Employment law question re: pregnant women

[madzone]

Thanks

Thing is, never having been to where she works it may be they have a point. However I, like a lot of people, am struggling to think of a place of work that is too small for a fold up chair. Surely that's a H&S issue of its own? Fuck me, even our sheep have to have more room than that.

I'll pass this onto her. Tbh, she really needs someone to fight her corner as she's not a natural feather-ruffler (unlike her stepmother )

 

[cesare]

Thanks

Thing is, never having been to where she works it may be they have a point. However I, like a lot of people, am struggling to think of a place of work that is too small for a fold up chair. Surely that's a H&S issue of its own? Fuck me, even our sheep have to have more room than that.

I'll pass this onto her. Tbh, she really needs someone to fight her corner as she's not a natural feather-ruffler (unlike her stepmother )

Can she take a few photos? Also could she ask for a copy of the risk assessment (presumably they've now done one in order to make this H&S pronouncement).

We can give her loads of info to fight her corner, including drafting letter of grievance etc.

 

[madzone]

Can she take a few photos? Also could she ask for a copy of the risk assessment (presumably they've now done one in order to make this H&S pronouncement).

We can give her loads of info to fight her corner, including drafting letter of grievance etc.

That's a good idea about the photos

It makes me cross because she's worked for them without fuss for 8 yrs and they're being a bit cunty

Thanks again, cesare.

 

[cesare]

That's a good idea about the photos

It makes me cross because she's worked for them without fuss for 8 yrs and they're being a bit cunty

Thanks again, cesare.

NP

This sort of thing makes me cross too, from what you've told us it doesn't sound at all reasonable - quite the reverse.

 

[madzone]

She's talking about going on early maternity leave which means she'll lose her bonus (which is apparently 3 months half pay?) I hope she doesn't back down from this

 

[cesare]

She's talking about going on early maternity leave which means she'll lose her bonus (which is apparently 3 months half pay?) I hope she doesn't back down from this

I wonder whether encouraging her to go on maternity leave early is behind this? I'm not saying that's the case, but it wouldn't be the first time that an employer has done it.

As for the bonus, whether or not that's payable after the first two weeks of compulsory maternity leave depends on the rules of the bonus scheme and they're all very different (e.g. could be attendance based, could be performance based, could be just given to those in employment etc etc etc).

She definitely shouldn't back down at this stage.

 

[madzone]

Ahhhh, she's just said it's not HR who have refused her a chair - it's the manager. They haven't done her H&S assessment yet. How soon should it be done? She's about 21 weeks now. She's asking if she should contact HR and get the assessment done herself. She's also getting sore hips and tingling in her ankles.

 

[Termite Man]

She's talking about going on early maternity leave which means she'll lose her bonus (which is apparently 3 months half pay?) I hope she doesn't back down from this

That can't be right . Why would she miss out on bonus because she's on maternity leave that sounds more like discrimination against pregnant women than not giving them a chair

 

[madzone]

That can't be right . Why would she miss out on bonus because she's on maternity leave that sounds more like discrimination against pregnant women than not giving them a chair

Fuck knows. Tbh it sounds like her manager is a bit of an ill-informed cock. It's early maternity leave though, not standard

 

[cesare]

Ahhhh, she's just said it's not HR who have refused her a chair - it's the manager. They haven't done her H&S assessment yet. How soon should it be done? She's about 21 weeks now. She's asking if she should contact HR and get the assessment done herself. She's also getting sore hips and tingling in her ankles.

They should have done a risk assessment when she first told them she was pregnant - also reassess/ed if anything materially changes/ed. Long overdue now and particularly as they're relying on H&S to justify this proposed transfer.

It might be worth her having a quiet word with HR, managers don't always fully understand the implications.

 

[weepiper]

Ahhhh, she's just said it's not HR who have refused her a chair - it's the manager. They haven't done her H&S assessment yet. How soon should it be done? She's about 21 weeks now. She's asking if she should contact HR and get the assessment done herself. She's also getting sore hips and tingling in her ankles.

FFS they should have done it ages ago, it's only 8 weeks til she can start maternity leave. Ridiculous, they are buggering her about

 

[cesare]

That can't be right . Why would she miss out on bonus because she's on maternity leave that sounds more like discrimination against pregnant women than not giving them a chair

That whole issue of bonus on maternity leave is tricky and contentious. In a nutshell, it depends on what the bonus is for.

If it's just automatically given to employees because they're employees, then it's not right to with-hold it because an employee remains an employee while on maternity leave.

But if it's attendance related and/or active service related, then an employee on maternity leave isn't attending/in active service so the bonus would be pro-rata'd accordingly.

It all depends on the rules of the scheme together with what they've done in the past in similar situations.

 

[Termite Man]

Does she have a mobility clause in her contract ?

 

[trashpony]

I've just checked my maternity policy (am not pregnant incidentally!) to see what it says re H&S evaluation but it doesn't give a date. I know that I was assessed within 4 weeks of notifying the company when I was pregnant.

I would definitely tell her to contact HR herself to get her H&S check done. If she's notified the company that she's pregnant that should have kickstarted the process. As it hasn't, if I were her, I'd ring them and chase them about it.

I think companies are, on the whole, fucking hopeless when it comes to maternity (and I worked for a company that regularly wins awards for being family friendly but they were dreadful).

 

[madzone]

Apparently she told her manager she was pregnant at 7 weeks, she's now approx 21 weeks. She's said she's going to contact HR today and will get back to me.

Thanks everyone for this - I love urban for this sort of thing

 

[_angel_]

If the shop's "too small" for a chair then how the hell do customers get inside it? (Let alone ones with wheelchairs or pushchairs)..


????

I don't see how someone nearly fainting isn't a 'health and safety' issue tbh.

