Explain the attraction of Jazz please....

[ViolentPanda]

I like some jazz a lot, Coltrane, Miles Davis, Joe Henderson, bits and bobs here and there. I even, momentarily, quite enjoyed its fusion with techno and DnB. Having said that, it's use and fusionable nature should be approached with caution - namely the travesty that is acid jazz, which is probably the single most repellent musical form ever, and its ubiquity in restaurants and bars which should be clamped down upon by the necessary authorities.

Are you saying you think acid jazz is worse than jazz-funk?

 

[jbob]

Courtney Pine. Beat that.

 

[jbob]

Are you saying you think acid jazz is worse than jazz-funk?

Sometimes its hard to know where to direct your loathing most effectively. Perhaps we should agree to spread the hate?

 

[Dubversion]

Courtney Pine. Beat that.

to be honest, much as I loathe him, I don't loathe him as much as the others mentioned.. I guess cos NOBODY takes him seriously

 

[Dubversion]

Sometimes its hard to know where to direct your loathing most effectively. Perhaps we should agree to spread the hate?

I'm more than happy to lump fusion, jazz funk and acid jazz together to be honest. Lots of the same fans and the same scene.. all filth

 

[ViolentPanda]

Courtney Pine. Beat that.

People always mention him, and album-wise I reckon he's a disappointment, but he's also one of the few Jazzers I've seen live that actually got me up and grooving, and as an habitue of the Capitol jazz festival for a long while, I saw a lot of live performances.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Sometimes its hard to know where to direct your loathing most effectively. Perhaps we should agree to spread the hate?

You have a point.

Mind you, at least "acid jazz" waas slightly jazz-based, jazz-funk (well, most of it) wasn't jazz, and it certainly wasn't funky!

 

[chemn]

There was a sort of point in there, that saying you 'hate jazz' is a bit iffy when you may like certain offshoots and fusions with other things.

I can't stand that stuff you hear and someone will be sat there, spliff in hand, saying something like "It's all bout the notes he isn't playing", though.

Fnah!! I've never heard anyone say that, but I can't wait until I do

 

[ViolentPanda]

I'm more than happy to lump fusion, jazz funk and acid jazz together to be honest. Lots of the same fans and the same scene.. all filth

I'm almost ashamed to admit that if I went to a party in the 80s where the DJ put on a jazz-funk record, I'd get near the decks then "accidentally" stamp hard on the floor.

 

[damnhippie]

nothing to understand about jazz...listen to 'kind of blue' or ella fitzgerald singing 'i got it bad and that ain't good', or oscar peterson playing 'hymn to freedom'...

just beautiful, simple sings played with soul.

i think the negative stereotype of jazz is covered by a relatively small and easily ignorable part of the genre.

 

[gentlegreen]

Yes, some jazz appears to be mostly for the benefit of the musicians themselves.

And don't take Dub's purist line too seriously either.

Weather Report, Chick Corea, Airto Moreira, Keith Jarrett, even Azymuth .. all have their place. If it feels good, do it ...

"Kind of Blue" is indeed a rare gem.

 

[Dubversion]

And don't take Dub's purist line too seriously either.

i'm no purist, thanks. Just don't like fusion

Weather Report, Chick Corea, Airto Moreira, Keith Jarrett, even Azymuth .. all have their place.

yes. Propping up a new bypass.

 

[wishface]

I like some jazz a lot, Coltrane, Miles Davis, Joe Henderson, bits and bobs here and there. I even, momentarily, quite enjoyed its fusion with techno and DnB. Having said that, it's use and fusionable nature should be approached with caution - namely the travesty that is acid jazz, which is probably the single most repellent musical form ever, and its ubiquity in restaurants and bars which should be clamped down upon by the necessary authorities.

got to agree with that. pretentious shite.

 

[jbob]

You have a point.

Mind you, at least "acid jazz" waas slightly jazz-based, jazz-funk (well, most of it) wasn't jazz, and it certainly wasn't funky!

I think my slight favouring on the most wretched front for acid jazz is based on its visceral exposure to me during the late 80s/early 90s; I was mercifully a bit too young to witness the full horror of the fusion vanguard and its ungodly practices. All those backwards cap wearing tossers smarming up the place were certainly proto-Nathan Barleys, and, it is my contention, bear much responsibility for the gentrification of much of London. Forget your property developers, Jamaroquai is more to blame for social inequality.

 

[Dubversion]

Forget your property developers, Jamaroquai is more to blame for social inequality.

i think you're onto something.

