Etymology Addiction - Brixton Street Names

[Minnie_the_Minx]

What's with the Scottish type names just off Windrush Square, or at least Saltoun and Rattray anyway.

What's all that about?

Maybe when they build a new lot of roads they keep a theme or something (eg. why Poets Corner?)

Why Endymion and Leander next to each other

Same as when they name flats - after a particular theme

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Yeah I mentioned it above, I own that. Its alright in places but it could be a lot bigger and some of the entries are really crap - like he talks about what used to be on the road and forgets all about the name itself. Disappointing. Its not bereft of merit though. It has its moment.

Sorry, didn't see that

 

[Etymologist]

Maybe when they build a new lot of roads they keep a theme or something (eg. why Poets Corner?)

Why Endymion and Leander next to each other

Same as when they name flats - after a particular theme

I can't find anything on rattray and saltoun except, indeed, that they are scottish. Leander and Endymion elude me too. But its early days yet. The information may not be sitting there clearly for me to see. Sometimes it becomes evident through tiny little clues. I really should go to the Lambeth archives.

But yeah there certainly seem to be themes. Sometimes there are references to a certain place where a landowner is from. The Minets*, a French Huguenot family, owned the land surrounding Myatts fields. In the 19th century they started building a residential estate and the road names in the are reflect some of the names of their origin in France. Ancestors of the Minets came from Cormont, Hence Cormont Road (alongside Myatts Field). Cormont is a village in Pas-de-Calais, hence Calais Street (also alongside Myatts Field).

*Hence the Minet Library, where the Lambeth archives are.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I can't find anything on rattray and saltoun except, indeed, that they are scottish. Leander and Endymion elude me too. But its early days yet. The information may not be sitting there clearly for me to see. Sometimes it becomes evident through tiny little clues. I really should go to the Lambeth archives.

Well I suppose you'll just have to guess for now like below

Endymion Road in Brixton could just be a mythological reference, or a quiet tribute to the novel by Disraeli; but since Hyperion House is only just down Brixton Hill, I'd put my money on Keats. Endymion Road in Finsbury Park, on the other hand, is part of a whole network of Disraeli-inspired street-names: Coningsby, Tancred, Lothair, Venetia and Alroy Roads, and Sybil Mews

 

[Vintage Paw]

I used to live on Willow Avenue. It had two houses with lots of willow trees in their gardens.

 

[ringo]

There is a huge amount of etymology inThe London Encyclopaedia.

It's very expensive, though I think it used to be less in the Museum Of London bookshop.

 

[Etymologist]

There is a huge amount of etymology inThe London Encyclopaedia.

It's very expensive, though I think it used to be less in the Museum Of London bookshop.

It is a truly wonderful book. My dad has a copy. I think its worth about that much. I've pre-ordered the new edition of it from amazon; it comes out in august I think. I can't wait.

 

[teuchter]

I
But yeah there certainly seem to be themes. Sometimes there are references to a certain place where a landowner is from. .

Lots of these Victorian areas were built as quite large developments quite rapidly (not unlike modern Barratt homes type developments) and the names were probably chosen at the whim of the developer/landowner. Hence bunches of adjacent streets following a certain theme. I'd guess the name choice would be based on what would sound attractive to potential buyers, and influenced by the developer's personal fancies. His favourite author or where he went on holiday that year or whatever.

In these areas I guess it's easy to read too much into the significance of a street name.

This is rather different to older parts of towns which grew more slowly and where the names are more likely to tell you something about the actual history/previous uses of the area.

 

[Etymologist]

Lots of these Victorian areas were built as quite large developments quite rapidly (not unlike modern Barratt homes type developments) and the names were probably chosen at the whim of the developer/landowner. Hence bunches of adjacent streets following a certain theme. I'd guess the name choice would be based on what would sound attractive to potential buyers, and influenced by the developer's personal fancies. His favourite author or where he went on holiday that year or whatever.

In these areas I guess it's easy to read too much into the significance of a street name.

