date / name that vintage car / ship / etc

[Griff]

Alright car - late 30s??? The ladies dress doesn't match the post war period particularly well. Though I have seen a picture of my gran when she was little in the late 1920s with her grandma who is wearing an outfit which is quite Edwardian in style.

Thinking about this tonight (sad I know) I'd age that picture a little later than I first imagined, at about 1949/52. You can't go by the cars alone. You only have to look at pictures of East London in the early '70s and there are plenty of early '60s cars around.

The car isn't British built late '30s by the way.

 

[oneflewover]

The cars are 1940s + the Thames barge any time after 1880, but the only thing to give us an earliest is Brittania which was launced in 1953 and commisioned in 1954.

 

[cybertect]

I'd guess at 1940s but I'm not at all sure

g_force's Rover ID seems plausible - which would place it after 1948.

I reckon not that much later - check out the horse and cart in the background to the left of the tree trunk.

 

[Louloubelle]

oooh

I've only just noticed the horse and cart. well spotted!


The thing about these photos is that some are as early as 1860, these are easy to date by the backs which have the photographer's business details on the back, it's the older ones I'm having fun trying to date

OK

Date that pram!

 

[Griff]

C'mon Louloubelle, where are the car pictures.

 

[Louloubelle]

C'mon Louloubelle, where are the car pictures.

sexist


OK

here are some bits of cars

I know the date of this one so it's just for fun

also the cars are not in the UK

 

[Griff]

1963?

 

[Louloubelle]

1963?

close

1964

here's the whole pic

 

[Louloubelle]

I've got a ton of work to do now but I shall return with more cars later

 

[Roadkill]

What does 'under sail' mean?

Is it the one that looksa bit oriental?

'Under sail' just means the that it has sails set - it's the vessel on the right in post #28.

Thames barges were the last commercial sailing vessels in Europe: the last one was taken out of service in 1970.

You still see a few of them about on the Thames, although they're all yachts and pleasure craft these days.

 

[Griff]

close

1964

 

[Roadkill]

here's another boat!

That's hardly a boat... 'Boat' usually refers to an undecked (i.e. open) craft: that's very definitely a ship.

It's difficult to say exactly what it is, though. It's fairly small, and looking at the shape of it my guess would be that it dates from the first quarter of the twentieth century. Judging from the lighters (loading barges) alongside it and the derricks on the foremast, it looks like a small-ish passenger/cargo steamer.

 

[cybertect]

Date that pram!

Judging by the clothes and hairstyles I'd reckon that's 1920s, perhaps early 1930s.

The pram looks considerably older, though. I'd guess late Victorian or probably Edwardian.

for comparison

http://www.freewebs.com/janesprams/pramspre1900.htm

1912

1900 from the Science Museum

 

[cybertect]

1964

The Beetle was a few years old when that picture was taken then.

It's got an oval rear window, a feature that was phased out in 1958 in favour of a larger, squarer one.

 

[Louloubelle]

Thanks so much for all the very exciting contributions so far

Here's another ship

more cars later, I promise

 

[boohoo]

Judging by the clothes and hairstyles I'd reckon that's 1920s, perhaps early 1930s.

I reckon mid to late 20s not too much whiff of 30s style yet though the hat rim is broad.

 

[boohoo]

C'mon Louloubelle, where are the car pictures.

C'mon Louloubelle, where are the dresses pictures.

 

[Roadkill]

Thanks so much for all the very exciting contributions so far

Here's another ship

more cars later, I promise

Well the one in the background with the smoke coming from its funnel is just a tug...

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

'Boat' usually refers to an undecked (i.e. open) craft: that's very definitely a ship.

Wow, you really do learn something new every day

 

[ICB]

what a cool thread

Well the one in the background with the smoke coming from its funnel is just a tug...

towing a barge, and the foreground looks like a crane

you're not quite there with the ship boat distinction though, there are plenty of decked sailing boats, if you're a square rigger you've got to have more than two masts to be a ship

 

[Roadkill]

you're not quite there with the ship boat distinction though, there are plenty of decked sailing boats, if you're a square rigger you've got to have more than two masts to be a ship

It's not a hard and fast distinction, but most definitions of a 'ship' imply that it has to be decked, whereas a boat is open. that applies no matter how it's powered -sail, steam, motor...

I wasn't going to confuse the issue by getting into different sailing vessel rigs, but you're right: a 'ship' is a vessel square-rigged on three or more masts.

<edit for spelling: 'quare-rigged' is just going to confuse the issue...>

 

[ICB]

It's not a hard and fast distinction, but most definitions of a 'ship' imply that it has to be decked, whereas a boat is open.

I wasn't going to confuse the issue by getting into different sailing vessel rigs, but you're right: a 'ship' is a vessel quare-rigged on three or more masts.

aye, and weirdly subs and any fishing vessel, even a massive whaler, are always boats

 

[Roadkill]

aye, and weirdly subs and any fishing vessel, even a massive whaler, are always boats

I don't know about subs, but it's true - and weird - that people even refer to big trawlers as 'fighing boats.' 'Fishing ship' just sounds wrong somehow, doesn't it?

I've seen reference to 'whaling ships' before, though.

 

[DrRingDing]

What kind of boat is this?

Well the rig is a gaff and also possibly a sloop.

 

[Roadkill]

Well the rig is a gaff and also possibly a sloop.

Nah. A sloop is fore-and-aft rigged on one mast, like this:

That barge has two masts. I think technically you'd call it a yawl rig, since the mizzen mast is very small (if it were closer in size to the main it'd be a ketch) but a barge is usually described as being sprit-rigged, since the peak of the main gaff (and usually the mizzen) is supported by the diagonal sprit.

Sail plan of a typical Thames barge:

The reason the Thames barge survived as long as it did, is that the sprit rig is easy to handle for its size. Even a 250-ton barge could be worked by two men.

 

[fortyplus]

ships vs boats:

a vessel's a thing on water that floats,
the big ones are ships,
the small ones are boats.

sailing-ships:
a fully-rigged ship is square-rigged as roadkill says on all three or more masts.
with two square-rigged masts it's a brig.
in the latter days of sailing ships, most ships were re-rigged as barques, with fore-and-aft sails on the mizzen (the mast at the back) because they sail better.

I loved going to the cutty sark when I was a nipper.

 

[DrRingDing]

@Roadkill...You've got better eyes than me (I couldn't see a mizzen on that boat) and you know your sailing onions!

 

[Roadkill]

in the latter days of sailing ships, most ships were re-rigged as barques, with fore-and-aft sails on the mizzen (the mast at the back) because they sail better.

I loved going to the cutty sark when I was a nipper.

Debateable: I think the main reason that many ships were re-rigged as barques is that they were cheaper to run. The slight loss of performance from losing the square sails on the aftermost mast was outweighed by the savings in materials and handling costs.

Btw, Cutty Sark has no masts at all atm. They've just started doing some major work to her. It'll be great when it's finished (and she really did need it), but for now she looks all forlorn - just a slightly battered hull without her soaring rig.

 

[fortyplus]

er roadkill...

technically that gaff-rigged vessel is a cutter not a sloop; a sloop has only one headsail.

and those barges are ketches, not yawls - the distinction is where the mizzen is stepped in relation to the rudder-post.

 

[Roadkill]

er roadkill...

technically that gaff-rigged vessel is a cutter not a sloop; a sloop has only one headsail.

Damn it, you're right.

and those barges are ketches, not yawls - the distinction is where the mizzen is stepped in relation to the rudder-post.

Are you sure? I was taught that the distinction was in the comparative sizes in main and mizzen.