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Extinction Rebellion

SpackleFrog

Smash showy bell-bottom pants and sporty haircuts
So... I don't think ER are really doing direct action at all. They're just getting themselves arrested in the hope of generating sympathy among the ruling class. Instead of creating pressure around demands they seem to be sacrificing themselves in the hope that the powers above will listen.

It's completely unsustainable and well as daft.
 

Cheesepig3

Cheese. Cheese. Cats.
Not sure you've grasped the core of the concept 'seize power'
Yeah, but there's not going to be any non-democratic (lol, spellcheck wanted 'non-denominational) transfer of power in UK.

And if there is, or an attempt at one, I'll be on the other side of the barricades.

Just because we despise the contemptible toxic bastards who legitimately govern us, we don't get any moral right to force an improvement by violence.

Of course it all seems different when you're 17 or so.
 

SpackleFrog

Smash showy bell-bottom pants and sporty haircuts
Yeah, but there's not going to be any non-democratic (lol, spellcheck wanted 'non-denominational) transfer of power in UK.

And if there is, or an attempt at one, I'll be on the other side of the barricades.

Just because we despise the contemptible toxic bastards who legitimately govern us, we don't get any moral right to force an improvement by violence.

Of course it all seems different when you're 17 or so.
You don't get power by being elected to govt. And I'm older than 17 although still young for an Urb. Pickers is ancient I believe.
 

Cheesepig3

Cheese. Cheese. Cats.
You don't get power by being elected to govt. And I'm older than 17 although still young for an Urb. Pickers is ancient I believe.
Hmm, well, you certainly get authority by being elected to Government.

Power is something taken; authority is something given.


Power is illegitimate. The two terms are often used interchangeably like "risk" and "hazard", and much of the time it doesn't matter.


Anyone "seizing power", strictly speaking, is being really rather naughty.

How would anyone "seize power " without a form of violence?
 

SpookyFrank

Self-cleaning oven, the whole bit.
So... I don't think ER are really doing direct action at all. They're just getting themselves arrested in the hope of generating sympathy among the ruling class. Instead of creating pressure around demands they seem to be sacrificing themselves in the hope that the powers above will listen.

It's completely unsustainable and well as daft.
Who is going to support all the arrestees is what I'm concerned about. Probably they'll all have their charges dropped (besides that one idiot who decided to graffiti a government building with an entire police evidence gathering team watching) but if they don't they'll need court support etc. I doubt that an organisation that was pulled out of some hippie's arse three weeks ago has the resources to do that.
 

Pickman's model

every man and every woman is a star
Yeah, but there's not going to be any non-democratic (lol, spellcheck wanted 'non-denominational) transfer of power in UK.

And if there is, or an attempt at one, I'll be on the other side of the barricades.

Just because we despise the contemptible toxic bastards who legitimately govern us, we don't get any moral right to force an improvement by violence.

Of course it all seems different when you're 17 or so.
If there is an attempt to seize power then, you say you'll be on its side being as a seizure of power from below unthinkable if unarmed while one 'from above', from disgruntled elements of the ruling class and armed forces much more likely, albeit still currently improbable
 

Pickman's model

every man and every woman is a star
Who is going to support all the arrestees is what I'm concerned about. Probably they'll all have their charges dropped (besides that one idiot who decided to graffiti a government building with an entire police evidence gathering team watching) but if they don't they'll need court support etc. I doubt that an organisation that was pulled out of some hippie's arse three weeks ago has the resources to do that.
By government building do you mean the women of WW2 memorial?
 

Edie

Well-Known Member
Yeah, but there's not going to be any non-democratic (lol, spellcheck wanted 'non-denominational) transfer of power in UK.

And if there is, or an attempt at one, I'll be on the other side of the barricades.

Just because we despise the contemptible toxic bastards who legitimately govern us, we don't get any moral right to force an improvement by violence.

Of course it all seems different when you're 17 or so.
That’s an interesting pov. And true.
 

TopCat

Organise...
Who is going to support all the arrestees is what I'm concerned about. Probably they'll all have their charges dropped (besides that one idiot who decided to graffiti a government building with an entire police evidence gathering team watching) but if they don't they'll need court support etc. I doubt that an organisation that was pulled out of some hippie's arse three weeks ago has the resources to do that.
Well speaking to a good mate (who was nicked on a bridge last week) they just collected their details and dropped them off in deepest North London.
 

Miss-Shelf

I'll meet you further on up the road
Who is going to support all the arrestees is what I'm concerned about. Probably they'll all have their charges dropped (besides that one idiot who decided to graffiti a government building with an entire police evidence gathering team watching) but if they don't they'll need court support etc. I doubt that an organisation that was pulled out of some hippie's arse three weeks ago has the resources to do that.
This may or may not be in process
I spent last night waiting in Bromley police station (with others) to meet 4 people who'd been arrested (not for the graff on the way memorial) . The arrestees were all well resourced (£ and friends) and it hasn't been traumatic arrests. Their details are passed on to *someone* . Remains to be seen if the *someones* follow up
 

SpookyFrank

Self-cleaning oven, the whole bit.
Just because we despise the contemptible toxic bastards who legitimately govern us, we don't get any moral right to force an improvement by violence.
They use violence against us but we can't use violence to stop them from doing so? Horseshit.
 

Cheesepig3

Cheese. Cheese. Cats.
They use violence against us but we can't use violence to stop them from doing so? Horseshit.

Depends who is doing the violence.

I've no problem with battering a copper who's overdoing it.

Who, exactly, are you categorising as ripe for a kicking/stabbing/bombing/shooting? How do you decide who receives the violence? By whose right?
 
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