first domestic treble. That's an incredible feat when you think that it's something that managers like Ferguson, Mourinho and Wenger and teams like Liverpool never achieved it despite their dominance .

And the fact that they didn’t have the budget that Man City have!

 

[editor]

I remember coming to meet you in a pub somewhere near Marylebone to deliver your cup final ticket 11 years ago today!

And I remember being told to 'sit down' by stewards at the game. At a cup final, FFS!

 

[The39thStep]

And the fact that they didn’t have the budget that Man City have!

I think Utd broke a few transfer records in those days and the amount Chelsea spent was massive for that time. Must be a way of working out transfer spend in comparative values .

 

[Mr Moose]

And I remember being told to 'sit down' by stewards at the game. At a cup final, FFS!

No sitting down during the semi-final fortunately, not in the ‘singing section’ anyway. A good lesson Palace taught us.

 

[Lord Camomile]

Watford mate going to Wembley: "I've been waiting 35 years for this so I'm going to enjoy it (unless we get stuffed)".

The troll in me wants to remind him I'm 34, but don't want to spoil his day

 

[1927]

Watford mate going to Wembley: "I've been waiting 35 years for this so I'm going to enjoy it (unless we get stuffed)".

The troll in me wants to remind him I'm 34, but don't want to spoil his day

Enjoy. I still get goosebumps just thinking about the Fact that Cardiff even got there. Enjoyed the day despite the result. I’d love to do it again. Hope you win.

 

[Lord Camomile]

Enjoy. I still get goosebumps just thinking about the Fact that Cardiff even got there. Enjoyed the day despite the result. I’d love to do it again. Hope you win.

It's only him that supports Watford, I'm essentially clubless these days.

But yeah, think that's his attitude too - enjoy the day out, result be damned (to a point... ).

 

[newbie]

I think the only 'magic' that's left in the FA cup is in the early opening rounds where non-league teams do battle with even smaller non league teams. As soon as all the little teams are out and the millionaire teams take over it all gets a bit meh.

The FA is comprised of lots of little FAs, all of which get an allocation of tickets for the final, so it involves the people that keep amateur football ticking along at village and sunday morning in the park level. In that sense, as well as the giant killing rounds, it's more grounded than the League Cup.

 

[Lord Camomile]

"Hot Cross Barnes"

Haven't heard that one before

 

[Lord Camomile]

Oof.

Thought he was offside initially, but doesn't look like it was.

Hold steady, Hornets.

 

[agricola]

... and this is how not to play a Guardiola team

 

[agricola]

One more City goal and one of South London's football records will have gone

 

[editor]

Proof indeed about how big fat money has destroyed any magic the cup had left.

 

[Mr.Bishie]

Proof indeed about how big fat money has destroyed any magic the cup had left.

Blew my 5-1 bet out the window!

 

[tommers]

Boo.

 

[editor]

Worst final I've seen in a long, long time. Monster money club with near infinite resources crush infinitely smaller opposition. It was like watching an exhibition match. Fuck the Premier League.

 

[editor]

Yep:

This is City’s problem. They are too good – and that has brought to the surface concerns about their ownership and financing that perhaps should have been more prominent earlier. There is no doubt that Pep Guardiola makes players better, and there is no doubt that City have spent their money incredibly efficiently. But equally the scale and source of those resources is something unprecedented – even if the latest Uefa investigation does not prove wrongdoing. Saturday’s final was not a game; it was a strangely gruesome exhibition.

But Saturday was miserable, the traditional showpiece of the English season reduced to a grim parade, devoid of any drama, there to satisfy the propaganda wing of a faraway regime. Perhaps some people enjoy watching eviscerations like this: Romans, after all, flocked to the Colosseum for fixtures between lions and Christians that were only marginally less one-sided than this. But even City fans did not seem particularly enthused, grumbling on the underground about a fifth trip to Wembley this season and cheering goals with the weary satisfaction that used to be reserved for a top-flight team battering a minnow in the third round.

Greed has won, big finance has won. Whatever small role elite clubs still play in the local communities from which they grew is dwarfed now by their position as global brands. It is desperately sad to say it but if the future is more mismatches like Saturday’s, or the sort of coronation procession that so many leagues have now become, maybe the least bad solution is just to let them go, let them have their super league.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/19/manchester-city-sky-blue-smashing-of-watford-proves-football-is-broken

 

[stavros]

I think Utd broke a few transfer records in those days and the amount Chelsea spent was massive for that time. Must be a way of working out transfer spend in comparative values .

They did, although I think both had other teams who could match them in spends. Blackburn, Newcastle and Liverpool were big spenders in the 90s, and United could certainly match Chelsea in the early Abramovich days.

I've not seen any authoritative study on real terms player inflation, although I think it probably rather high. I vaguely remember Dean Saunders going from Derby to Liverpool being the British transfer record when I first got into football, at £2.9m. Roberto Baggio was the world record, at about £7m to Juve.

 

[RD2003]

Nobody's laughing now as Manchester City become 'the biggest and the best' | Daily Mail Online

 

[Athos]

As a Luton fan, I thought it was the best FA Cup final for many years. W***ord adding to the record they already set this season - conceding the quickest ever PL goal - with some others:

Biggest FA Cup final defeat at Wembley.
Equalling biggest defeat ever.
Only team to make two FA Cup finals without scoring a goal.
Only team to allow two players to each score two against them in an FA Cup final.
Lowest ever attendance at FA Cup final at 'new' Wembley.

There's a new helpline for the bedwetters:

0600 101010
Oh, six, oh, oh. Won nothing, won nothing, won nothing.

