butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Him? 
And no, you're wrong again.
And no, you're wrong again.
Durham Left bookfair 22nd November 2008
- Thread starter Cl@ss W@r
- Start date
love & weed
New Member
You and Seyton delighted in spreading an atmosphere which is quite similar to that of Stalinist Russia - the discrimination against activists because of ALLEGED mental health issues. You say they are there and have nothing to go on except your own stupid imagination (certainly no medical opinion) - not disimilar to Stalinists who acted prejeudicially against activists in Russia. The similarities are all too clear.
love & weed
New Member
Him?
And no, you're wrong again.
Doubt it.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Don't be so narrow minded. If David Bowie can re-invent himself, why can't Attica?
Paul Marsh
NeitherWashingtonNorMecca
Agreed, this has been a denial of the anarchist movement for the years i have been active and from when i speak with older activist much the same, crass and the story of Wally Hope..
But i know my own actions have only served the zelits of Marsh & co, in there biggeted thoughts, a disagreement is a two way road love & weed.
What can we expect from thugs of Class War and others, there as much in denial of themselves as is attica, i have no comfort in agreeing with some people, but we are all damaged and we need to look beyond ourselves.
Here MARTIN WRIGHT
(you will have to download) from Ian Bone On Anarchism serious.
Never more of a true word said, the likes of Marsh and co are nothing but thugs who are turning anarchism into a joke, but the joke is not funny.
When the far right are on the rise, global capitalism going to only path it can do, anarchism in the uk suffers these fucking jokers and yes we need to reclaim anarchism from them as a matter of serious urgency.
We have been in this disagreement far to fucking long brothers and sister, and there are some who are prepared to forget the past, move on and begin again we are underclasrising.
Louis MacNeice
Autumn Journalist
Yes i do and myself i have no problem with him, come to Paul Marsh and co then not only do i have a problem a lot of people do, indeed some become members of The CGB, others left The Uk, this goes back a long way..
Rabidrodent
Samphire sucker!
Rabidrodent
Samphire sucker!
You're another one of them nutballs arent you.....
You're also starting to really get my heckles up with your slanderous load of bollocks.
yes, dear. now, why did you post up personal information about seyton?
Rabidrodent
Samphire sucker!
Perhaps the whingy e19896 put him up to it...
Rabidrodent
Samphire sucker!
Attica will fall for anything if you pop him a Largactil and call him The Bedraggled Durham Messiah...
Thats how he gets all smoochy for his latest epic dialectic praxis showstopper.
you're right!
attica will do anything for anyone who buys a copy of mayday magazine
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
It's a half-decent magazine trying to rethink the left. I particularly liked the half-time team talk.
no, developing an autonomous working class culture is NOT central to 'our movement'. which is a good thing, seeing some of the people involved in 'our movement' are utter loons. SUPPORTING the development of such a culture is central, though. an autonomous working class culture, a culture of resistance, is not something a few thousand anarchists can create for a class of millions, although organisations similar to the ones you cite can help support and maintain something already in existence.Udo Erasmus said:
no, where attica and you go wrong is thinking that a bookfair or bookshop where people 'view' material, something i've always associated with galleries or museums, is the answer. propagating and spreading the material and ideas is not a one day in the year task, as attica believes, but something which should occur in our everyday lives, through our practice. but then to do that you have to enounter working class people at work and at play. it's not going to happen through being a vanguard or through being a tout. in fact, being a tout is one of the things which puts people beyond the pale and i would be interested to know why you think you should support a grass.
what the fuck is it with so called anarchist and issue of mental health for fuck sake? if i was one of those nutballs your term of abuse then what would it matter? nothing i have said is in your words slanderous load of bollocks..
Paul Marsh
NeitherWashingtonNorMecca
Having read all through this thread I think the perfect solution is that e19896 and Attica/TBH/love&weed (delete as appropriate) go away and start working together.
Its a match made in heaven, although for it to be consumated a reinforced bed may be required........
Its a match made in heaven, although for it to be consumated a reinforced bed may be required........
Rabidrodent
Samphire sucker!
Put that fucking works down mate. You could at least attempt to be coherent when you post, no need for actually typing 'junkie speak' aswell!
Give me strength.
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
Your formulations seem rather simplistic and based on setting up strawmen. Has anyone other than yourself, said that we are arguing that propagating and spreading the material and ideas is a one day in the year task? Yes, this kind of thing should occur in everyday lives, but at the moment working class struggle is at a low ebb, and working class culture is more shaped by mass media and capital than grassroots struggle. Building a radical subculture that links in with every little or tiny spark of working class struggle seems like a great thing to me.
It has been the traditional practise of all radical movements to set up meetings, events, talks etc where people can discuss, debate and refine ideas. Indeed, one of the great strengths of the Left compared to mainstream politics is that it precisely encourages people to study and educate themselves.
It is also based on a false model of struggle. For example, you act as if any attempts of activists to build something rather than passively just wait for a spontaneous erruption of anger from our class is elitist.
I'm not sure what your problem is, precisely, with activists organising an event to give people an opportunity to learn about working class history?
I mentioned institutions like the Plebs League and Central Labour College (set up by communists and syndicalists as a radical alternative to the reformist pedagogy of Ruskin College and the WEA), only very small numbers of working class people would have passed through these bodies, but these included the trade union militants in the Rhondda who drafted the Miners Next Step and played a key role in working class battles. These small cogs turned bigger wheels.
We know that working class consciousness is uneven. There are pockets of people who are very politicised and there are reactionaries in our class. Within the same individual you will have people who are good trade union militants, but might, for instance, be racist against asylum seekers e etc.
Activism is not elitism or substituting our actions for those of our class, but rather part of building our class so that we move from being a class-in-itself to a class-for-itself.
Zhelezniakov
Well-Known Member
If e19896, Attica, and his mates TBH and love & weed, did get together, could they write their conclusions down on tablets of stone ? 
it's really very simple. you've said it's the task of, for want of a better word, 'the left' to develop an autonomous working class culture. i disagree, saying that we ('the left') should support such a development. after all, if the emancipation of the working class is the task of the working class itself, then the creation of a working class culture's certainly not something to leave to anyone else either.
as for attica's do, he's said above about w/c people in the ne not having the opportunity to 'view' books and material about working class history and contemporary struggle. it is a strange choice of words, as i have already observed. but it's a fucking LIE the premise he's basing his guff on. it is admittedly some time since i last haunted the bookshops of the north-east. but even in the 1980s and 1990s there were books about working class history readily available in bookshops across the region. perhaps someone's nicked them all out the shops, i don't know, but i do know a pile of shit when i see one and attica's post about the bookfair's one of the larger and smellier piles i've come across.
pieces of andrex, more like, and promptly flushed down the lavatory.If e19896, Attica, and his mates TBH and love & weed, did get together, could they write their conclusions down on tablets of stone ?
Udo Erasmus
Well-Known Member
No, I believe that the working class will develop a culture that is autonomous from capital through a whole process of popular and democractic struggles which will take a variety of shapes and forms. But you seem to think that activists taking an initiative or attempting to do something is substituting their own efforts for those of the class. Whereas, I see it as part of building the movement of our class. You see, I believe in the concept of human agency, rather than thinking that the overthrow of capitalism will somehow happen magically.
Yes, I'm sure that people can get some books of working class history from the local corporate bookshop (though book selection is reduced overall as independent booksellers go to the wall), but the bookfair is an initiative where people involved in the movement can come together and bring materials to help bring a sense of history to the current struggles of our class.
Get a life!
I'm sure you would hate an event like this too.
Aaaaaarrrggghhhh Is he princess fucking Diana or something?
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