differences between rural and urban transport

[tarannau]

what you propose is a two tier society with a rural population dependent on their own mobility to survive and a urban society which has good public transport provision.

Bollocks I do. This whole idea of a rural vs urban population divide is a load of arse. This is a pissy little island in the wider scheme of things, with a reasonable level of amenties and services throughout the country. And - to be fair - even the 'urban' public transport options aren't enough for some living outside of London.

Christ, Brits don't half whinge.

 

[co-op]

I used to walk the 8 miles (as the crow flies) from the station over the hills, lovely walk if it's done for leisure (even in my days of better joint health it took me 2 hours with some steep climbs!), but alas no longer capable of doing so - and I wouldn't suggest anyone ought to do it daily and then back again. If it were simply a case of a couple of miles and a track it would be more feasible, but it is a lot further. When I was growing up I used to cycle until I was nearly killed on the B road out of town by a lorry taking a corner - no pavement and a steep grass bank for the lorry to pin you against means there's nowhere to escape to, I completely lost my nerve after that.

Seriously I sympathise with all of this. Country roads can be horrendous; I have been flattened against the banks on the sides of roads too fucking often.

TBF to tarranu - there is a genuine problem with PT in areas of low population density. For me the real rural problem is cars/lorries etc (or rather the way they are allowed to drive) - they liberate some and imprison the rest.

 

[tarannau]

Londoners expect a tube train to leave every few minutes. My local station has three trains an hour to Leeds and I'm pathetically grateful for that, even living near a local station. There are far far fewer local stations in west yorkshire - or anywhere - outside of London.

Most of London ain't tubed up though. Most London BR services are about the same as yours, with commuter towns in the suburbs sometimes being worse.



Can you reference any of those London vs Yorkshire income disparity figurees. Certainly doesn't tally with my experience - London typically gets the bad end of the stick.

 

[_angel_]

Bollocks I do. This whole idea of a rural vs urban population divide is a load of arse. This is a pissy little island in the wider scheme of things, with a reasonable level of amenties and services throughout the country. And - to be fair - even the 'urban' public transport options aren't enough for some living outside of London.

Christ, Brits don't half whinge.

Have you ever lived in some two bit town or small village? No, there isn't a reasonable level of amenities and services for everyone who wants them.

Did you not read what she wrote about the school, post office and pub closing down?

 

[_angel_]

Most of London ain't tubed up though. Most London BR services are about the same as yours, with commuter towns in the suburbs sometimes being worse.

You get tube stations less than a mile apart sometimes in London! I've never had any problems getting places in London from the tube. Not had to walk very far from the local stop to wherever I've wanted to be.

It's like a parallel universe when I come back home to Leeds.

 

[tarannau]

Have you ever lived in some two bit town or small village? No, there isn't a reasonable level of amenities and services for everyone who wants them.

Did you not read what she wrote about the school, post office and pub closing down?

Yep, lived 20 miles out from Aberystwyth. No public transport to speak of.

Or in the middle of the rainforest for months at a time, the nearest airfield s 2 days trek away and so on.

FFS people, we're lucky - we've got refrigeration, freezers, running water, home deliveries from Tescos and live on a small island. And people are moaning about the loss of post offices, convenient drinking hostelries and the lack of door-to-door transport with dark mentions of two-tier societies and all kinds of alarmist nonsense. Some of these folks coped with the war and real hardship - a long journey ain't the end of the world.

 

[ethel]

london BR services are in the main better than 3 trains an hour. also the bus service is signifiacntly better than anywhere else i've lived.

had a look for stats on rural cycyling stats. you are less likely to have an accident on a bike in a rural area vs an urban area but you are much more likely to die as a result of that accident due to the higher speeds involved.

 

[ethel]

Some of these folks coped with the war and real hardship - a long journey ain't the end of the world.

why don't you ask them then? i'm sure that most elderly people, when their post office closes, don't think "ack well, we beat hitler, this isn't so bad"

 

[Epona]

Yep, the trouble of old people in pleasant, rural homes not being able to get regular buses door-to-door is exactly equivalent to the struggle of women in getting the vote.

Is this a new Godwin's law or something?

You completely misunderstand what rural life is like, if you think that nice homes without door to door transport is what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about massive loss of rural jobs, and people living in poverty, without hope, and in the case of the elderly or infirm, huge isolation due to the collapse of local communities and industry. The countryside is not just the pretty pictures you see on postcards.

 

[_angel_]

Yep, lived 20 miles out from Aberystwyth. No public transport to speak of.

Or in the middle of the rainforest for months at a time, the nearest airfield s 2 days trek away and so on.