 

[Dirty Martini]

Every time one of these threads comes up, I put one of my handful of jazz records on and think "Yeah, maybe this time". Today it's Home Cookin' by Jimmy Smith, which is great. But I never seem to get beyond what I have already. There doesn't seem to be enough time, or something's missing for me.

One day.

yes. Propping up a new bypass.

Heh, like that

 

[jbob]

It's too late now, I fear. As previously mentioned, its malign influence permeates eateries and bars across the capital, submerging a collective consciousness into an illusionary feeling of superiority that those outside the loop 'don't get it'.

On a slightly related note, I once got up and left the house after a girl I had just had sex with put on a Jamaroquai LP. I think this answers anyone considering questioning my principles.

 

[maya]

There are so many types of jazz, that- time permitted- there's very likely that you some day, somewhere, might hear something you'd dig...
However, I can't guarantee it, since there's so much about jazz which is off-putting: the obligatory focus on virtuosity which at best encourages a few steps outside the box but at worst descends into egocentric, directionless solowankfests...

Of course, if the "noodling" is what you hate, you might like more old-fashioned and bluesy trad or big band stuff or even swing...
Louis Armstrong, Count Basie, later bandleaders like the awesome Charles Mingus-
All the experimentation in the 70's, well 'righteous', political ensembles like Art Ensemble Of Chicago...
Afrofuturism: Sun Ra, on the star train to Uranus...
Soul jazz: Lonnie Liston Smith
Free jazz: Peter Brötzmann- skronk horn deathray screams

I know exactly what you mean when you say you loathe "jazz jazz"- The clichéd type of jazz that you think about when the word is mentioned... But believe me, there's a whole world of fantastic experimentation, obscure connections, collaborations, bastard genre fusions and mad sonic pathways... That can colour your ears with this thing which might be called 'jazz' but which isn't-jazz because it BURNS and will set your EARS on FIRE man...

</ record hippie nerd rant >

 

[8ball]

to be honest, much as I loathe him, I don't loathe him as much as the others mentioned.. I guess cos NOBODY takes him seriously

It's a name I've heard a lot but don't really associate with anything so I looked him up on youtube.

 

[Paulie Tandoori]

jazz is as important for the notes that they don't play, as for the notes that they do play

That's what my friend's dad told me years ago. He was talking about Count Basie but i think the point is well made. It's about people doing things musically which are unexpected, unusual, sensual and synchronistic. I love listening to jazz music cos is sounds marvellous when it can do all those things

 

[poului]

utuj78h9yiyukh

Does anyone else find there to be a distinctly insecure streak of reverse snobbery regarding the criticisms levelled at jazz? What exactly is wrong with a passionate focus on technique and musicianship in your work?

 

[8ball]

jazz is as important for the notes that they don't play, as for the notes that they do play

I find with the kind of jazz that inspires those kinds of comments, I am in broad agreement.

The less notes they play, the better it is.

 

[poului]

The less notes they play, the better it is.

Well, that's Tony Braxton out of the picture, then.

 

[Paulie Tandoori]

I find with the kind of jazz that inspires those kinds of comments, I am in broad agreement.

The less notes they play, the better it is.

Sounds like you got it to me

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I really don't get it.

I was listening to some tuneless warbleing on the radio this morning - it just sounded dreadful to me and the song didn't 'flow' at all. The music was alright, but when the woman starting singing it spoilt it.

So what is the attraction? What am I missing?

I think jazz was popular back when they made it up, because it was 'antiestablishment'.

It's not anymore.

 

[8ball]

I think jazz was popular back when they made it up, because it was 'antiestablishment'.

It's not anymore.

Hmm.

You could have a point here - things seem to vanish up their own arse when they are taken under the wing of the establishment and become 'safe'.

 

[Diamond Dog]

Hmm.

You could have a point here - things seem to vanish up their own arse when they are taken under the wing of the establishment and become 'safe'.

 

[8ball]

I was thinking of him as I was typing the post - are you telepathic?

 

[Diamond Dog]

Only in the sense that I'm thinking what thousands of others would think when someone mentions something along the lines of anti-establishment figures disappearing up their own arse

 

[danny la rouge]

I was listening to some tuneless warbleing on the radio this morning - it just sounded dreadful to me and the song didn't 'flow' at all.

It probably was dreadful. Jazz is a huge genre. It shouldn't really be one genre at all. Some of the subdivisions of jazz, I don't like at all. And within each subdivision there are artists I don't like, and some who frankly aren't any good. It'd be a shame if you decided all jazz was rubbish after hearing Jamie Cullum, for example.

If you knew who it was you disliked, it could help in finding jazz you do like. If you see what I mean. Unless you just don't want to like jazz, which is a shame, but perfectly fine, too.