Driving Standards

Discussion in 'transport' started by hash tag, Mar 11, 2014.

  1. kebabking

    kebabking Unfettered ambition

    The experience and judgement that allows me to drive at 60mph along a straight, 2 mile dual carriageway near me thats miles from anywhere and which some witless mouthbreather has classed as a 40, is the same experience and judgement that tells me that only said witless mouthbreather would consider driving at more than 15 down a suburban street near my children's school despite it happily boasting a 30 limit...
    Plumdaff, mauvais and T & P like this.
  2. BigTom

    BigTom Well-Known Member

    But you don't know what the roads were that were surveyed, there was only 9 sites and they aren't detailed so we've no way of knowing. All we know is that they are 20mph limits. I don't think most local authorities do blanket 20mph limits, certainly none of the West Midlands councils do, I think it's just some in London, so it's somewhere between possible and likely that some, most or all of these sites are not in blanket 20mph boroughs. You can't say these figures don't show a problem because there are some roads you think have been wrongly classed and decide this speeding is on those, at least mauvais had some good points about the majority of speeding being only slightly over and that the average speed was significantly reduced compared to 30mph zones so even though the vast majority of drivers can't obey the limit, they are still moving slower than when it was 30mph limits (with the caveat they may have been slower moving roads before the change).
    I posted it only to say that it's clear that only a small portion of drivers are able to follow a simple rule.

    Thing is, that's probably been classed as a 40 due to collisions on that stretch. I wouldn't be surprised if it was 50 or 60 and there was 2 fatalities in a year (iirc that's the threshold at which councils have to examine a road to see what they can do to reduce risk there) and they reduced it to 40 as a result.
    mojo pixy likes this.
  3. Dogsauce

    Dogsauce Lord of the Dance Settee

    20mph in residential areas isn’t about how safely you can drive, or how good modern brakes are or whatever defensive stuff a lot of drivers come out with, but about the impact on others when they fuck up, e.g. kids running into the road. I know it feels frustratingly slow if you’re not used to it, but it’ll seep in eventually.

    There are blanket limits in some London boroughs (I’m in one) but they’re the sort of places where there’s no justification for owning a car anyway.
  4. T & P

    T & P |-o-| (-o-) |-o-|

    I certainly don't object to 20 mph on residential side roads, and in fact observe that or an even lower speed even when the limit is set at 30 mph. Most drivers can actually adjust their speed according to conditions and local geography regardless of what the local laws might allow.

    But at the same time there are plenty of trunk/ main roads in Lambeth affected by the blanket speed limit where a 20 mph limit is so thoroughly inadequate it's nothing short of a farce. And that in effect can prove counterproductive in the long term as far observance of the Highway Code is concerned.
    Bahnhof Strasse and mauvais like this.
  5. hash tag

    hash tag Pedicabo omnes

    I don't have the slightest problem with 20 limits, but do have a problem with the way it's coordinated some times. There are estate side roads close To battersea power station which are run by wandsworth and are 20mph. You exit these roads on to a main route operated by Lambeth and they become 20mph. It's a crazy set up.
  6. mojo pixy

    mojo pixy unquantifiable hazards

    I have heard that the reason for 20mph limits on main roads is to help keep traffic moving; so instead of 30-stop-30-stop-30-stop-30-stop etc, it might go more like 20-10-20-10-20-10-20-10-ok maybe stop now. It's better for emissions to keep traffic moving slowly than stopping and starting, better for the cars' brakes and engines, generally better for drivers' tempers to keep moving (albeit slowly), plus slowly moving traffic rather than fast moving but constantly stopping traffic is said to bring the chances of accidents down.

    Unfortunately, from inside our own cars we only see our bit of the picture, not the broad view of Traffic Flow.
    muscovyduck likes this.
  7. hash tag

    hash tag Pedicabo omnes

    Interesting case Driver using hands-free kit kills young dad during "in-depth" chat with friend

    "The fact that using a phone (hands free) is lawful does not alter the fact it is an actual distraction. The guidelines make that clear."

    "A police collision investigator concluded Ayres' driving had caused the crash and said he could not discount the possibility that the lawful use of a hands free phone for such a period had led to a distraction."

    PC Godfrey Barlow told the jury use of a hands free phone can provide a distraction and was a "possible" cause of the collision.

    "The research shows less time is spent looking at the road," PC Barlow explained.

    When asked how the use of hands free phone differed from talking to a passenger PC Barlow said: "The research mentions you visualise the person you are speaking to."

    He added: "It is going to lower your situational awareness."
  8. dervish

    dervish if you flibble when you wibble, don't wobble

    Wasn't there a study that said that using a handsfree was about the same distraction as drink driving?
  9. Dogsauce

    Dogsauce Lord of the Dance Settee

    Company I used to work for wouldn't allow drivers to use hands-free, pretty sure they started doing this about five years ago, it's well known to increase risks.
  10. Bahnhof Strasse

    Bahnhof Strasse Free the Sepsis Six!

