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Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
Counter Demonstration 14th July 2018 !
How do people feel about the way independent Anti Fascist/AFN demonstration went, particularly during the end when SUTR 'bandwagon' (literally) was given permission to usurp, promote and basically attempt to maintain vanguard and leadership of march to Victoria Station !

Was it a good idea to open up organising to other groups ?
Are their lessons to be learned from this, in my opinion aberration at best when dealing with opportunist sects and their front organisations, particularly SWP ! Organisers & stewards of anti fascist mobilisation must be pretty naive, if not easily manipulated not to think that they wouldn't pull such a stunt as they did !

If we, militant and independent anti fascists are now reliant and making SUTR/UAF figureheads of movement; what is the point of us existing as independent organisations ?
 

The Flying Pig

Active Member
Counter Demonstration 14th July 2018 !
How do people feel about the way independent Anti Fascist/AFN demonstration went, particularly during the end when SUTR 'bandwagon' (literally) was given permission to usurp, promote and basically attempt to maintain vanguard and leadership of march to Victoria Station !

Was it a good idea to open up organising to other groups ?
Are their lessons to be learned from this, in my opinion aberration at best when dealing with opportunist sects and their front organisations, particularly SWP ! Organisers & stewards of anti fascist mobilisation must be pretty naive, if not easily manipulated not to think that they wouldn't pull such a stunt as they did !

If we, militant and independent anti fascists are now reliant and making SUTR/UAF figureheads of movement; what is the point of us existing as independent organisations ?
We should be wise enough by now to know how these demos work. There are many people who want to demonstrate but certainly are not up for physical confrontation and I fully understand that. The right action for them is to leave an area where there is the threat of physical attack, for others who are not prepared to yield then you stay in the area. We are not all macho and physically or mentally strong enough to put ourselves at physical risk.
 

Red Sky

It was like that when I got here.
Counter Demonstration 14th July 2018 !
How do people feel about the way independent Anti Fascist/AFN demonstration went, particularly during the end when SUTR 'bandwagon' (literally) was given permission to usurp, promote and basically attempt to maintain vanguard and leadership of march to Victoria Station !

Was it a good idea to open up organising to other groups ?
Are their lessons to be learned from this, in my opinion aberration at best when dealing with opportunist sects and their front organisations, particularly SWP ! Organisers & stewards of anti fascist mobilisation must be pretty naive, if not easily manipulated not to think that they wouldn't pull such a stunt as they did !

If we, militant and independent anti fascists are now reliant and making SUTR/UAF figureheads of movement; what is the point of us existing as independent organisations ?
T
Your posting style has changed. Is it a shared account?
Sobered up.
 

Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
We should be wise enough by now to know how these demos work. There are many people who want to demonstrate but certainly are not up for physical confrontation and I fully understand that. The right action for them is to leave an area where there is the threat of physical attack, for others who are not prepared to yield then you stay in the area. We are not all macho and physically or mentally strong enough to put ourselves at physical risk.
It's not a case of being 'Macho'; I presumed, as a general rule adopting the tactic of mass direct action partly would be to counter that culture and that there a plenty of roles just as important, if not more that people can play in anti fascist movement that do not involve confrontation, if they choose not to ! Being manipulated as was done last Saturday and negotiating to the level of subservience was counter productive at best !
 

19force8

For the avoidance of faith
My understanding was that the demo was not called on the premise of mass confrontation, but as the start of the process of rebuilding active anti-fascism in the unions and working class generally. This was a sensible approach given the massive imbalance of forces on previous major demonstrations (<50:1) and uncertainty about numbers on the day.

On the whole it was successful - there were a lot of union members and banners there. Even the attack on Hedley and co. will work to our (& his) advantage in pushing for greater involvement in the future.
 

Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
Any news on alleged stabbing of D F L A supporters in M anchest er & counter demo or attempts at retaliation ? :eek:
 
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Patteran

A nowadays excuse
Any news on alleged stabbing of D F L A supporters in M anchest er & counter demo or attempts at retaliation ? :eek:
The three fellas that got stabbed in Piccadilly Gardens? Wasn't political (in a narrow sense). Bucket hats vs lumpen teens in a late night clash, if we're referring to the same incident.
 

Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
From Facebook !


Stabbing of D F L A supporters Manchester ! Muh ammad H arun Has hashin Hu sayn shared a post. 18 August at 21:35 · Salaam brothers, 3 main members of an is lamophobic group called the D F L A have been stabbed in Manchester last night. Tomorrow on Sunday 19th August the D F L A will attack Did sbury P ark M asjid some time between 12-2pm. When our own homes are attacked why is it we go crazy then but not when Allah's house is attacked? Brothers are requested to surround the Ma sjid at 11.30am onwards 2 71 B urton R oad M 20 2WA Please share to make others aware even if you cant make it!!

Mu slim De fence Le ague M D L 17 hrs · There were a few M D L supporters outside Did sbury Ma sjid in Manchester today after D F L A thugs planned to attack it. 5 juiced up DF LA thugs came but legged it when they saw just 1 anti-fascist. After they sped off in their car M D L and anti-fascists went to all the near by pubs looking for them. Most of you probably know M D L is run by Sun nis that follow Tari qah and Tas awwuf etc. as you probably see us sharing posters for Mi lad programmes and U rs celebrations of Aw liyas. Did sbury Park Mas jid are sal afi but if we sit by thinking 'it is only a sa lafi Mas jid we aren't going' the isla mo phobes don't know that. They will just think they attacked one Mas jid so they can attack another. Today it will be a sa lafi Mas jid and who knows next time it might be a Suf i Mas jid. It is for this reason the M D L showed a small presence.
 

Patteran

A nowadays excuse
There's no suggestion from any source that the stabbings in town were politically-motivated. Piccadilly Gardens is a street-dealing hotspot, predominantly shitbags selling spice to the homeless. The three teens arrested were carrying knives & drugs. DFLA mouthpieces publicly & repeatedly denied any involvement with the mosque protest.

I'm open to being wrong here. But it still seems most likely that three grown men, maybe out-of-towners full of ale, have been caught out by the blade-wielding brutality of skinny inner-city teenagers. Perhaps the victims were right wingers - plenty are these days - but I don't think it's helpful to second-guess motivations or frame the incident like this if personal politics weren't relevant.
 

The39thStep

Well-Known Member
There's no suggestion from any source that the stabbings in town were politically-motivated. Piccadilly Gardens is a street-dealing hotspot, predominantly shitbags selling spice to the homeless. The three teens arrested were carrying knives & drugs. DFLA mouthpieces publicly & repeatedly denied any involvement with the mosque protest.

I'm open to being wrong here. But it still seems most likely that three grown men, maybe out-of-towners full of ale, have been caught out by the blade-wielding brutality of skinny inner-city teenagers. Perhaps the victims were right wingers - plenty are these days - but I don't think it's helpful to second-guess motivations or frame the incident like this if personal politics weren't relevant.
Yup, heap of shite. Could have been anyone passing through at that same time on the same night. None of the three that got stabbed are in the DFLA as far as I'm aware.
 

Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
Yup, heap of shite. Could have been anyone passing through at that same time on the same night. None of the three that got stabbed are in the DFLA as far as I'm aware.
Do you know if their are any escalations after these stabbings ?
 

M Testa

Well-Known Member
antifascists outnumber EDL 5-1/. pre-demo arrests for 2 EDL speakers (1 well known balloon-heid), 4 arrests on the demo. they met up at the pub 11am. 2nd march in a mpnth or so. Worcs told em to nick off! more to come.
oh, and the EDL 'book burning' division were all armed with poundland lighters! that'll show them leftisteys.
and before anyone does it: EDL go from bad to Worcester!
 

Nigel

For A Degenerates' Workers State
I was only asking :eek:
Besides this is E DL Watch thread & it was the e dl mobilising in Worcester !
 
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