England come home

Discussion in 'football' started by palomino, Jun 13, 2010.

  1. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    Because you respond to any criticism of English football with knee-jerk nationalism and excuses! How the fuck will English football ever learn and address the problems inherent in its culture if you won't even accept they exist?
     
  2. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    That I don't.
     
  3. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    But you're arguing two different points as if they're the same thing!
     
  4. strung out

    strung out (",)

    but i agree with your criticism of the faults in english football! i just don't think that 5th to 8th best world cup record (depending on how you measure it) is that bad. we could be a bit higher up, but meh, i'm not too fussed about international football anyway.
     
  5. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    No! Football is a competitive sport. The whole point of it is winning competitions. Consistently failing to make it past the quarters isn't an anomaly or bad luck; it is evidence of a fundamental flaw.

    How does either Greece or Denmark's records compare with Italy?

    The Netherlands, population fifteen million and a league system in decline, are probably the finest example in world football of the benefits of a comprehensive grassroots programme and the benefits of a consistently self-critical analysis. England would do well to look a little closer at the Netherlands.
     
  6. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    Your criticism above would be relevant if I was extrapolating from one competition, but I'm not. Over any significant number of competitions, a failure to succeed can't just be attributed to bad luck. England's failure to progress past the later stages of competitions is down to a lack of depth - in itself inexcusable given the population and standard of league - and an inflexibility and lack of adaptability caused precisely by the way English football develops players.
     
  7. Maltin

    Maltin Well-Known Member

    Except for the 2 Olympic titles England won which were the World Championships of their time. :p

    I thought my little table above conclusively proved that at World Cup level.

    There was no final in 1950. Uruguay won the World Cup that year because their overall record was better than the other teams in the final group. :D:facepalm:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Football_at_the_1928_Summer_Olympics#Participation

    It's not to say the British weren't parochial or felt superior, but that is not the official reason for the dispute.

    None of the other top 10 teams in the world believe they can win either. :rolleyes:
     
  8. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    The whole point is winning matches ;) Put us and Uruguay in a league system, see who finishes higher. It's the difference between the FA cup and the Premiership - when Portsmouth played Cardiff in the FA cup final a few years ago would you honestly say they were better that season than Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Tottenham, Villa....?

    The (arguably) was conceding it wasn't the best example, but just because at one tournament various elements conspired for a perfect storm of events does not mean they are a 'superior' team.
     
  9. Maltin

    Maltin Well-Known Member

    They have all won the European Championships once.
     
  10. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    The trouble with Italy is they've also won the World Cup, as I conceded.
     
  11. discokermit

    discokermit Well-Known Member

    so, you're from the north but identify with the welsh team.

    you can see how i was getting confused there taff.

    plus you moan like a welshman.
     
  12. ernestolynch

    ernestolynch Banned Banned

    Fuck off you racist brummie knacker. :cool:
     
  13. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    They were also amateur you fool


    The only stat that matters is the one marked 'winner'. England's record as a national team is certainly no better, and arguable worse, that notorious under-achievers Spain, who have won two major competitions.

    T
    Ah, so you know at least a little about football. Irrelevant mind - that was the rules, Uruguay won under those rules (and also would have won in a simple knock out process too btw).

    And the official reason for the Falklands wasn't to keep Thatcher in power. The whole attitude of English football in that era was one of superiority and a condescension towards foreign football. It was collectively believed across the UK that the three best teams in the world were England, Scotland and Wales, in that order, and this attitude marred relations between British football and the rest of the world.

    N
    Believing you can win it, believing you will win it and believing you have the sole right to win it are not the same thing.
     
  14. London_Calling

    London_Calling Pleasant and unpatronising

    So that's it after the Group stage now Ledley's borked, I suppose: Dawson or Carragher . . . FFS.
     
  15. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    But Italy have a world cup record, don't they?

    Major comps are major comps.
     
  16. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    The north of Wales you thick racist fucker.

    North Walians are not Taffs - the river Taff is in the south. If you wish to apply some lazy semi-insulting term to a North Walian then at least get it right and call us Gogs you massive twat.
     
  17. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    Surely that's too much effort for someone trying to apply lazy insults? :hmm:
     
  18. ernestolynch

    ernestolynch Banned Banned

    [​IMG]
    That's the thick brummy racist's limit.:cool:
     
  19. Maltin

    Maltin Well-Known Member

    BRITISH!!!
    I'm not sure the Scots would have collectively believed that.
     
  20. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    Lol. Fair point.

    Still, I don't see why discocunt has to introduce xenophobic insults into it. I've not mentioned bowler hats or public school bumming once.
     
  21. StanSmith

    StanSmith Three Lions on my shirt

    He is no more a Brummie than Proper Tidy is a Taff.
     
  22. Lord Camomile

    Lord Camomile Lemonade socialist

    It's the thought that counts ;)
     
  23. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    You are quite right. Well, English and Scottish anyway - Wales' FA was a regional subsidiary of the English FA with no domestic league at the time, so I reckon we've got a pass on that.

    Quite right again.
     
  24. strung out

    strung out (",)

    so anyway, basically everyone agrees that england have slightly underachieved in world cups and that we should improve our system from the grassroots up. what are we having an argument about?
     
  25. discokermit

    discokermit Well-Known Member

    sos taff. didn't know you was so touchy.

    must be all the rain, bound to get you down in the end.
     
  26. Maltin

    Maltin Well-Known Member

    :D
     
  27. ernestolynch

    ernestolynch Banned Banned

    One thick brummie bastard logs out, another thick brummie bastard logs in.

    :cool:
     
  28. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    Does it not rain in England? I hope to travel there one day, I hear the streets of Dudley are lined with gold. I just need to work a few more decades down the pits and polish a few more visiting English gentleman's shoes on my bi-annual day off and then I might have enough pennies to get the horse-drawn coach to the Promised Land of milk and honey, yes massee.

    When is bigotry a-ok? When it is domestic minorities, apparently. You massive bellend.
     
  29. Proper Tidy

    Proper Tidy I killed a man

    I think it is your use of slightly compared to my use of massively.
     
  30. discokermit

    discokermit Well-Known Member

    [​IMG]


    calm down, boyo!
     

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