No, sorry the BFF are linked to EDL as well. They might use it though, if they were passing.
English Defence League in Birmingham today (4th July)
- Thread starter FreddyB
- Start date
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Its a pity that a decent discusssion on how to approach the issue of the EDF/March for England demonstrations has been sidetracked by MC5s insinuation that the BNP and BFF have the same PR and marketing section.
Spion
I hear ya
From what I read you and FreddyB were saying, 'ignore them and they'll go away', e142515 was saying, 'let's make friends with them', and I said you needed to mobilise numbers if you were going to deal with a load of racist streetfighters appearing on the streets. That's my understanding of 'the discussion'
audiotech
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I hear Griffin's been on the BBC marketing the idea that 'the EU should sink boats carrying illegal immigrants to prevent them entering Europe'. I wonder how this sort of PR goes down with those in the BNP courting 'respectability' with the public?
No doubt a statement dear to the black hearts of the BFF and all.
Decent discussion? The sum total of your input is to ignore such groups.
Pressure on this pub chain to hold to it's declared policy of a 'welcoming and friendly atmosphere' in their Bistro's would be my response.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Thanks for todays update from LUAF MC5.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Do you think the BNP scored 20%+ across half the nuneaton wards in last month elections because these passing goons - a pitiful few at athat - happened to go into a pub with BNP landlord? Get some perspective man - stop chasing Hollywood nazis on the internet.
Spion
I hear ya
I'm so obsessed that I've spent about 7 minutes in the last couple of days posting on the subject. Do fuck off you tedious mental twat
Me and some others tried to set up an unemployed organisation in the late 80s. I may get round to responding to that thread at some point
audiotech
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Posting information on the sieg heiling company BNP candidates keep is not 'chasing Hollywood nazis on the internet'.
Spion
I hear ya
What, like calling them 'obsessed'? Pot meet kettle
audiotech
wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac
No probs.
Imo, things are happening at the grass roots amongst some working class communities that the far left particularly the A/Imp Left Spion represents doesn't understand indeed can't comprehend:, a reignited patriotism, a rejection of multi-culturalism, yet which embraces all races, a dislike of official diktats from above and in many cases a dislike for 'lefties' who they feel are very selective in who they champion. This is a toxic mix and I don't think there are easy answers, but you can be sure the Trotskyist left won't be the solution.
Spion
I hear ya
really? Where is manifasted?
Spion
I hear ya
I'm still waiting to hear where this grass roots movement is manifesting itself, Treelover.
And it's pretty funny that after banging on about other peoples' 'obsession' with race the first three things you say this supposed movement is concerned about are all connected with ethnicity
More accurately I'm saying that ignore them because west midlands police (in Brum on the 8th) are going to deal with them.
I'm not saying this is ideal but seems preferable to another mob turning up on the day and confusing the situation from the police point of view. Why bother if their screwed anyway?
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
Don't you think that maybe OB might be slow off the mark and they will be confronted by a large amount of angry muslim youths?
is that conducive to anything?
It is a very real possibility and not even slightly good.
I can see the argument for leafletting in the city centre the week before, targeting Asian youth (fucking sickening thing to say in so many ways) and being in the city on the day trying to influence what those youth do but not as a mob in any sense at all.
Spion
I hear ya
Who says they're screwed?
And why give a bunch of violent racist thugs the freedom to intimidate people in the centre of a British city? And freedom to recruit - because everytime these boneheads get the chance to chant their shit unopposed they'll attract other boneheads who never thought of doing that on their own.
And yes, if they get away with what they're doing it will cause Asian youth to confront them becaue they won't put up with their families getting abused and threatened while out shopping on a Saturday.
I don't want it to turn into an inter-communal scrap any more than you do, but that's all the more reason anarchs, the left and anti-racists should be there to help it become a wider response than simply a racially divided one
Boneheads? What, they were all skinheads?
Where did they abuse Asian families shopping on a Saturday?
