Did you enjoy secondary school?
- Thread starter scifisam
- Start date
becki1701
Withsproglet
At the time it was ok....now when I look back I think 'Oh gawd....how horrible'. In my opinion growing up in general is one big fat trauma, especially when you hit puberty and start noticing the opposite sex, but you only realise that afterwards when you're grown up enough to look at it objectively.
I'm sure she'll be absolutely fine, just keep chatting with her about it and you'll probably pick up on it if something starts bothering her, but be careful not to create problems in your own head because of your fears
I'm sure she'll be absolutely fine, just keep chatting with her about it and you'll probably pick up on it if something starts bothering her, but be careful not to create problems in your own head because of your fears
extra dry
Happy to be here
get her involved in a martial art...judo, karate, kung-fu, kick boxing, a lot of kids here do tye-know-do (spelling) they all have a confidence and funny enough a respect for each other.
1) it will build a strong self confidence within her
2) allow her to look any wanabe bully in the eye and stand up for herself
3) teach her that non conflict and walking are the best strategies for dealing with these kids
4) most importantly if it does get physical she will be able to resist and defend herself
I think you might have reservations, but she has a year to build up her own self confidence and to have just some basic level is better than non.
In my case I was the target for about three years at secondary school..just because I wore glasses and had white hair...so I know what it feels like to be bullied day in day out.
it all stopped after one confrontation with the schools main bullying twat and his mates.
1) it will build a strong self confidence within her
2) allow her to look any wanabe bully in the eye and stand up for herself
3) teach her that non conflict and walking are the best strategies for dealing with these kids
4) most importantly if it does get physical she will be able to resist and defend herself
I think you might have reservations, but she has a year to build up her own self confidence and to have just some basic level is better than non.
In my case I was the target for about three years at secondary school..just because I wore glasses and had white hair...so I know what it feels like to be bullied day in day out.
it all stopped after one confrontation with the schools main bullying twat and his mates.
scifisam
deleted
Ah, she does do karate already - did it for a year when she was 4, took a break when we moved house, then started up again a couple of years ago. I do think it's useful for pretty much every kid.
The reason I'm worried is that she already has problems at school. The psychologists say she's autistic; I'm not sure I agree with that, but she certainly does have a problem with school, so I'm going along with the diagnosis because it means she'll eventually get a full statement (which will, among other things, mean the school I want her to go to will have to take her). She doesn't know that's the label she's been given, though.
If you don't give her instructions in a particular way, she won't understand. If you don't jolt her every 2 minutes, she'll go into a daydream and stop doing whatever it was she was doing. If she has to work in a noisy room, she gets overwhelmed and zones out. I know, I know, all kids are like this sometimes, but it's a matter of degree. Those problems are easily overcome in a small group situation, but not in larger classes.
She is also even more forgetful than other children her age, and has a terrible sense of direction - it was only recently that she learnt left from right, and she still gets them - and the difference between forwards and backwards - wrong half the time. Given the number of kids I've seen given detentions for forgetting a pen or being five minutes late, she might end up with daily detentions for something that's not her fault.
She spent pretty much all of years 3 and 4 sitting in the book corner reading, refusing to do anything else. That was an improvement on years 1 and 2, where she hid under tables to read, hit out when told to do anything, drew angry pictures of death into the desk, all sorts of disturbing things.
For those couple of urbanites that have met her, this will probably be very surprising. When she's with me, she's happy, bright and very well-behaved indeed. If she's not laughing herself, she's making other people laugh with her funny and sometimes clever comments. And, although it sometimes takes a couple of reminders, she always does what I tell her to and never independently decides to do something 'bad,' except for being so messy that visitors should probably take a valium before entering her room.
She's a lovely kid.
She's also fine in less formal situations, like her afterschool classes or the adventure playground. It's school that changes her.
The reason I'm worried is that she already has problems at school. The psychologists say she's autistic; I'm not sure I agree with that, but she certainly does have a problem with school, so I'm going along with the diagnosis because it means she'll eventually get a full statement (which will, among other things, mean the school I want her to go to will have to take her). She doesn't know that's the label she's been given, though.