This is rather different to older parts of towns which grew more slowly and where the names are more likely to tell you something about the actual history/previous uses of the area.

Definately. But for some reason, even though many of them are likely to be whim related, I like to discover what the word is, where, what or who it refers to, even if it has nothing to tell me about local history. It is perhas a whimsical psychogeographic notion, but I think the fact that those names are there (however it came about) has an effect (perhaps unconcious) on one's experience of the place. Knowing that Dalyell road MIGHT be named after Tam Dalyell of the Binns gives me a sense that there is something of Tam still echoing about in that street, somehow, if only in my mind. And I fully realise that most people who live in or visit the street have not the faintest care what Dalyell might refer to. For most Dalyell Road is that road, and thats that.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Was just looking for that book but it must be at other flat. However, came across "The Citties of London and Westminster: A History" (can't remember where I came across - maybe my grandfather's).

It was taken out of the Central Information Library, British Travel Association in 1966

Wonder how much they charge for overdue books

 

[quimcunx]

Yes I know that I'm asking quim for another word


PS: Now I could be wrong (as I often am), but I doubt very much that when Helix Road was so-named, many people knew about DNA

Actually I should have said RNA which is shaped like a helix or spiral. DNA is a double helix.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Actually I should have said RNA which is shaped like a helix or spiral. DNA is a double helix.

if you say so

 

[malice]

I have a book sitting on my desk called "the streets of london" by S. Fairfield, published in 1983, which is quite good for this sort of stuff. Unfortunately it doesn't have much beyond the centre - so it has Effra, but not Saltoun, Rattray etc. can have a peruse through and see if I find any good ones for brixton

 

[Bob]

.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

.

see post 27

 

[Bob]

Anyone know why Poets Corner roads are named that way?

And Mayall road?

And indeed why is Herne Hill, Herne?

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Anyone know why Poets Corner roads are named that way?

And Mayall road?

And indeed why is Herne Hill, Herne?

Herne Hill according to Wiki

Herne Hill is located in the London Borough of Lambeth and the London Borough of Southwark in Greater London. There is a road of the same name which is part of the A215.


The name Herne Hill initially appeared in 1798, when the area was farms and woodland. It has been suggested that it derives from previously being called Heron's Hill, as the River Effra attracted a large number of herons, but other explanations have also been suggested.

and from the Herne Hill Society:

It may be that the river Effra - now sadly almost all underground - attracted large numbers of herons. So that a hillock by the river came to be known as Heron's Hill. Another interpretation of the name is ‘hill by a nook of land' deriving from the Old English hyrne (corner, angle) hyll. The first reference to Herne seems to be in 1798, possibly alluding to le Herne, a field in Brixton.

 

[bluestreak]

I'm always disappointed that the Victorians hanged the name of Gropecunt Lane, the London home of medieval prostitutes.

Apparantly part of Gropecunt Lane became Threadneedle Street - an interesting pun that I'm sure doesn't need explaining and adds a new dimension to the Bank Of England being known as the "old lady of threadneedle street".

 

[gaijingirl]

Anyone know why Poets Corner roads are named that way?

no.. but I did hear this...

If you look at the Poets' Corner roads.. there is a multitude of architectural styles there. Apparently that group of roads was used by architects to build "show-homes" to promote their wares - which were then built along entire streets in central London.

(no idea if that's true or not, but heard it from an estate agent selling houses in the area............. so probably a complete lie... )

 

[oryx]

Back in the '90s/early 2000s I used to work for housing associations who were (& still are) major builders of new housing schemes. Which obviously needed names.

I had a bit of involvement in naming them. It went like this: think of either a) public figure associated with area, even a relatively recent one or b) check out the local history of the area and find an associated name.

I suspect that's how they did it a hundred years (or slightly more) ago.

My main two memories of being involved in naming blocks/schemes are:

- being overridden by the local authority as the proposed names were already in use

- winding up long-serving colleagues that they were going to have a scheme named after them. Boy, that was fun.

