Discussion in 'protest, direct action and demos' started by Jeremiah18.17, Oct 27, 2018.
a bit of both
So right now Trafalgar Square is bigger, or at least _denser_, than it was yesterday, but there's still a fair sized camp outside Westminster Abbey, a smaller one near the Treasury, and people are still on Whitehall though that's clearly the focus of the most cop attention rn.
Well that's a strange moment. I just passed Boris Johnson's dad in the street and he had an ER sticker on.
He addressed them earlier, and in support of them.
BJ's whole family is turning against him.
I've just thought of a few witty things I could have said. Too late.
Cops have started clearing tents and stuff.
Just keep it in your head in case it happens again.
South end of T Sq below Nelsons Column at the junction.
Mass clearance imminent?
Not sure, I left a couple of hours ago, that's someone elses twitter.
Trafalgar Square is the "allowed" protesting spot under the Section 14. So yeah that didn't last long I guess.
You can't have a civil disobedience movement that goes where it is told, surely?
Well, they didn't, they kept on at the other sites until cleared and are still there, and they were right to do so. Cops have really jumped the gun clearing things this early though.
OK dokay. If they want to play it that way....
Yeah. Is just that the concept itself seemed odd. Personally, I'd have wanted them anywhere BUT in the allowed zone.
I went down for a mooch earlier and had a good look around, we went to T Sq, MOD, and then round the long way to Whitehall.
Hung around a bit for Barry Gardiner's speech, he was making all the right noises and explicitly ruled out a coalition with anyone if they form a minority govt. They expect to bring the independents along with them for votes on New Green Deal and all that stuff. This may or may not be news to people here but I'd not heard that before and am not sure how much salt to take it with, a pinch or a shovel.
Anyway that's not why I'm posting...
Saw the people protesting outside the MOD and was taken aback at their ages, one lady must have been 75-80 and was carried off by the cops. They were quite careful but they had to be as there was no resistance at all being shown. Lots of clapping and cheering (which we joined in with). I counted circa. 100 police of various levels, including a sprinkling of TSG, that's a lot of old bill for 10 protestors so shows how they can keep a lot of police busy for a long time with small numbers.
Went round to Whitehall where people were locked together, you could smell the angle grinders working. Police riot shields used to protect the protestors faces from the sparks and stuff. Which makes a change I guess....A decent crowd of people shouting encouragement, some confused tourists. It was kind of a half kettle, you couldn't get through the line of police from T Sq but we walked around via Embankment and could get through easily. I guess it stops the 2 spots from meeting up. Like a valve.
We went to give the arrested people a cheer and a clap and started chatting to a very nice, mc lady from Oxford. She'd never been on a protest before so I asked her if they were talking to the police at all. She said they'd been told not to chat to the police this time. We had a little chat and I passed on some of my learnings from my fairly limited protest career (in comparison to people on here), she was a little taken aback at some of it. Hadn't really heard of the CJA protests, didn't ask her if she knew about the road stuff. Anyway, I hope she's OK and they don't find out the hard way what the cops are capable of.
Must admit I found the interpretive dance element of it all thoroughly grating, but I wish them luck. For all our sakes. I'll look into local stuff possibly but they definitely need some wiser heads in there.
Sorry if this is a little light on serious political analysis. Just some observations.
Just look at them.
With their books.
Is that the same hearse that matey-boy's head was locked on to the steering wheel on Monday morning?
I think so.
It's easier to control a bunch of people in one area than the same number spread out - partially logistically and in terms of being able to set boundaries (lots of small groups have a larger "surface area") but also police tactics are very much based on exerting control over space. I have a bit long TED talk about this but basically my theory is that it's always a battle over who defines what space is used for. So occupation is treated as much more significant than it might seem based on what it actually does.
Moving everyone to one space is thus considered a win, and has the practical effect that you can then close down that space more easily, as well as mop up stragglers in other areas without so many personnel. (They don't actually have that many cops there - there are lots but there are only so many. They can't do a concerted attack on more than one site at a time.)
I think we may be talking at cross-purposes - I meant it seemed odd that XR even countenanced going to a place where they would cause minimum disruption, at the behest of the police. I'd have taken it as a pretty clear statement of the police saying "your action is of minimal value if performed here, and you will make it easier for us to manage you".
Which I'd expect any half-competent protester to interpret as "be anywhere but here" iyswim.
Well, they haven't moved in general; this was what happened the last time and it didn't really work then either. TS is larger but people at other sites haven't budged. I thought whitehall would have been cleared but it hasn't been.
Brilliant stuff spitfire. a picture can be worth a thousand words, as they say. Thankyou.
No worries, thank you for the kind words.
Do you know what the people with the weird red dresses and white faces* are meant to signify, spitfire ?
* - not that this is unusual in XR...
statues, call themselves Red Brigade
the red is blood
They are performance artists types, from Bristol I think, who have been doing the walking statues thing since long before XR existed.
Cheers. So would they be completely motionless when these pics are taken (I’d figured they were marching in a lot of them)?
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