Discussion in 'protest, direct action and demos' started by Jeremiah18.17, Oct 27, 2018.
We all long to hear that London Bridge is down
I'd be surprised if Extinction Rebellion had anything to do with it, unless they have been engaged in some seriously deep infiltration of the London Taxi Drivers Association.
I'm quite happy to intervene in a violent incident in which someone is perpetrating a misuse of authority (or power).
I don't like collective blame of groups (the rich, Eton old boys, union members, blacks, middle class white guys) and advocacy of violence against them.
I'm sure that now I have explained, you will agree with me.
yer right- it was taxis.
Jesus these people are a bloody menace. I can't imagine their leadership is State, no undercover would be that blatant.
Long and quite painful interview with them on Novara. I am trying to see the good in what's going on with them, but they don't half make it hard to see that through all the horrendous and ignorant politics.
Their entire mo is based round criminalisation of their movement
I agree. I am really invested in the urgent necessity to address climate change and I've drifted in and out of climate change protest since the early '90's(Like many on here) but I'm not finding the substance with XR (yet?)
Aside from any general criticism of accountable nonviolent direct action, the way Roger Hallam presents what Extinction Rebellion is up to in the Guardian video (posted up thread) seems really misguided. People pledging their willingness to face the consequences of committing acts of civil disobedience is one thing, but turning around to the coppers and publicly suggesting that they get buses and make mass arrests, so you can win, just seems delusional. It's like calling the local sheriff's office from an Alabama lunch counter to remind them to bring the Alsatians.
I know, but this is a step towards criminalising even those people involved who can't afford prison time. Anyhow various folks have made sure it's flagged with ER and suggested they talk to a lawyer.
I find the fact that they've rejected consensus decision making (nice idea but a massive pain in the arse irl) in favour of something called holocracy. That does indicate a critical attitude to social movements of the past.
What's that then?
I mean, it's basically a cell structure as used by terrorists worldwide, but someone with an MBA branded it.
So when the police infiltrate they are fucked.
Also cuts the ready time of new members considerably, when there's no 'membership' as such or centralised approval system. Like, grab some mates, put on the T-shirts and off you go.
the guardian predictably love them
HS2 work halted by overnight protest on nature reserve
"Extinction Rebellion style", as though lock-ons were invented by Roger bleedin' Hallam. Seriously state of that paper sometimes you'd think it was being run by Leonard from Memento.
The Age of Social Media being what it is, some twats will prioritise grandstanding over effectiveness or outcome. But this sort of civil disobedience has been slowly normalising for decades now, to a point where it's becoming something to actually aspire to. It fits perfectly with in a time when everything is documented live and commented on before it's even finished.
Though I have no doubt that sooner or later will come new legislation to counter these cellular techniques; ways of criminalising smaller gatherings on less evidence would be my guess. Possibly also attempts at criminalisation of closed message groups, it may be unenforceable but that's never stopped a government before.
I think the idea is to build up numbers and then start taking NVDA in situations like this.
Even if they weren’t Royal they’d still have power due to their enormous wealth and the amount of land they own.
Do you think they’re just pantomime figures or something?
So the thread about climate change has managed about 26 posts this year. That is just over 2 a month.
The thread largely criticising a group protesting about climate change has managed about 330 posts in a month.
So very Urban 75,
And now for something completely different.
The UKs CO2 emissions have already dropped to levels last seen in the 1890s
Britain's CO2 Emissions Have Fallen to Levels Last Seen in 1890
The UK is on the road to the phase out of coal (the Radcliff, Drax and Kingsnorth Climate Camps were anti coal generation)
Lazards review of the levalized costs of electricity generating showed that renewables are becoming cost competitive with thermal fossil fuel plants (and exceeding them) [for the US but the global trend in similar]
These protests are pushing at a door that is already opening. People want clean air for their cities, cheap energy for their homes and a stable climate for their children. Low carbon energy sources, public transport over cars and improving housing insulation are all easy policy wins to achieve the former. Extinction Rebellion are off their arses and doing something. That makes them alright in my book. What they are doing is one tiny part of a huge global effort to attack an enormous problem from multiple angles.
4th warmest year ever measured and a mild el Nino brewing.
If sitting your arse in a road helps in the tiniest bit to bring the inevitable switch to a low carbon economy quicker, fair fucks to them.
What's it look like when you factor in flights from / to UK airports?
And I know a few climate change activists who enjoy their down time a few thousand miles away and don’t get there by boat.
I’m surprised that hydrogen isn’t being leapt on as an alternative vehicle fuel.
Last seen in the 1890s except in the 1920s
As with electric vehicles, you still need an energy source to produce the hydrogen, so it's no panacea for climate change.
I'm with you, these people are natural allies of mine. I am on their side. I do fear though that their response is disproportionate to the problem they seek to solve, and until we see more people willing to go to prison for 30 years for climate activism, rather than just risking mere arrest, and taking the fight into targeted transport and power infrastructure sabotage, and properly-funded cyber attacks on the top C02 polluters, and other more sustained undermining of the oil economy, the state is going to successfully minimise them, brush them off as the ship sinks.
30 years prison eh?
Separate names with a comma.