 

[editor]

Excellent bit of writing:

Pep looked less like a happy football coach watching his side make history and more like an anguished scientist whose prototype civil defence robot has just run amok at a trade show, slaughtering several bystanders. It looked as though he understood that the very scale of the victory had begun to devalue it, that City were now in the territory of negative marginal returns, that the reaction to this turkey shoot would go beyond appreciation and congratulation, towards accusation and perhaps even condemnation.

At Wembley, City brought on three substitutes – Kevin de Bruyne, Leroy Sané and John Stones – each of whom would have been the best player in Watford’s team. There’s no magic or mystery about why their squad is so strong. They have a net transfer spend of more than £1.2 billion over the 11 seasons since the 2008 takeover. That’s almost 50 per cent more than their closest rival over that period – the Qatar-funded PSG – and half a billion pounds more than the team in third place, Manchester United.

To neutrals, City’s success is not an inspirational sports story. It’s just another depressing example of the Matthew principle we see at work in almost every economic arena, with the rich leveraging their wealth and power to get richer, and the rest left further and further behind. Free markets might sound good in economic models, but in real life they always seem to end up getting cornered, and City have had this one where they want it for a few years now.

It’s been the most successful week in City’s history, and the pity is that their manager, fans and PR department have seldom sounded more angry. It’s time to accept that oil-funded success and mass popularity are never going to go together. It’s as though City are perched on the back of a dragon, peering down at a sullen populace, wondering incredulously why they are not loved. Shouldn’t it be obvious?

Ken Early: City’s domination has been bought – and they’re paying the price

 

[Mr Moose]

As a Luton fan, I thought it was the best FA Cup final for many years. W***ord adding to the record they already set this season - conceding the quickest ever PL goal - with some others:

Biggest FA Cup final defeat at Wembley.
Equalling biggest defeat ever.
Only team to make two FA Cup finals without scoring a goal.
Only team to allow two players to each score two against them in an FA Cup final.
Lowest ever attendance at FA Cup final at 'new' Wembley.

There's a new helpline for the bedwetters:

0600 101010
Oh, six, oh, oh. Won nothing, won nothing, won nothing.

As a Watford fan we’ve missed you over the last few years? Where on Earth have you been?

Seriously, congratulations though. New stadium beckons for a good team. Can see you being fine in the Championship, then who knows.

No point having rivals if we never play and I love WFC Lootown derbies. Almost certain to meet in one of the cups.

 

[Mr Moose]

Worst final I've seen in a long, long time. Monster money club with near infinite resources crush infinitely smaller opposition. It was like watching an exhibition match. Fuck the Premier League.

It’s still 11 v 11 and plenty of teams have given City a game this season. We did for 20 mins. But we played a more attacking line up than them. Madness with our defence.

Naive and a bit inept. Our bad rather than a sea change in football. We’ve had a big six for years and football has been a repulsive business ever since.

We needed to borrow Dyche for the first half and bore them to death.

 

[Athos]

As a Watford fan we’ve missed you over the last few years? Where on Earth have you been?

Seriously, congratulations though. New stadium beckons for a good team. Can see you being fine in the Championship, then who knows.

No point having rivals if we never play and I love WFC Lootown derbies. Almost certain to meet in one of the cups.

We've been clawing our way back from an unprecedentedly harsh series of points deductions. But three promotions in five years, lifelong fans owning the club, and a new ground on the way, mean we're on our way. Sure it won't be long before we meet in the league again (though, being realistic, it's more likely to be the result if you bring relegated than us going into the premier).

 

[newbie]

At Wembley, City brought on three substitutes – Kevin de Bruyne, Leroy Sané and John Stones – each of whom would have been the best player in Watford’s team. There’s no magic or mystery about why their squad is so strong.

Did anyone watch the womens Champion League final, which took place at exactly the same time? Lyon (who have the same financial dominance as City, but Europe wide) went 4 up quite quickly, with a short sharp hattrick. From halftime on they coasted and fundamentally, to my eye at least, appeared to pull their shots when they got the opportunity, which was quite often. If they'd taken the City approach they could have had 10. Towards the end they somewhat negligently let Barca get one back.

I think that must have come from the manager (a man btw). So which is the preferable approach in a high profile final? To manifestly crush and humiliate, or to do so less overtly but more arrogantly?

 

[Lord Camomile]

So which is the preferable approach in a high profile final? To manifestly crush and humiliate, or to do so less overtly but more arrogantly?

I'm torn on this one. I get that it seems like an exercise in humiliation to keep pummeling a team, but I also feel anything other than giving them your best could be classed as patronising.

If you're genuinely pulling your shots and just ambling around, that's almost more humiliating, I think.

 

[newbie]

I'm torn on this one. I get that it seems like an exercise in humiliation to keep pummeling a team, but I also feel anything other than giving them your best could be classed as patronising.

If you're genuinely pulling your shots and just ambling around, that's almost more humiliating, I think.

'genuinely', I don't know, but it was my impression.
I think that was my feeling too, better to go down to a proper thrashing than to feel so utterly worthless because they can't be bothered with you.

ps it's on youtube. Some good football, particularly the first half.

 

[Lord Camomile]

'genuinely', I don't know, but it was my impression.

Wouldn't surprise me, we've seen it in countless other games. I suppose there's the argument to be made, at least in some cases, that once you feel you have the game won you might not play at 100% to conserve energy/avoid injury, but in a cup final with no more games..? (Although, of course, in the example of the Champions League most of them will have some fairly important games coming up in the summer! )

ps it's on youtube. Some good football, particularly the first half.