aurora green
Tectonic
Plus the Lido is an expensive swim for families.
Council to "revitalise" Brixton
- Thread starter Gramsci
- Start date
dogmatique
merde alors
aurora green said:
IIRC The current owners were recently granted a 25 year lease on the basis of a successful Lottery grant, which is being matched by the council.
Off the top of my head, the wonderful Lido was awarded 250,000, and (strangely lumped together) with a grant of 890,000 to restore the bandstand on Clapham Common.
Right... 250,000 for a massive Lido or nearly a million quid for ONE bandstand. Shows just how more expensive everything is in Clapham, eh?
dogmatique
merde alors
Ah, not entirely correct...
"£2.5m lido restoration
A £2.5MILLION plan to restore a popular summer attraction is set to start this month.
Leisure company Fusion Lifestyle will be refurbishing the 1930s lido in Brockwell Park - dubbed Brixton Beach.
It will open for the summer in July but access may be restricted because of the building works.
When the 12-month development is finished, the council is set to grant the company a lease for 25 years at a peppercorn rent. The small print of the deal was agreed by Lambeth council on Monday last week.
The Heritage Lottery Fund has given the project a £400,000 grant towards the works' costs.
The council will guarantee the loan taken out by the company to complete the revamp.
Councillor Clare Whelan, executive member for the environment, said: "It is a reducing [financial] risk, year on year. We would not be taking on the risk if there was a likelihood we would have to take on the sum."
"£2.5m lido restoration
A £2.5MILLION plan to restore a popular summer attraction is set to start this month.
Leisure company Fusion Lifestyle will be refurbishing the 1930s lido in Brockwell Park - dubbed Brixton Beach.
It will open for the summer in July but access may be restricted because of the building works.
When the 12-month development is finished, the council is set to grant the company a lease for 25 years at a peppercorn rent. The small print of the deal was agreed by Lambeth council on Monday last week.
The Heritage Lottery Fund has given the project a £400,000 grant towards the works' costs.
The council will guarantee the loan taken out by the company to complete the revamp.
Councillor Clare Whelan, executive member for the environment, said: "It is a reducing [financial] risk, year on year. We would not be taking on the risk if there was a likelihood we would have to take on the sum."
It's an expensive swim for everyone -- a fiver for a dip is a hell of a lot -- but yes, for a family it would be prohibitive, which is a great shame. Am I right in thinking they don't do any concessions?aurora green said:
aurora green
Tectonic
On there site, which I agree is somewhat trip-tastic, they say they give a pound off for concessions, but dont mention any other deals for families or anything.
Just what I was thinking: drugs and water don't mix, kids.aurora green said:
dogmatique
merde alors
IntoStella said:
Whilst I agree that it is over-priced - Tooting Bec is only 3 quid isn't it? I think the prices reflect the fact that for the last couple of years they got by without any council subsidy (which in previous years had run to upwards of 150 grand).
Hopefully the new lease and the peppercorn rent will allow them, if not to lower prices - to offer decent concessions, not just a pound off.
We'll have to wait and see though... wouldn't count on it.
dogmatique
merde alors
Gramsci said:
The sheer bare faced cheek of that statement is staggering.
Run down? Really? So who's fault is that then?
dogmatique said:
Well obviously it was the council's mistake in the first place.
But what's wrong with now trying to make a better deal for residents? I spend a lot of time at the rec using a wide variety of facilities, and it is obvious that it is an unecoonomical building to run. If in the long run it is better to cut losses now and invest in a building which is physically cheap[er to run and uses space more economically whilst retaining the facilities that people want and need) what's wrong with that? Better value in the longer term.
Ms T said:
AFAIK from conversations with good folk such as Jo Negrini, the plan is to build mixed use developments - leisure, council offices and social housing.
I am all for the coucil rationalising it's own buildings - and the council is the single biggest employer in Brixton! It's workers are crucial to the daytime, shopping and cafe trades.
IU'm no apologist for the council, but get tired with viewing every possible initiative as negative when the core of it makes sense.
You don't honestly think for a moment, do you, that all the existing facilities will be replaced with equally good facilities in a new development? This is Lambeth we are talking about.OpalFruit said:
dogmatique
merde alors
OpalFruit said:
It was a rhetorical question aimed at the council.
You may be right about having a new building in the long run, but it makes my blood boil that they can allow a hugely expensive building to go to rack and ruin in such a small amount of time, and then expect us to blindly support them tearing it down and trust them to construct a well managed and appropriate replacement.
I mean, come on.
editor
hiraethified
Common practice these days, sadly:dogmatique said:
http://www.urban75.org/brixton/photos/337.html
http://www.urban75.org/brixton/photos/338.html
gaijingirl
Well-Known Member
Is it just me who thinks that Brixton Rec is actually ok? I find the pool great (if a little over chlorinated).. the gym (although I haven't used it since it was moved)..was always good.. I played squash regularly there for well over 2 years at extremely low prices and made loads of friends. I've been in there for meetings.. enjoyed listening to gospel singing whilst working out on a Sunday... It's got better facilities than any other gym I've used, private or public... There is a private gym (LA Fitness) where I work which is appallingly run...the pool is usually out of action at least 5 days of the month, no central heating/air con/broken machines..the list goes on.... Brixton Rec beats it hands down...