    I think that was more using a hand held mobile. We have hands free and it is distracting, so tend not to use it.
  11. dervish

    dervish if you flibble when you wibble, don't wobble

    This might have been what I was thinking of.
    Bahnhof Strasse likes this.
  12. T & P

    T & P |-o-| (-o-) |-o-|

    I’ve always been quite skeptic about how serious an effect having a conversation on a hands-free has on drivers’ attention. I can’t certainly see it being significantly worse than having the same conversation with someone in the car. Surely it depends on the nature of the conversation far more than where the voice of the other person is coming from.
  13. hash tag

    hash tag Pedicabo omnes

    If you are speaking to a passenger, under ordinary circumstances, they will have their eyes on the road. Even if they make a slight reaction to something they see, the driver will probably pick up on it.
    that said, children, dogs, load music, a good argument can be very distracting/dangerous.
  14. T & P

    T & P |-o-| (-o-) |-o-|

    Exactly. IIRC some of the most common and worst arguments between couples happen in cars. I can imagine those being as disruptive as as any interaction in a car could be. I’d imagine warring children in the back seat are pretty bad too. In fact both such scenarios have got to be far more distracting/ potentially dangerous than an ordinary conversation over a hands free system.

    Point being, if transporting unruly children is not deemed too dangerous a task to be done safely by the average driver, then having a normal conversation over the phone shouldn’t be either.
  15. Dogsauce

    Dogsauce Lord of the Dance Settee

    Passengers tend to be watching the road and will usually shut up if the driver is having to do anything tricky, there's generally an awareness of what's going on and conversation adjusts instinctively, whereas a mobile caller doesn't have that awareness.
  16. weltweit

    weltweit Well-Known Member

    Has anyone commented on the driving test, apparently they now have a move which is causing some controversy, pulling across the road into the part of oncoming traffic and then reversing back to your side before continuing. It sounds a little tricky, if that is what it is, and I am not convinced!
  17. hash tag

    hash tag Pedicabo omnes

  18. Dogsauce

    Dogsauce Lord of the Dance Settee

    The thing I've been finding drivers having the biggest problem with in recent weeks is that rule that says if you're crossing the centre line give way to oncoming vehicles. So many flying straight at me on those roads where cars are parked both sides, thinking it's OK because there's a 50cm gap that a bike coming the other way (who is not over the centre line) can just about squeeze through. No reduction in speed necessary. Absolute cunts.
  19. T & P

    T & P |-o-| (-o-) |-o-|

    When I'm on my scooter I very often experience this. Even if I've entered the narrow section first most car drivers will not only enter it too, but fail to reduce their speed at all, expecting me to slow down and pin myself against the parked cars to let them through.
    Almor likes this.
  20. SpookyFrank

    SpookyFrank We kill the flame

    All the street near me are like this, double parked so the rules about who should give way go out the window. When I'm driving I find people (except cabbies) are very good at letting each other go past based on who can most easily pull over or who gets to the narrow bit first. When I'm on a bike though, this idea of patiently waiting for someone to pass goes out the window and cars just come straight at me whether there's space or not.
    Almor likes this.
  21. BigTom

    BigTom Well-Known Member

    Operation's started in earnest :)
    86 people fined yesterday, 1 towed, some will get points as well, lots more "given advice". Excellent :)

    The number of drivers fined for bad parking in ONE DAY
    Winot, Almor and Bahnhof Strasse like this.
  22. Bahnhof Strasse

    Bahnhof Strasse Free the Sepsis Six!

    Done for careless driving:

    marty21, dessiato, A380 and 1 other person like this.
  23. Teaboy

    Teaboy It definitely looks brighter over there..

    The mind boggles.
  24. Poi E

    Poi E Pessimism: a valuable protection against quackery.

    Snow excuse!
    A380 and T & P like this.
  25. mauvais

    mauvais change has become unavoidable

    Also known as 'tank commanders' :)
    A380 likes this.
  26. Spymaster

    Spymaster Cockney Wanker

    You get a few of these every time it snows. Anyone with an IQ above 20 can see that it's idiotic. The driver should be banned for a year on the basis that they are a fucking moron, and have to redo their test.
  27. Spymaster

    Spymaster Cockney Wanker

    BigTom and existentialist like this.
  28. cupid_stunt

    cupid_stunt Dyslexic King Cnut the Great.

    Yes, all of them, when you have a decent adblocker installed. :thumbs:
  29. BigTom

    BigTom Well-Known Member

    yeah, it's awful, I fucking hate the popout videos with the news story that autoplay as well.
    Bahnhof Strasse likes this.
  30. Spymaster

    Spymaster Cockney Wanker

    Wales Online is the worst. Every time ddraig links to them it virtually freezes my browser.
    existentialist and ddraig like this.

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