If you don't give her instructions in a particular way, she won't understand. If you don't jolt her every 2 minutes, she'll go into a daydream and stop doing whatever it was she was doing. If she has to work in a noisy room, she gets overwhelmed and zones out. I know, I know, all kids are like this sometimes, but it's a matter of degree. Those problems are easily overcome in a small group situation, but not in larger classes.
She is also even more forgetful than other children her age, and has a terrible sense of direction - it was only recently that she learnt left from right, and she still gets them - and the difference between forwards and backwards - wrong half the time. Given the number of kids I've seen given detentions for forgetting a pen or being five minutes late, she might end up with daily detentions for something that's not her fault.
She spent pretty much all of years 3 and 4 sitting in the book corner reading, refusing to do anything else. That was an improvement on years 1 and 2, where she hid under tables to read, hit out when told to do anything, drew angry pictures of death into the desk, all sorts of disturbing things.
For those couple of urbanites that have met her, this will probably be very surprising. When she's with me, she's happy, bright and very well-behaved indeed. If she's not laughing herself, she's making other people laugh with her funny and sometimes clever comments. And, although it sometimes takes a couple of reminders, she always does what I tell her to and never independently decides to do something 'bad,' except for being so messy that visitors should probably take a valium before entering her room.
She's a lovely kid. She's also fine in less formal situations, like her afterschool classes or the adventure playground. It's school that changes her.
extra dry
Happy to be here
Go to the headteacher of the new school and explain the situation, see what they have to offer your child..be up front about it...otherwise your kid will be labeled a problem child..if the teachers do not know about her situation they will think she is lazy, disruptive, naughty etc you get the picture.
As for the coping skills just be there for her each time she comes home from school.
At school maybe some school club...after school activities, or classes at dinner time.
I was persuaded to do a knitting class when I was about 11...it was better than being in the playground getting 6 colours of shit kick out me...I hope they have something for the kids at the school.
to help her with her education what about some home schooling like a private tutor or do some teaching yourself...the subjects she finds difficult like math, english, science...what ever it is.
As for the coping skills just be there for her each time she comes home from school.
At school maybe some school club...after school activities, or classes at dinner time.
I was persuaded to do a knitting class when I was about 11...it was better than being in the playground getting 6 colours of shit kick out me...I hope they have something for the kids at the school.
to help her with her education what about some home schooling like a private tutor or do some teaching yourself...the subjects she finds difficult like math, english, science...what ever it is.
scifisam
deleted
Having the teachers know upfront is one of the reasons I'm happy for her to carry on working with psychologists and having that label of autistic - it means that all the teachers will know straight away and it'll give them a guide to how to treat her. Obviously, I will try to have some contact with the teachers myself, but, with secondary school, that's going to be very limited.
My plan is to visit local schools with my daughter this year, a year earlier than usual.
The other things we already have going. Which means that yep, I agree with you, they are good ideas.
She has tons of afterschool activities, partly because she needs the extra skills, partly for fun, partly in the hope that she might make friends there. It's true about classes like that helping kids who are bullied; even just letting them go into the library at lunchtime, where they're safe, is a start. Though, given the short amount of time given for lunch at most secondaries these days, I'm surprised there's ever time for bullying.
Right next to me are a huge pile of books I recently bought to help her with her school subjects. She's not as behind as you'd expect, because, even though she doesn't take part in lessons, she does read a lot - she's way, way ahead in English. The science book we've been working through has been very easy for her. OK, so it is aimd at the year below her, but, still, she's doing well considering.
The subject that's been affected the most is maths; she's doing at least half an hour of that every evening at the moment (there isn't time for more). Plus, she has Murderous Maths books (the equivalents of the better-known Horrible History books), and they help a bit, and will help more once she knows enough mathematical knowledge to understand what they're on about. Then there's the abacus and the fractions blocks and the computer games and so on - there's practical a school in her bedroom, plus half the Science Museum shop (dangerous place, that!)
My plan is to visit local schools with my daughter this year, a year earlier than usual.
The other things we already have going. Which means that yep, I agree with you, they are good ideas.
She has tons of afterschool activities, partly because she needs the extra skills, partly for fun, partly in the hope that she might make friends there. It's true about classes like that helping kids who are bullied; even just letting them go into the library at lunchtime, where they're safe, is a start. Though, given the short amount of time given for lunch at most secondaries these days, I'm surprised there's ever time for bullying.