FFS people, we're lucky - we've got refrigeration, freezers, running water, home deliveries from Tescos and live on a small island. And people are moaning about the loss of post offices, convenient drinking hostelries and the lack of door-to-door transport with dark mentions of two-tier societies and all kinds of alarmist nonsense. Some of these folks coped with the war and real hardship - a long journey ain't the end of the world.

no, not everyone does have home deliveries from tescos. If all your village had was a postoffice and a pub and that's gone, that's kind of it for your local community.

My friends aunt was miles away from a supermarket and online shopping wouldn't deliver that far. (She moved back being unable to drive)

A small island starts to seem a bit bigger if you're in the remote parts of Scotland.

 

[ethel]

good article on bbc site about deaths of children on rural roads: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4537453.stm

 

[_angel_]

london BR services are in the main better than 3 trains an hour. also the bus service is signifiacntly better than anywhere else i've lived.

had a look for stats on rural cycyling stats. you are less likely to have an accident on a bike in a rural area vs an urban area but you are much more likely to die as a result of that accident due to the higher speeds involved.

Last time I was in London was surprised to see how many buses were running, even late into the night. Nope, does not happen in Leeds with that frequency.

Fortunately taxis are a damn site cheaper here though. If there's two or more of you sharing it might even work out cheaper than the bus.

Don't get me started on north yorkshire buses! £5 return even to go one stop, no train link between whitby and scarborough, one bus an hour that takes an hour. Why????

We got told it was cheaper to take a taxi for some of the shorter stops than fart about on a bus.

 

[co-op]

l

had a look for stats on rural cycyling stats. you are less likely to have an accident on a bike in a rural area vs an urban area but you are much more likely to die as a result of that accident due to the higher speeds involved.

Regardless of what the stats say, I don't think they can tell the whole story here anyway. If rural fatalities amongst pedestrians and cyclists are lower it's basically because 99.9% of people have been terrorised off the roads except when they're in a car or bus, so naturally the casualties are low.

Most of the time I feel much safer cycling in London than most country roads - the roads I cycle in the country are ones that I've worked out are safe.

 

[snadge]

Some people who live in rural areas have no time to be walking and cycling everywhere, 40 mile round trip on a cycle for me takes about 2.5 hours, put that on to a working day, that is on pretty flat roads, chuck a couple of hills in and it's more.

There should be a comparison here, everyone in London stop using public transport or private transport to get to work, get the kids to school etc and see if they can cope.

Try walking and cycling everywhere, add the extra inconvenience of having to walk or cycle to a supermarket 10 miles away instead of just up the road and a post office 15 miles in the other direction.

People in London have it SO fucking easy then try and tell the rest of the country how to live.

10 to a penny they can't cope

 

[snadge]

Regardless of what the stats say, I don't think they can tell the whole story here anyway. If rural fatalities amongst pedestrians and cyclists are lower it's basically because 99.9% of people have been terrorised off the roads except when they're in a car or bus, so naturally the casualties are low.

Most of the time I feel much safer cycling in London than most country roads - the roads I cycle in the country are ones that I've worked out are safe.

utter garbage, you don't know what you are talking about.

There are loads of people cycling where I live, lots of windy country roads and there has been one fatality in the past 3 years, that was a pissed cyclist on the dual carraigeway with no lights.

 

[tarannau]

You completely misunderstand what rural life is like, if you think that nice homes without door to door transport is what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about massive loss of rural jobs, and people living in poverty, without hope, and in the case of the elderly or infirm, huge isolation due to the collapse of local communities and industry. The countryside is not just the pretty pictures you see on postcards.

You do realise that a fair chunk of my family still live in 'rural' Wales don't you, either in the old mining heartlands or the Beacons. Fair to say that I'm more clued up on the collapse of rual communities and industries than most.

Love the patronising,m reductive bollocks though. Keep it up. Once you've been in London you can't have a handle on rural life in the slightest. Whereas every smartarse bumpkin seems to think that they know what life in London's like, claiming that it's subsidised at the expense of the rest of the country,

 

[ethel]

utter garbage, you don't know what you are talking about.

There are loads of people cycling where I live, lots of windy country roads and there has been one fatality in the past 3 years, that was a pissed cyclist on the dual carraigeway with no lights.

in your area, fair enough, but not in the country as a whole where there ae roughly the same numbers of fatalites on urban and rural roads:

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=2006-09-11b.87211.h

 

[snadge]

in your area, fair enough, but not in the country as a whole where there ae roughly the same numbers of fatalites on urban and rural roads:

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=2006-09-11b.87211.h

Maybe cos' there is LOADS of cyclists and drivers around here are pretty courteous as a whole towards them.

 

[Nougat]

Differences I have noticed are-:

drivers are younger in rural areas. I swear I have seen 15yr olds driving!

buses really do come only on wednesdays in certain parts of north wales.

bus fares are more expensive in ALL rural areas that I have been to than in London.