As I said in another post, anti fascists trying to have a fight with them, will give them what they want. Not to mention anti fascists might find themselves on the end of a kicking, from people who are not that political, but are well used to street fighting.
Asians youths might give a much better account of themselves than anti fascists in a punch up with them. But again, this is what many would want to see, Asian youths fighting mainly white youths(with some black people amongst the EDL), in a middle of a town center.
spacemonkey
I Love Noodles
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=100179777051
Apparently, there is going to be a counter demo, by the usual suspects by the look of it.
Apparently, there is going to be a counter demo, by the usual suspects by the look of it.
Shame the continue to attack the working class instead of working with us well we need not The Middle Class is not time we stood up to the plate and began to take back what is ours, some years back much the same happened in Sheffield the far right went in and told the white working class of Darnhall all there ills and problems was due to Muslims, I was living there is one of the many new homes, they was informing the community was all going to Muslims
No the fact was they was buying the former slums, and living in them, over time they repaired them, a lot of land was cleared and new homes built as part of the world student games, a housing association was created for this purpose united kingdom housing, since gone bust, in 1993 things come to a head and there was a riot not on full scale as others but the streets was taken back, the left come spoke there normal diretribe, 2009 that community and others in Sheffield remain divided on ethnic lines, we only need to look at Broomhall in Sheffield, to see this another shooting of inter racial tensions, the far right know this and are exploiting the facts of poverty, it is not racist.
To speak about immigration as a problem, I agree with no borders very much, but until the left get its fucking head round, that a lot of white working class people see this as a problem and engage with them not as racist but people who have by political correctness, and the new labour project become sidelined by the wider society, and those who are negating this fact are creating the problem.
Such tensions are not new, the rise of the far right is nothing new, there seems to some form of mass hysteria from the far left as per fucking norm, and instead of engaging with the working class they what plan to go and kick them in, reclaim the streets for whom I might ask?
No until we as a working class begin to self organise and understand that making the middle class history, the middle class will blame us the working class, the far right have just become a little more clever in how they exploit this circumstance, neither them or the middle class are a solution for us the working class but ourself,s.
lewislewis
Lumumba Cymru
Lots of photos kicking around. They are clearly football-firm based.
Interesting that they sometimes call themselves the English and Welsh Defence League. Talk of union jacks, but all I can see in the photos are England flags.
It's obvious that the wider section of working class people that agree with these hooligans, will state their support on Facebook but won't turn up to any marches or demos.
Interesting that they sometimes call themselves the English and Welsh Defence League. Talk of union jacks, but all I can see in the photos are England flags.
It's obvious that the wider section of working class people that agree with these hooligans, will state their support on Facebook but won't turn up to any marches or demos.
Fuckin right. And they're planning to turn up in bigger numbers in Brum on August 8th, then later in the month in Luton.
If nothing else, these guys are being used as tools to whip up some sort of reaction from local Asian kids, provoking something that can usefully be presented as a race riot, and thereby adding to the BNP's perceived credibility.
Too right.
"The usual suspects"?
The trotsky vangard and others, like we need them to save the working class there the problem, nither left or right offer us anything..
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
The sum total of my imput is to argue that repeating the same tactics of trying to find a group of nazis to confront is exactly why 'anti fascism is in the dead end that it is.At oldham where we ended up with a riot over 35 NF supporters it was anl/uaf who ended up being no platformed and the BNP with their best vote nationally.
The trouble with the politics of mainstream anti fascism is that there are no politics,no political alternative posed by the 'anti nazis' that is why the BNP have grown. The extension of the lack of political alternative is to focus on groups like then EDL or BFF or BPP in the hope of being able to introduce the same stopped clock tactics that anl/uaf have wheeled out for the past 30 years.
As a past time being up on who the latest neo nazi cult is quite good fun but that is exactly what is should be , a past time not a political imperative.
As for the pub/bistro so what -its a local issue.They will meet elsewhere.
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