Right next to me are a huge pile of books I recently bought to help her with her school subjects. She's not as behind as you'd expect, because, even though she doesn't take part in lessons, she does read a lot - she's way, way ahead in English. The science book we've been working through has been very easy for her. OK, so it is aimd at the year below her, but, still, she's doing well considering.
The subject that's been affected the most is maths; she's doing at least half an hour of that every evening at the moment (there isn't time for more). Plus, she has Murderous Maths books (the equivalents of the better-known Horrible History books), and they help a bit, and will help more once she knows enough mathematical knowledge to understand what they're on about. Then there's the abacus and the fractions blocks and the computer games and so on - there's practical a school in her bedroom, plus half the Science Museum shop (dangerous place, that!)
I found the first three years really boring and easy and full of girls being bitchy. Not bullying, just annoying sniping. I'd say the last couple of years were the best when (most of) that had been grown out of and the boys actually started to become a bit more human and good looking I remember coming back after one school holiday and noticing some of them had got taller and nicer and I suppose this roughly coincides with the improving conditions of my education.
I remember coming back after one school holiday and noticing some of them had got taller and nicer and I suppose this roughly coincides with the improving conditions of my education.DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
It was largely a bag of fail, but there were a few things that were good.
Dr. Furface
One small step for me
It was ok mainly because I had some good mates and we had a lot of good times, but lessons and teachers bored the shit out of me. I was quite popular as a kid (with both sexes), I usually had money, dressed well and was 'in with the in crowd' - so that was all good. But I wasn't interested in or much good at any subjects except English, at which I didn't really have to try. Anything that involved any kind of effort, I didn't want to know - hardly ever did any homework. I increasingly bunked off as the years went by, and ended up spending more time working on market stalls then attending school. I'd have left at 14 if I could have done - and I might as well have.
I loved it so very, very much. I went to an all boys school and, without girls there to impress, we got down to the serious business of coming up with ever more elaborate practical jokes.
We had a game called mops-v-skins where you picked your side and then left yourself open to being ambushed by the other side and beaten, often quite savagely. Good boy fun.
Used to have good fun tormenting sub teachers too but it was never anything evil, everyone in my year was more mischevious than anything else. Good, good days, despite my terrible acne and frizzy afro hair.
We had a game called mops-v-skins where you picked your side and then left yourself open to being ambushed by the other side and beaten, often quite savagely. Good boy fun.
Used to have good fun tormenting sub teachers too but it was never anything evil, everyone in my year was more mischevious than anything else. Good, good days, despite my terrible acne and frizzy afro hair.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Ok-ish up to age 14, but then others seemed to get a social life and I didn't. I spent most of the rest of my 4 years at school participating as little as possible in school life and planning my escape to Uni, which, when it happened, I promptly fucked up.
Now, I think a fuck up was what I needed to stop me from living someone else's idea of a life. Looking back, I should have got myself expelled, but that did not even occur to me as a possible option at the time.
Now, I think a fuck up was what I needed to stop me from living someone else's idea of a life. Looking back, I should have got myself expelled, but that did not even occur to me as a possible option at the time.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I'm not sure how much you can help, really. Kids either fit in or they don't. And the kids who don't fit may well be the ones who will grow up into the more interesting adults. I'm glad I didn't fit in with most of the arseholes who were popular at my school.
baldrick
hmmmmm
It was ok.
I was a bit of a geek, but it was a very academic school so there was no bullying for being clever or owt.
i did get bullied by a former "friend" who decided this would be her way in to hanging with the cool bitchy girls, though that was sorted out really quickly so kudos to the teachers for that
Just felt like i didn't really fit in tbh, although i did have friends who were also geeky, one of whom i'm still regularly in touch with. i went to a girls school before that though, so i thought boys were this very weird alien species until i was in 6th form pretty much.
they are still alien, but at least i can talk to them these days
I was a bit of a geek, but it was a very academic school so there was no bullying for being clever or owt.
i did get bullied by a former "friend" who decided this would be her way in to hanging with the cool bitchy girls, though that was sorted out really quickly so kudos to the teachers for that
Just felt like i didn't really fit in tbh, although i did have friends who were also geeky, one of whom i'm still regularly in touch with. i went to a girls school before that though, so i thought boys were this very weird alien species until i was in 6th form pretty much.
they are still alien, but at least i can talk to them these days
And nor would it be helpful for me or anyone else to elaborate on our negative experience, but she's not you, it's not the same school/kids/experience and kids have rights nowadays and are generally heard even when they sometimes should be ignored!
