devils whore - channel4 english civil war drama
- Thread starter feerd
- Start date
Azrael
circling Airstrip One
Something I often point out to the "religion: cure for liberalism" brigade.
The drama's getting a bit earnest and ranty about Cromwell now (I see the old "he butchered women and children in Ireland" rubbish is wheeled out for the occasion) which is spoiling the trippy mood from the early episodes. I want to see more of Tim McInnerny and his Evil Goatee ™.
Azrael
circling Airstrip One
There was an article on this in a recent BBC history magazine, written by an Irish historian no less. It repeats what's been known for ages: there's no evidence that Cromwell ordered the massacre of civilians. He did order captured soldiers to be killed, which may or may not have been standard military practice at the time (this is in debate).
So having him in a church while his men gleefully hack away at women and children is just manipulative fantasy. Which is the Devil's Whore's perrogative, it isn't a doccumentary, but I'd have thought what Cromwell did (brutal imperialism and "pacification" of Ireland) was bad enough without the embellishment.
So having him in a church while his men gleefully hack away at women and children is just manipulative fantasy. Which is the Devil's Whore's perrogative, it isn't a doccumentary, but I'd have thought what Cromwell did (brutal imperialism and "pacification" of Ireland) was bad enough without the embellishment.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
well, whether or not Cromwell actually ordered such massacres himself (and there are various accounts, albeit undefinitive, that he did), his policies led to them, as surely as bush's led to abu graib.
having him actually there is just ya typical dramatic license tho. nothing wrong with that, if you accept, or believe, my first point.
having him actually there is just ya typical dramatic license tho. nothing wrong with that, if you accept, or believe, my first point.
Azrael
circling Airstrip One
I agree.
As I said above, I believe that exaggerating Cromwell's sins detracts from the drama, and risks turning him into a panto villain. He thought he was on a mission from God, and authorised to smite those who stood in arms against it: casual butchery of civilians is, so far as I can see, totally out of character.
Azrael
circling Airstrip One
Anyone else catch the last episode? It was atmospheric, but rather dissapointing. Sexby's end was done well enough, but I felt it spoilt the character dynamic when Elizabeth surrendered to his Captain Jack-esque charms, and the "love conquers all" ending was a bit wet.
Once again they exaggerate Cromwell's sins for no good reason: he did have John Lilburne shipped off to Jersey, but subsequently brought him back to Dover Castle, where he was allowed frequent day releases to visit his wife. He renounced activism, became a Quaker, and died at home, not in a frozen dungeon off the coast of France.
Ah well, fun enough series, but if could have been so much more.
Once again they exaggerate Cromwell's sins for no good reason: he did have John Lilburne shipped off to Jersey, but subsequently brought him back to Dover Castle, where he was allowed frequent day releases to visit his wife. He renounced activism, became a Quaker, and died at home, not in a frozen dungeon off the coast of France.
Ah well, fun enough series, but if could have been so much more.
boohoo
No.
I wasn't well last night and fell asleep half way through
Is it repeated?
I saw the beginning and the end but not much of the middle
Watch it on channel 4 catch up on your computer.
zenie
>^^<
kalidarkone
Bringing YOU round.....
(How sad)
trabuquera
Modesty Bag
It's happening more and more and more often that I listen to a programme narration or an ad on telly and it seems like the Voice of John Sim (and no i DON'T have a crush on him, not even with a scar and an unfeasibly wide-rimmed hat).
Is is that:
- John Sim really IS voiceovering almost everything on telly these days? OR
- there are a lot of actors whose voices and pronunciation sound a lot like him? OR
- actually there are a load of other actors who are now ASKED to "do us a John Sim voice"? OR
- iv'e got deep unresolved psychological issues about JS to the point of hearing his voice out of the tellybox even when it's not there?
Is is that:
- John Sim really IS voiceovering almost everything on telly these days? OR
- there are a lot of actors whose voices and pronunciation sound a lot like him? OR
- actually there are a load of other actors who are now ASKED to "do us a John Sim voice"? OR
- iv'e got deep unresolved psychological issues about JS to the point of hearing his voice out of the tellybox even when it's not there?
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
Now it's finished is there any torrent about for this series?
Spion
I hear ya
There's no reason why those in Ireland (who were royalist or allied to them) would have been given any more quarter than those in besieged royalist houses here, ie little or none.
It's completely ahistorical to project a modern liberal view back in time.
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