Examples of creative food product bullshit

[mrs quoad]

I'm a trained barrista and I grind my own New World blend every day, before steeping it in my caffetiere and having it neat in a very, very large mug, espresso strength.

I'm not talking from ignorance here, mrs, but supreme immersion.

No, I do not like the taste of coffee. I thought I did. I was wrong.

Wookey.

If you think that's an accurate description of decent coffee, you're either way off or else you and I have qualitatively different tastebuds. Or the stuff you're getting is old roast.

Sorry, mate, but that's absolute bunk when set next to my lived experience of coffee (or, come to that, my experience as an addict and addictions counsellor )

I can't deny your lived experience; but it bears absolutely no relation to my home-roasted, home-ground, beautifully smooth and un-bitter coffee experience

 

[Wookey]

Have you only ever drank coffee in the U.S.?

France (minging, with chicory) Italy (like Sammy Davis, short and black) US (was that even coffee?) the UK (milk whether you asked for it or not...).

 

[mrs quoad]

No, I do not like the taste of coffee. I thought I did. I was wrong.

Ahhhh.

The zeal of the convert

I've been occasionally told there's nowt worse than an ex-smoker n all

O well. Until the scales drop from my bedevilled heathen eyes, I shall carry on deluding myself

 

[Xanadu]

Wookey.

If you think that's an accurate description of decent coffee, you're either way off or else you and I have qualitatively different tastebuds. Or the stuff you're getting is old roast.

Sorry, mate, but that's absolute bunk when set next to my lived experience of coffee (or, come to that, my experience as an addict and addictions counsellor )

I can't deny your lived experience; but it bears absolutely no relation to my home-roasted, home-ground, beautifully smooth and un-bitter coffee experience

You roast your own beans? Lucky bugger

 

[mrsfran]

Why? Caffeine's really bad for you. I don't want to take caffeine six times a day, it's an addiction.

So you, as someone self-confessedly completely addicted to caffeine, think you know best about decaffeinated coffee? To turn your own question back on you, when was the last time you had decaffeinated coffee?

Clearly, the caffeine in coffee is what's most important to you. However, I neither need nor want the caffeine. Please don't apply your addiction to me

 

[soulman]

So you, as someone self-confessedly completely addicted to caffeine, think you know best about decaffeinated coffee? To turn your own question back on you, when was the last time you had decaffeinated coffee?

Clearly, the caffeine in coffee is what's most important to you. However, I neither need nor want the caffeine. Please don't apply your addiction to me

Why do you still want real coffee once a month. Playing with your addiction?

 

[Herbsman.]

That may be but it's got sweeteners in it to make it taste equally sugary.

I think you've completely missed the point. My point was that this is misleading marketing.

Do you not see that they're trying to make this out to be some sort of special magical wonder-product by saying "this is normal sugar, but it has 33% less calories per spoon", rather than telling the truth, which is "this sugar has different shaped particles to normal sugar, which make its density lower. however, you could achieve the same effect by simply using less sugar."

Things like decaffeinated coffee and alcohol free beer are obviously not examples of creative food product bullshit like this 33%-fewer-calories-per-spoon sugar, so I'm not sure why people brought them up

 

[mrsfran]

Why do you still want real coffee once a month. Playing with your addiction?

Why is it important to you to imply I have an addiction to caffeine? It's honestly perplexing to me. I prefer decaffienated coffee, that's all there is to it. I don't enjoy the effects of caffeine. Do you ask the same questions to someone who has a beer once a month?

Sometimes, I forget that I don't like the effects of caffeine and think it'll wake me up, so I have some. Then I have some and am reminded that I don't like it. And life goes on.

 

[Wookey]

Wookey.

If you think that's an accurate description of decent coffee, you're either way off or else you and I have qualitatively different tastebuds. Or the stuff you're getting is old roast.

Sorry, mate, but that's absolute bunk when set next to my lived experience of coffee (or, come to that, my experience as an addict and addictions counsellor )

I can't deny your lived experience; but it bears absolutely no relation to my home-roasted, home-ground, beautifully smooth and un-bitter coffee experience

We come from directly opposite angles when it comes to addiction and recovery. I don't agree with a word you have to say on the subject, and you won't agree with a word I have to say on it. It's a good job we still have crochet in common.

It is strange, don't you think, that on one hand we have MissFran saying she likes the bitter taste, and that's why she drinks it, and you who says there is no bitter taste.

Are you asking me to believe that you both have different tastebuds?

As far as I know, coffee (fresh, roast and ground) tastes bitter. That's the point of coffee. That's why people tend to sweeten it - to make it taste better.

If you don't sweeten it, it doesn't disprove my point, it just means you are more deluded than most about why you drink it.

 

[Wookey]

So you, as someone self-confessedly completely addicted to caffeine, think you know best about decaffeinated coffee? To turn your own question back on you, when was the last time you had decaffeinated coffee?

