Cream - any good?

Discussion in 'music, bands, clubs & festies' started by ska invita, Jul 27, 2016.

  1. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    Sunshine of Your Love just popped into my head - it sounds a lot better than i remember it - classic songs often have that - theyre overplayed and you think your sick of them, but when you hear them you realise why theyre so great...

    I dont really know Cream though - any pointers?
  2. DotCommunist

    DotCommunist slowtime

    white room, with black curtains in the sunshine
    fizzerbird likes this.
  3. xenon

    xenon A move in any direction

    Try the albums Disraeli Gears and wheels of fire.
    spliff and nogojones like this.
  4. xenon

    xenon A move in any direction

    It's in the station.
    D'wards and Pickman's model like this.
  5. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    always found the piano bit in layla a bit mushy
  6. Sirena

    Sirena Don't monkey with the buzzsaw

    I didn't like Cream albums (a bit worthy and boring....) but I liked them as artistes.
  7. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    i do hope clapton didn't mean his famous racist speech of 1976

    nsfw, btw
  8. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

  9. The39thStep

    The39thStep Well-Known Member

    I feel free
    I'm so glad
    White Room

    Are my faves. A lot of their stuff to me though degenerates into drum/ bass riffs and numbing guitar solos which was a product of the times and exactly what a lot of people liked about them. And fucking drum solos.The film about Ginger Baker was quite good though.
    ska invita likes this.
  10. Rutita1

    Rutita1 Sassy McFlashy

  11. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    i liked cream when i was a teenager, but then i found the small faces

    Last edited: Jul 27, 2016
  12. littleseb

    littleseb littleseb

    don't mind them as a band, some cracking tunes, but the three individuals seem like arseholes in their own rights.
    i can live without them, but don't mind if the odd song is played somewhere.
    metalguru likes this.
  13. littleseb

    littleseb littleseb

    never really rated Ginger as a drummer. very bit-y style......
    i like it when he holds it together though, as in strange brew or white room.
    Pickman's model likes this.
  14. two sheds

    two sheds Least noticed poster 2007

    bimble likes this.
  15. Lurdan

    Lurdan old wave

    I like Jack Bruce and Pete Brown's songwriting so I occasionally listen to some of the studio tracks but I was never a fan of the band.

    Quite fond of this

    Never thought a lot of their live stuff. I don't care for Clapton's playing generally and making the ten minute rock drum solo fashionable was just criminal.
    The39thStep likes this.
  16. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    What's a drum and bass work out of theirs?
    And what was the ginger baker film called? That sounds quite fun...
  17. The39thStep

    The39thStep Well-Known Member

    Didn't mean drum and base as in 'drum and base' more the protracted interplay between Bruce and Baker. The thing about Cream is at the time they were a supergroup.All three had reputations as ' musicians' and that meant reputations had to be upheld in excelling as ' musicians' which in those days led to some exhilarating moments but also however some quite turgid self indulgent dross. So normally on any of their albums and their live shows there would be several opportunities to showcase their musical abilities, solos, interplay, drum section, bass section, lead guitar solo etc etc. and if you got bored and didn't get it you would normally find someone to put you straight on appreciating ' technique'. in my view you had to put up with a lot of filling to get to the bits that I liked.

    Beware of Mr Baker is the film. He's a nutter.
    ska invita likes this.
  18. Sirena

    Sirena Don't monkey with the buzzsaw

    The Small Faces were a proper group with a proper organic development. They were brilliant.

    Cream were a concept: a confection as a band. And they weren't so good.
  19. Johnny Canuck3

    Johnny Canuck3 Well-Known Member

    Sounds like Clapton probably voted for Brexit.

  20. bi0boy

    bi0boy Power User

    Most over-rated club in northern England.
    moody and The39thStep like this.
  21. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Raddled old poet

    They have some good songs, but you have to wade through a lot of stuff that's really boring. I feel like defending Jack Bruce as the best musician amongst them, but actually a lot of the songwriting he was responsible for was self-indulgent acid-head bollocks. (But I saw him live in the 80s in a tiny club in Bannockburn, and he was great. He seemed more at home, despite being responsible for the invention of sprawling stadium rock).

    I like: Strange Brew, I Feel Free, White Room.

    Of their covers, I'm So Glad is the most successful, in my opinion. It is worthy of being heard in its own right. Sitting on Top of the World on the other hand is far more powerful when delivered by Howlin' Wolf (though that was itself a cover with considerable reworkings compared with the Mississippi Sheiks' version), as is Willie Dixon's Spoonful. Go to Chester Burnett himself for those. Born Under A Bad Sign is fine, but they're just doing Albert King's version, and his has more sass and groove. These are all OK until you hear the better versions (not always the original) and realise that Cream's versions are just a bit ponderous and turgid.