 

[madzone]

If the shop's "too small" for a chair then how the hell do customers get inside it? (Let alone ones with wheelchairs or pushchairs)..


????

I don't see how someone nearly fainting isn't a 'health and safety' issue tbh.

The more I hear about it the more I think it's a case of vodafone not being brilliant employers coupled with the manager not being a brilliant manager. It's probably best that I'm not nearer as I might have had words with him by now.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Apparently she told her manager she was pregnant at 7 weeks, she's now approx 21 weeks. She's said she's going to contact HR today and will get back to me.

Thanks everyone for this - I love urban for this sort of thing

I'm betting the manager hasn't bothered to inform HR.

 

[feyr]

They should have done a risk assessment when she first told them she was pregnant - also reassess/ed if anything materially changes/ed. Long overdue now and particularly as they're relying on H&S to justify this proposed transfer.

It might be worth her having a quiet word with HR, managers don't always fully understand the implications.

I've just checked my maternity policy (am not pregnant incidentally!) to see what it says re H&S evaluation but it doesn't give a date. I know that I was assessed within 4 weeks of notifying the company when I was pregnant.

I would definitely tell her to contact HR herself to get her H&S check done. If she's notified the company that she's pregnant that should have kickstarted the process. As it hasn't, if I were her, I'd ring them and chase them about it.

I think companies are, on the whole, fucking hopeless when it comes to maternity (and I worked for a company that regularly wins awards for being family friendly but they were dreadful).

Apparently she told her manager she was pregnant at 7 weeks, she's now approx 21 weeks. She's said she's going to contact HR today and will get back to me.

Thanks everyone for this - I love urban for this sort of thing

i think hr dont have to do a risk assesment untill you inform them formally, ie written confirmation. i know that i have told my line managers as soon as i know because my job involves manual handling, lone working and being put in a position where i may be kicked/punched by students. they have done an informal risk assessment, adjusting my rota if need be and making sure i dont get put with the most risky students. then when i have informed hr, i have done a more formal risk assesment with a hr advisor

 

[scifisam]

Thanks

Thing is, never having been to where she works it may be they have a point. However I, like a lot of people, am struggling to think of a place of work that is too small for a fold up chair. Surely that's a H&S issue of its own? Fuck me, even our sheep have to have more room than that.

I'll pass this onto her. Tbh, she really needs someone to fight her corner as she's not a natural feather-ruffler (unlike her stepmother )

If she sat on one of those tall folding bar stools (the kind you get with kitchen bars), she wouldn't take up any more space than she would standing, and she'd still be at almost the same height if visibility is an issue. It's simply not possible for there to be space for her standing but not space for her on a folding bar stool.

 

[Pingu]

I am at vf HQ tomorrow afternoon if its any help (will try to copies of any documentation you may need etc)

 

[Hocus Eye.]

Urban75 at its best here. Good luck Madzone and family.

 

[madzone]

i think hr dont have to do a risk assesment untill you inform them formally, ie written confirmation. i know that i have told my line managers as soon as i know because my job involves manual handling, lone working and being put in a position where i may be kicked/punched by students. they have done an informal risk assessment, adjusting my rota if need be and making sure i dont get put with the most risky students. then when i have informed hr, i have done a more formal risk assesment with a hr advisor

She got written confirmation from the gp when she was 7 weeks and gave it to her manager. She's so excited about the pregnancy that she's been doing everything related to it as soon as she can

 

[madzone]

If she sat on one of those tall folding bar stools (the kind you get with kitchen bars), she wouldn't take up any more space than she would standing, and she'd still be at almost the same height if visibility is an issue. It's simply not possible for there to be space for her standing but not space for her on a folding bar stool.

My thoughts exactly.

I am at vf HQ tomorrow afternoon if its any help (will try to copies of any documentation you may need etc)

Thank you

 

[madzone]

Urban75 at its best here. Good luck Madzone and family.

Isn't it just

Thanks.

 

[madzone]

She's spoken to the H&S rep who is sending her a form and says that she can and should have a chair. When my stpedaughter told the manager she'd go and buy a fold away one he said she'll have to move stores. He can't do that if H&S have said she can and should have a chair where she is, can he?

She's just told me that when she informed her regional manager that she was pregnant he said, 'That's the problem with female staff'

 

[ViolentPanda]

She's spoken to the H&S rep who is sending her a form and says that she can and should have a chair. When my stpedaughter told the manager she'd go and buy a fold away one he said she'll have to move stores. He can't do that if H&S have said she can and should have a chair where she is, can he?

She's just told me that when she informed her regional manager that she was pregnant he said, 'That's the problem with female staff'

Bit of a hostage to fortune, a comment like that.

 

[cesare]

She's spoken to the H&S rep who is sending her a form and says that she can and should have a chair. When my stpedaughter told the manager she'd go and buy a fold away one he said she'll have to move stores. He can't do that if H&S have said she can and should have a chair where she is, can he?

She's just told me that when she informed her regional manager that she was pregnant he said, 'That's the problem with female staff'

She needs to get back onto the H&S rep AND HR to let them know her manager's response. If she can email them, even better so there's a record. Tell her to start keeping notes of this sort of thing.

Stupid comment from the Regional Manager.

 

[madzone]

She needs to get back onto the H&S rep AND HR to let them know her manager's response. If she can email them, even better so there's a record. Tell her to start keeping notes of this sort of thing.

Stupid comment from the Regional Manager.

Yeah, I've told her to start writing stuff down. Good point about the emails - I'll pass it on.

 

[madzone]

Update - she's just been told by her manager that she has to pick a store to move to by Tuesday. Apparently the H&S report has been done (although she hasn't seen it) and 'apparently' all the vodafone people are in agreement that she needs to be moved. I've told her not to do anything until she's seen the report but what else should she do?