Clearly, the caffeine in coffee is what's most important to you. However, I neither need nor want the caffeine. Please don't apply your addiction to me

I had one a few weeks ago at a mate's house. She's sworn off caffeine, and it was all she had in, so against my better knowledge I had one (because I needed a coffee).

Of course, it was a very empty experience, because there was no caffeine. Take the caffeine away and I might as well drink water - in the same way, if you take alcohol out of beer, or nicotine out of fags, I might as well drink juice and breath fresh air. The enjoyment is not in the flavour, and never was.

 

[soulman]

Why is it important to you to imply I have an addiction to caffeine? It's honestly perplexing to me. I prefer decaffienated coffee, that's all there is to it. I don't enjoy the effects of caffeine. Do you ask the same questions to someone who has a beer once a month?

Sometimes, I forget that I don't like the effects of caffeine and think it'll wake me up, so I have some. Then I have some and am reminded that I don't like it. And life goes on.

I'm not implying anything. It's you who's off on one about addictions for some reason..

 

[Wookey]

Ahhhh.

The zeal of the convert

I've been occasionally told there's nowt worse than an ex-smoker n all

O well. Until the scales drop from my bedevilled heathen eyes, I shall carry on deluding myself

I doubt the scales will drop, because you seem convinced you already have the answer. But our answers are different.

 

[mrsfran]

Given that I've also enjoyed non-alcoholic beer on occasion, I think it's safe to say that the reason we enjoy things is very different. I'm all about the flavour, not the chemical effects.

 

[dessiato]

kelloggs cornflakes arent gluten free. they use barley malt flavouring which contains gluten

are you sure they do that, cos the Coeliac Society guide book shows Kellogs as gluten free and, therefore, a 'safe' food. If they've changed the recipe that could explain some problems my mother in law is having.

 

[Wookey]

Given that I've also enjoyed non-alcoholic beer on occasion, I think it's safe to say that the reason we enjoy things is very different. I'm all about the flavour, not the chemical effects.

I disagree. I think the reason we 'enjoy' things is very much the same across all humans. But we each have a different mental capacity for understanding which came first - the love of the taste, or the addiction.

Do you believe people when they say they 'enjoy' a cigarette?

Even though it tastes rank, leaves a nasty flavour in your mouth, stings your eyes, furs up your tongue, yellows your fingers, gives you cancers, turns you into an outcast, makes you wheeze, makes you dizzy....

What bit do they 'enjoy'?

Of course, they don't enjoy a single aspect of it. That's why they're desperate to give up (78% of smokers wish they weren't).

They've confused 'pleasure' with 'topping up'.

You, on the other hand, don't have the physical addiction, but I think you do labour under a mental addiction. It's strange how you keep revisiting caffeine coffee, when you know how much you don't like it, don't you think?

 

[WouldBe]

Do you not see that they're trying to make this out to be some sort of special magical wonder-product by saying "this is normal sugar, but it has 33% less calories per spoon", rather than telling the truth, which is "this sugar has different shaped particles to normal sugar, which make its density lower. however, you could achieve the same effect by simply using less sugar."

You could apply that to other products as well. Low fat cheese - eat 1/2 an ounce instead of a full ounce.

 

[Chairman Meow]

I disagree. I think the reason we 'enjoy' things is very much the same across all humans. But we each have a different mental capacity for understanding which came first - the love of the taste, or the addiction.

Do you believe people when they say they 'enjoy' a cigarette?

Even though it tastes rank, leaves a nasty flavour in your mouth, stings your eyes, furs up your tongue, yellows your fingers, gives you cancers, turns you into an outcast, makes you wheeze, makes you dizzy....

What bit do they 'enjoy'?

Of course, they don't enjoy a single aspect of it. That's why they're desperate to give up (78% of smokers wish they weren't).

They've confused 'pleasure' with 'topping up'.

You, on the other hand, don't have the physical addiction, but I think you do labour under a mental addiction. It's strange how you keep revisiting caffeine coffee, when you know how much you don't like it, don't you think?

You are Allan Carr and I claim my fiver.

 

[WouldBe]

I disagree. I think the reason we 'enjoy' things is very much the same across all humans. But we each have a different mental capacity for understanding which came first - the love of the taste, or the addiction.

Sorry I don't see that that follows. People have different tastes. Some like sweet things, some like sour and some like bitter wether there's an addictive component to it or not.

 

[Wookey]

You are Allan Carr and I claim my fiver.

Allan Carr's dead.

But he was right.