Bajie
Zhu Bajie
I quite enjoyed it up to the 3rd year (which would be year 9 now), 4th year was okay'ish and 5th year year was crap. I think around the 4th year puberty properly kicked in and my whole world view changed, was a confusing time plus associated with people who I did not before and then fell out with the same people. All a bit arse really, left when I was 15.
friedaweed
Me and me girl named Jane
I went to three different ones and hated them all. It gave me the empathy I needed for my current job though Working with kids who hate school
Working with kids who hate school
scifisam
deleted
Yeah, but part of my fear is based on knowing what secondary schools are like these days, from working as a secondary school teacher, and part of my fear is based on the problems my daughter has. It's not an unreasonable concern.
This thread has helped bit, though.
Paulie Tandoori
shut it you egg!
still didn't enjoy it. in fact this thread is starting to make me really resent it 
Callie
Pivoting
I hated secondary school but not sure I can entirely blame the school system, it was probably more down to me not coping with being in such a weird fake social environment.
Learning stuff was OK but my slovenly nature didnt really work too well with education so there was no pull or enjoyment from learning.
I can't say if school pushed me to the edge mentally/emotionally or if I was teetering on it anyway but I did not enjoy it.
Learning stuff was OK but my slovenly nature didnt really work too well with education so there was no pull or enjoyment from learning.
I can't say if school pushed me to the edge mentally/emotionally or if I was teetering on it anyway but I did not enjoy it.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
I enjoyed it for the most part, but secondary school was really about friends and partying, with the school part just sort of a backdrop. I made sure I got good enough grades for uni, but that was all.
kabbes
First intersubjective, then internalised
Reading this thread makes me a bit sad that so many people had a crap time in a part of their lives that should have been fun -- after all, you don't have responsibilities and you should have the world open to you. There is something really rather fucked up in our society that creates the minority (but a substantial minority) of individuals (both pupils and teachers) that will go on to make lives a misery for so many others.
I very much liked school, despite being what was known as a "boffin". Why? I think it was because I have always been open, friendly and funny with everybody, which meant that I made friends easily (although few of these were really, really close connections). So I was the boffin that the cool kids liked to have around. I was also interested in *everything*, so I knew everyone in all the little subcultures.
Bully for me, I guess. One man got through it. But what can you learn from this?
I think a few things. Firstly, a very strong sense of self is crucial. Fundamentally, deep in my bones, I truly never cared what anybody else thought of me. I knew who I was and I knew where the boundary was between me and the rest of the world. I think this is the most important thing in school and life generally -- a weak sense of self leads to narcissism (because you actually are worried that you aren't that great), power-madness (because you are worried that you actually have none) and being a follower of the crowd. None of these will make you popular and, indeed, can really encourage others to view you very negatively.
Secondly, a strong sense of empathy helps. If you can see the world through somebody else's eyes then you are half way to being friends with them. People like people who they feel understand them. And empathy will naturally make you want to help others, which helps them help you back.
Thirdly, an innate sense of the ridiculousness of the world helps you get through the tougher times and helps others get through them too. Everybody likes humour.
Fourthly, although it may make life hard sometimes, a strong sense of good conscience and a willingness to do the right thing is ultimately appreciated by everybody.
Here's the bad news. Unfortunately I'm not sure that a parent can do much with a ten year old child that doesn't have these things. For a start, it is the style of the parenting that fundamentally creates these personality traits in the first place and it is very hard to suddenly alter your parenting style. Secondly, a lot of this stuff is laid down in the first three years of life and is very difficult to change. It takes years of work and personal introspection to change your fundamental character after this time.
But here's the good news: from what I understand of your relationship with your daughter, Sam (both from this thread and elsewhere), I don't think that you should have anything to worry about. The sense of self in particular comes from the parental empathy in the very infant days and you are SO attuned to your daughter and her needs that I don't see that she can be anything other than strong-selfed. And you seem to have been constant with her, which helps the various attachment patterns that go with empathy and humour. Finally, the fact that your parenting to date has been helpful in shaping these characteristics means that your parenting in the future is likely to continue helping J to become a rounded and happy person.