 

[co-op]

utter garbage, you don't know what you are talking about.

There are loads of people cycling where I live, lots of windy country roads and there has been one fatality in the past 3 years, that was a pissed cyclist on the dual carraigeway with no lights.

Gosh what a brilliant argument.

Obviously I don't know what I'm talking about.

 

[geminisnake]

A small island starts to seem a bit bigger if you're in the remote parts of Scotland.

You don't need to be that remote either
Seems to be north of Edinburgh is rural for a lot of companies if you want something delivered

And apart from the pavement outside our houses there's none for 1 mile in one direction and apart from the village, none for 2 miles in the other.
And I have NO intention of walking in and out to town on a 60 limit road with lunatics and farm vehicles regularly flying past me.

Hubby and son cycle but it scares me tbh.

 

[_angel_]

You don't need to be that remote either
Seems to be north of Edinburgh is rural for a lot of companies if you want something delivered

And apart from the pavement outside our houses there's none for 1 mile in one direction and apart from the village, none for 2 miles in the other.
And I have NO intention of walking in and out to town on a 60 limit road with lunatics and farm vehicles regularly flying past me.

Hubby and son cycle but it scares me tbh.

Didn't realise how many roads were single tracks in Scotland until my sis drove us up a few years ago. Genuinely freaked us out! Would you want to cycle or walk round a blind corner on a single track road with people flying around there at high speeds --- no!

 

[Funky_monks]

............ and you cant move down the high street of Bethesda because of all the busses. everywhere is within easy cycling distance of everywhere and you have every type of shop\amenity within a 15 min walk of your flat.

I used to live in Bethesda. But then people in Bethesda aren't cared about by others, oh no, not them. They are the mountain people....etc.


I have walked the pavementless road outside my house for about five miles in each direction and have yet to witness one of these 'busstops' of which you speak. I wouldn't suggest it was a walk for those incapable of scrambling up a steep bank right quick when a car (or combine) comes down the road. And this is in the Cotswolds, I guess you could get to that London in 2hrs (less by train). My local post office is 8 miles away.

I depend on a car so much, I get unsettled when one has trouble and we have to rely on the pick-up working. Had a horrible period last yr when the pick-up wasnt starting cos of the cold (later found out that only one glow-plug was working) and the punto had starter motor issues. Had to keep ringing my boss to come from three miles away and give my wife a lift to work.

I aint made of money, so I didnt want to send either to a garage, took me a while to puzzle out the problems with each though.

I think the poor are forgotten, so many people seem to think the countryside is populated only by the wealthy.

 

[snadge]

Gosh what a brilliant argument.

Obviously I don't know what I'm talking about.

Do you work?

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Rural transport, Canada:

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Urban transport, Canada

 

[weepiper]

Pavements Come-on! Apart from small stretches in villages maybe - Even then, many places still don't have even that. Quite a number of pedestrians have been killed round my way by walking in the road. You do find plenty walking tho - Just they tend to use any route away from the roads & the changes in agriculture & people over the years mean there are getting less & less of them.

Never mind that just getting to & from any bus can be a fair-old walk in itself.

lol yes I have no pavements for 5 miles in any direction

 

[co-op]

Do you work?

What's your point? - stupid, argumentative (and ignorant) replies like your one earlier won't get much mileage from me.

 

[Isambard]

It is true that there are some areas with VERY low levels of public transport.
One route I use in Somerset is just five buses a day and there are more remote places with less. However I do remember reading somewhere that 85% of the UK populaion live within walking distance of at least at hourly public transport service.

I think a lot of poeple who live outside of major cities say "there is no public trasnport" when there patently is. Where my house is in Somerset, a lot of people say they "need" the car, but there buses pssed the end of the street five times a hour!

 

[_angel_]

It is true that there are some areas with VERY low levels of public transport.
One route I use in Somerset is just five buses a day and there are more remote places with less. However I do remember reading somewhere that 85% of the UK populaion live within walking distance of at least at hourly public transport service.

I think a lot of poeple who live outside of major cities say "there is no public trasnport" when there patently is. Where my house is in Somerset, a lot of people say they "need" the car, but there buses pssed the end of the street five times a hour!

Most people in UK live in a city or at least a town. However for those 15% who have no transport, it is a problem.

The other problem is that there is transport, but it doesn't go to where you actually want to be.

I've lost count of places I simply can't visit because I've got no transport. Never mind places it hasn't been possible to visit because public transport means I'd have to spend far too long just getting there to do anything.

Even in Leeds it would help me no end to be in a car rather than having to co-ordinate two or more bus journeys. Why have to spend two or more hours going somewhere when a car could take you in fifteen minutes? Especially when you add in the high bus fares and the waiting around when things don't turn up.