 

[Dan U]

good fred

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Apparantly part of Gropecunt Lane became Threadneedle Street - an interesting pun that I'm sure doesn't need explaining and adds a new dimension to the Bank Of England being known as the "old lady of threadneedle street".

 

[Dhimmi]

The interest expressed in the OP is exactly the kind of obsessive spoddism I heartily approve of.

Surely Morval Road and Trelawn Road are Cornwall references? Perhaps named by a misty-eyed and homesick developer who'd made their way to London to make a packet on a few acres of rolling fields outside of the city.

 

[Red Faction]

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en...1.470156,-0.072656&spn=0.011816,0.026608&z=15

what about this one?

 

[Dhimmi]

After John Bellenden translator to James V?

 

[Etymologist]

no.. but I did hear this...

If you look at the Poets' Corner roads.. there is a multitude of architectural styles there. Apparently that group of roads was used by architects to build "show-homes" to promote their wares - which were then built along entire streets in central London.

(no idea if that's true or not, but heard it from an estate agent selling houses in the area............. so probably a complete lie... )

If an estate agent said it I would think it is a lie. It is a clever lie though, a nice one. If you look at the houses on shakespeare road (the only one I can summon properly to memory at this moment, having walked down it more than the others) the houses certainly aren't uniform. I really hope its true but estate agents in my experience don't know anything. Or if they do, they don't tell you the truth.

Back in the '90s/early 2000s I used to work for housing associations who were (& still are) major builders of new housing schemes. Which obviously needed names.

I had a bit of involvement in naming them. It went like this: think of either a) public figure associated with area, even a relatively recent one or b) check out the local history of the area and find an associated name.

I suspect that's how they did it a hundred years (or slightly more) ago.

My main two memories of being involved in naming blocks/schemes are:

- being overridden by the local authority as the proposed names were already in use

- winding up long-serving colleagues that they were going to have a scheme named after them. Boy, that was fun.

That is very interesting. I've always wondered about that. I have found that some long serving councillors do get little roads names after them. I remember seeing a road somewhere near Canning town called "Councillor [insert name I've forgotten] close". I thought it hilariously bad naming. Burgess Park is named after a councillor I think, or a mayor of camberwell or something. I forget.

The interest expressed in the OP is exactly the kind of obsessive spoddism I heartily approve of.

Surely Morval Road and Trelawn Road are Cornwall references? Perhaps named by a misty-eyed and homesick developer who'd made their way to London to make a packet on a few acres of rolling fields outside of the city.

Ah ha! Good work. So Morval and Trelawn are both parts of Cornwall. How did I miss that. I obviously need to brush up on my googling skills.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en...1.470156,-0.072656&spn=0.011816,0.026608&z=15

what about this one?

Hahah, I doubt very much that is london's medieval area for male prostitutes. I know no one suggested that but it seemed to be come sort of rejoinder to Gropecunt Lane. I wonder how long people have used to term 'bell end'? It probably is one of those Scottish writers, William or John Bellenden, as suggested above.

Check out this roadname. Makes me laugh, sounds like rudeboys should live there just so that when people say where do you live they can rudely respond "whatman!":
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&h....044761&spn=0.009949,0.022531&z=15&iwloc=addr

 

[oryx]

Not a Brixton street name, but......

In my home town there is a street with my (highly unusual) surname.

I have no idea how it was thus named. I seem to remember asking my dad when he was alive, & he didn't know - even though he was an obsessive spod (to quote indirectly from Dhimmi! ) about local history.

I'll be trawling spoddishly through this thread for ideas on where to look.....

 

[Dhimmi]

Well if you feel I'm safe to know your surname pm me the relevant details and I'll have a spod at it.

My latest fave was Baroness von Varo, which someone chirped up about on a history site, who was apparently in the Fuhrerbunker during the last days of the Third Reich, and no one knew who she was... took two months to track her details down and if it's googled now it comes in at number one not just as the original unanswered question. Amateur history on the web is bleeding marvelous.

 

[Etymologist]

http://www.catb.org/esr/jargon/html/S/spod.html

 

[talawa]

does glenelg mean any thing or just made up Palindrome