J sounds to me like she'll do absolutely fine, whatever personal quirks she happens to have (because we all have personal quirks and they are what make us unique and interesting). Just carry on doing what you're doing (including all these pre-emptive measures that will help deal with these quirks) and don't worry.
I very much liked school, despite being what was known as a "boffin". Why? I think it was because I have always been open, friendly and funny with everybody, which meant that I made friends easily (although few of these were really, really close connections). So I was the boffin that the cool kids liked to have around. I was also interested in *everything*, so I knew everyone in all the little subcultures.
Bully for me, I guess. One man got through it. But what can you learn from this?
I think a few things. Firstly, a very strong sense of self is crucial. Fundamentally, deep in my bones, I truly never cared what anybody else thought of me. I knew who I was and I knew where the boundary was between me and the rest of the world. I think this is the most important thing in school and life generally -- a weak sense of self leads to narcissism (because you actually are worried that you aren't that great), power-madness (because you are worried that you actually have none) and being a follower of the crowd. None of these will make you popular and, indeed, can really encourage others to view you very negatively.
Secondly, a strong sense of empathy helps. If you can see the world through somebody else's eyes then you are half way to being friends with them. People like people who they feel understand them. And empathy will naturally make you want to help others, which helps them help you back.
Thirdly, an innate sense of the ridiculousness of the world helps you get through the tougher times and helps others get through them too. Everybody likes humour.
Fourthly, although it may make life hard sometimes, a strong sense of good conscience and a willingness to do the right thing is ultimately appreciated by everybody.
Here's the bad news. Unfortunately I'm not sure that a parent can do much with a ten year old child that doesn't have these things. For a start, it is the style of the parenting that fundamentally creates these personality traits in the first place and it is very hard to suddenly alter your parenting style. Secondly, a lot of this stuff is laid down in the first three years of life and is very difficult to change. It takes years of work and personal introspection to change your fundamental character after this time.
But here's the good news: from what I understand of your relationship with your daughter, Sam (both from this thread and elsewhere), I don't think that you should have anything to worry about. The sense of self in particular comes from the parental empathy in the very infant days and you are SO attuned to your daughter and her needs that I don't see that she can be anything other than strong-selfed. And you seem to have been constant with her, which helps the various attachment patterns that go with empathy and humour. Finally, the fact that your parenting to date has been helpful in shaping these characteristics means that your parenting in the future is likely to continue helping J to become a rounded and happy person.
J sounds to me like she'll do absolutely fine, whatever personal quirks she happens to have (because we all have personal quirks and they are what make us unique and interesting). Just carry on doing what you're doing (including all these pre-emptive measures that will help deal with these quirks) and don't worry.
I liked it.
I've always been so straight down the line average, so I just fitted in pretty well (see - college, uni, work, the pub etc, etc
).
Never bullied, never the bully, reasonably academic but not overly-so, decent at football. I got on with and liked most of my fellow pupils & teachers.
I might have felt gawky and socially awkard at times, but I was a teenager, and that's going to be universal.
I've always been so straight down the line average, so I just fitted in pretty well (see - college, uni, work, the pub etc, etc
). Never bullied, never the bully, reasonably academic but not overly-so, decent at football. I got on with and liked most of my fellow pupils & teachers.
I might have felt gawky and socially awkard at times, but I was a teenager, and that's going to be universal.
girasol
Addicted to handstands!
hated it, except seeing my friends etc.
most of my reports said that i acted like school was just an extension of my social life. they got that right.
But surely that's what school is for?
I had a really good time, I got on with most people, I didn't think of myself as popular or cool, or the opposite. I really enjoyed learning most subjects, although I had some difficulty with Physics and Chemistry (I actually screwed up my first year and had to resit those two subjects)
My main group of friends was very mixed, with some good students and some who struggled so we helped each other whenever possible (yes, we did come up with elaborate ways of cheating and somehow never got caught, but we also tried to explain things if we understood something and someone else didn't).
There was a big sense of camaraderie and a little bit of healthy competition amongst us, and I still look back at those times really fondly. A couple of bad things happened, fall outs and stuff, but nothing that I found traumatising.
I also liked sports, but only for fun, so I avoided doing it competitively.
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