 

[feyr]

are you sure they do that, cos the Coeliac Society guide book shows Kellogs as gluten free and, therefore, a 'safe' food. If they've changed the recipe that could explain some problems my mother in law is having.

http://www.kelloggs.co.uk/products/Corn_Flakes/Cereal/Corn_Flakes.aspx shows it as one of the ingredients.

its not on the safe list i have from coeliac uk

 

[dessiato]

http://www.kelloggs.co.uk/products/Corn_Flakes/Cereal/Corn_Flakes.aspx shows it as one of the ingredients.

its not on the safe list i have from coeliac uk

Maybe the m-i-l is using an out of date copy! She loves her cornflakes in the morning, but lately has been quite ill. Her Coeliac wasn't considered because it was assumed she wasn't eating anything different! Thanks for this link, it is clearly shown there so, possibly that is why she has been ill. I'll contact her and let her know. Thanks again for letting me have that link.

 

[Wookey]

Sorry I don't see that that follows. People have different tastes. Some like sweet things, some like sour and some like bitter wether there's an addictive component to it or not.

We each have cultural preferences depending on the food we were brought up on, but I don't believe MissFran can taste bitterness, while Mrs Quoad cannot. I think they have the same kind of tastebuds set out in the same pattern, and I think the taste of coffee is the same whoever is drinking it.

What's different is their responses to it (although not that different, tbh).

 

[beeboo]

Witness coffee revels - always the last ones left in the bag, aren't they? Even coffee drinkers don't like them. That's because they have very little caffeine in.

Haha, I like coffee revels, thus destroying your entire argument

 

[feyr]

coffee revels are the whole point of revels! mmmm coffee

 

[mrs quoad]

We come from directly opposite angles when it comes to addiction and recovery. I don't agree with a word you have to say on the subject, and you won't agree with a word I have to say on it. It's a good job we still have crochet in common.

Fair point - I wouldn't go to the lengths of reading someone else's mind, interpreting their tastebuds, projecting my experience and diagnosing someone else's 'addiction' over the net Nor would I conflate psychoactive effects with 'addiction' And I hope I wouldn't be quite so bold / arrogant about how right I am and wrong they are

If you don't sweeten it, it doesn't disprove my point, it just means you are more deluded than most about why you drink it.

Ah. Yes. Here's where we're going to have to disagree about your prioritised access to The Truth, wookey. Maybe the fact that I occasionally keep my grounds in foil for an afternoon protects me from the mind control of teh truthness of teh bitterness mind controlll

 

[Yu_Gi_Oh]

http://www.kelloggs.co.uk/products/Corn_Flakes/Cereal/Corn_Flakes.aspx shows it as one of the ingredients.

its not on the safe list i have from coeliac uk

It was on mine, but I haven't looked at one in ages, I have never considered that Kelloggs would change the recipe. Sneaky bastards.

 

[WouldBe]

We each have cultural preferences depending on the food we were brought up on, but I don't believe MissFran can taste bitterness, while Mrs Quoad cannot. I think they have the same kind of tastebuds set out in the same pattern, and I think the taste of coffee is the same whoever is drinking it.

What's different is their responses to it (although not that different, tbh).

Results: Genetically-mediated sensitivity to the bitter taste of PROP was associated with reduced preferences for Brussels sprouts, cabbage, spinach and coffee beverages.

From http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FPHN%2FPHN2_04%2FS1368980099000695a.pdf&code=5c6e60f382bedbad5eecd461067b11c3

And I can't see it being down to what we were brought up on as my mum doesn't like any foreign food whereas I love it unless it's too spicey.

 

[mrs quoad]

^^^^^
mrs quoad gets weasel coffee from teh tin foil cat

 

[WouldBe]

coffee revels are the whole point of revels! mmmm coffee

I like coffee revels and coffee creams you get in chocolate selections.

 

[Wookey]

From http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FPHN%2FPHN2_04%2FS1368980099000695a.pdf&code=5c6e60f382bedbad5eecd461067b11c3

Some people have a sensitivity to bitterness, I agree. But not even that study says conclusively that there is a connection between that increased sensitivity and food choices. They cite lots of studies at the end where no connection could be made.

But even with supertasters being a reality, that doesn't mean Mrs Quoad can't taste bitter, while MissFran can - they both taste bitter. As it were. Coffee is bitter, it has caffeine and chlorogenic acids in which make it bitter. But their physical perception of that taste differs - Mrs Quoad says his coffee isn't even bitter!

(I doubt MissFran is a supertaster either, as she likes the taste of coffee and lemons, which are seem intensely bitter to PROP tasters).

And I can't see it being down to what we were brought up on as my mum doesn't like any foreign food whereas I love it unless it's too spicey.

I think it's many factors, including what we ate as kids, but also our access now to travel and increased choice, and new ingredients, and eating out more etc. The point is that coffee on it's own is bitter and astringent, and we try to make it less bitter by roasting it, soaking it in water, drip filtering it, adding milk and sugar. If coffee is such a great taste, why don't we all drink it neat, thick and black and sugarless? The majority don't, by a long stretch. I've made enough of the buggers to know.