    Albert King:

    Anyone For Tennis stands out as just terrible, terrible drivel.
    metalguru and two sheds like this.
  22. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    I Feel Free is Cream? ...didnt know that - thats a big tune. Im so Glad...hadnt heard that before... thats really top 68 style psych stuff
    But having had a flick through a couple of albums now most Cream tunes so far i actively dont like tbh ....definitely had some moments though, but few and far between really.... i do like the UK acid vibe off them generally, and ive got no problem jammed out rock, but they're no JH Experience...
    They were dead young though,,, early 20s...
    This is a great clip - well worth watching the first 2 minutes just for the hyperbolic introduction the band get

    the live versions (above) sound a good bit rawer than the albums and thats a good thing... really good live i reckon

    also great interview with Ginger at 34 mins in :D
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2016
    danny la rouge likes this.
  23. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    The whole long drum (and guitar) solo thing comes from jazz really - I think JH Experience and Cream are both in the jazz trio mold ultimately - I think Mitch Mitchell was really technical - Ginger is really similiar just plays a bit less consciously and tbf a little less skillfully compared to Mitch - but it comes out with a great slightly wildman on acid flavour

  24. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    What did they all do immediately after they split up?
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2016
  25. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    Hah this looks great

    *the idea that he invented this kind of drumming is a joke though....look at someone like Art Blakey for example - he was destroying drum kits from the 50s onwards
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2016
  26. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    This is a great set...when they just jam out i think theyre a great band

    im not so sure about the album tracks tbh

    maybe a bit unfair to say they're not as good as Hendrix Experience - who was? - they definitely more than hold their own in that style and playing live have their own quite gritty UK sound
  27. danny la rouge

    danny la rouge Raddled old poet

    I'd disagree slightly with that. Blues and R n B were both steeped in improvisation and, live, in extended improv workouts. What held it in check, time-wise, in recording history was the length of a side. In the very early days, blues artists (often recording as a solo rather than in a band) would watch the recording physically being cut and just end the song when the wax was about to run out. (Early jazz artists did much the same, though because they were bands rather than sole individuals, their arrangements were worked out with recording length in mind. The reason that 12 bar blues became a set form was also because if you're playing with other musicians they need to know when to expect a chord change). What changed song length was the dawn of the long playing record. This was just as true of blues or R n B as it was of jazz.

    Here's Muddy Waters live in 1960. He goes way over the 3 minute song length barrier. You can't do that on a 45, but you can do it live and you can do it on an LP. Charley Patton would have kept a song going for 15 minutes in a plantation all-nighter, but he couldn't do it on a 78.

    Clapton was a bluesman. He plays absolutely nothing from the jazz idiom. It's all Albert King. Back and forth between minor and major pentatonics, with flat fifths. He's really good at it - his clean and powerful fills in Strange Brew are masterful - but I'd suggest his best work was on the Blues Breakers "Beano" album. (When he was only 21).

    So his was the British blues boom tradition.

    It's true that Jack Bruce had more of a jazz foundation. Whenever you hear interesting harmonic structure or chord subs, then it's Bruce's doing. (You can hear him at times going half-diminished ii to dominant V with a flat 9th while Clapton keeps rooted to the I. It works well together, but it isn't Clapton's doing). He's more interested in varying the harmonic structure, but it's still well within R n B territory. He wasn't doing anything harmonically that Ray Charles hadn't done a decade or more before. And as for extended workouts, Ray Charles broke the 45 barrier with What'd I Say.

    I don't have a problem with extended work outs and acid-head whimsy. I just think that Cream were better at the British blues boom territory than the acid-head whimsy, and that what they lacked more than anything else was a good editor.
  28. littleseb

    littleseb littleseb

    I think Eric Clapton is best enjoyed with Delaney and Bonnie:

  29. ska invita

    ska invita back on the other side

    Nice post danny - i guess what i meant by jazz trio was more a kind of intimate way of playing together in a threesome thats feels to me closer in terms of interaction to a jazz trio than anything else - rather than explicitly playing in a jazz style... obviously they're an electric blues band foremost

    **ETA: Im really enjoying the first , 66 album Fresh Cream... 66 was a whole different world to 68...
    danny la rouge likes this.
  30. littleseb

    littleseb littleseb

    it still blows my mind how quickly things changed in the sixties. most things you can date, not only by year but by the month it was recorded.
    danny la rouge and ska invita like this.

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