The only thing that annoys me is the reception area which can see customers waiting 20 mins just to get in, and less scrupulous customers just walking in without paying and the cafe, where I would like to see them making something a bit healthier than chips and patties....
Why do we need to tear it down?? What is making is so expensive to run that would be solved by moving it elsewhere?
The only thing that annoys me is the reception area which can see customers waiting 20 mins just to get in, and less scrupulous customers just walking in without paying and the cafe, where I would like to see them making something a bit healthier than chips and patties....
Why do we need to tear it down?? What is making is so expensive to run that would be solved by moving it elsewhere?
gaijingirl
Well-Known Member
IntoStella said:
The Lido is £2.50 (£2 concs) if you go before 8am (or it might be 9am..) for an early morning swim... and it's a fantastic way to start the day!!
I can't wait for summer!!
I think the Rec's great. The gym is a little cramped dowstairs since they turned upstairs into a weights room (which never seems to have anybody in it) but it's ok -- and very cheap. Mind you, I've not been for a few months myself.gaijingirl said:
Fancy going together GG? I could do with some motivation.
I think it's really funny that the cafe sells such lardy fare. Got to keep yer strength up, that's what I always say.
gaijingirl
Well-Known Member
I'm always up for going to the gym with other people. Actually I've been thinking of trying to get a bunch of urbanite ladies together for a run around Brockwell Park (or a puff around Brockwell Park in my case) sometime soon...
Yeah I think the Rec is okay, at least the changing rooms are reliably clean (unlike the grim sauna/steam rooms). I use a gym and pool near work most of the time but like a swim at the weekends.
What are they going to do, dismantle the Rec brick by brick? It kind of boggles the mind Station Road as a building site for the rest of the decade. It'll never happen.
What are they going to do, dismantle the Rec brick by brick? It kind of boggles the mind Station Road as a building site for the rest of the decade. It'll never happen.
newbie
undisambiguated
Really?
See I don't think this has much to do with the current Rec at all. The tram is to land exactly there with attendant shopping mall and rail interchange. This is about developers releasing value and moving inconvenient, not very lucrative, facilities (swimming, parking, depot) somewhere else.
btw they built it brick by brick and Station Rd was a building site for an age and a day. But did you see the DoE buildings on Marsham St come down. They were huge but came down in a matter of a few weeks.
See I don't think this has much to do with the current Rec at all. The tram is to land exactly there with attendant shopping mall and rail interchange. This is about developers releasing value and moving inconvenient, not very lucrative, facilities (swimming, parking, depot) somewhere else.
btw they built it brick by brick and Station Rd was a building site for an age and a day. But did you see the DoE buildings on Marsham St come down. They were huge but came down in a matter of a few weeks.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
I love the Rec and think that all suggestions that it's destroyed should be argued against as much as possible. It's a wonderful example of grand theory public service architecture. I can't help but think that there's a political agenda to destroy anything that has any remnant of being for the people. Yes, it's badly administered, yes it's fabric has been allowed to get grotty (perhaps deliberately) and yes the staff are churlish, but it serves a very useful purpose.
I fear Brixton will end up with what's happened in Stoke Newington. Four recreation centres shut to fund a brand spanking new Millenium Sports Centre, only for it to be closed months after it openened because of building errors, leaving the borough with nothing.
Hang on to it I say, but with better funding and staffing.......
I fear Brixton will end up with what's happened in Stoke Newington. Four recreation centres shut to fund a brand spanking new Millenium Sports Centre, only for it to be closed months after it openened because of building errors, leaving the borough with nothing.
Hang on to it I say, but with better funding and staffing.......
The waste of demolishing a building that is still servicable sticks in my craw, true. The facilities are fine, and varied, but I don't think it is designed to make best use of space - the huge atrium effect, odd bridging structures, funny useless spaces (that bar!), and the cost of putting all that water in thin air does indeed (apparantly) cost huge amounts more to run each year. And - I understand this could be controversial - the layout of spaces makes it more expensive to staff and patrol than more rationally designed buildings. Jobs are jobs - but concil tax isn't primarily there to create unecessarlily heavy staffing structures, is it?
The point about making way for the tram terminal is an interesting - and no doubt astute one - but I am all in favour of the tram coming to Brixton - and it needs to be in an intercahneg with the tube and overground. i think the o'ground is being expanded to take longer trains (commuter form the SE), and to have a proper integrated interchange with the tube - good!
I don't think the council have a good record at all - SRB / City Challenge - hah! what a corrupt waste of money - but with money coming through the transport links, good, rational use of council property, mixed development of housing, independent retail - and PLENTY of pressure to keep the existing provision of facilities in a new sports building, could it not be suported to work, rather than stopped in it's tracks?
Or is my vision hopelessly rose-tinted?
The point about making way for the tram terminal is an interesting - and no doubt astute one - but I am all in favour of the tram coming to Brixton - and it needs to be in an intercahneg with the tube and overground. i think the o'ground is being expanded to take longer trains (commuter form the SE), and to have a proper integrated interchange with the tube - good!
I don't think the council have a good record at all - SRB / City Challenge - hah! what a corrupt waste of money - but with money coming through the transport links, good, rational use of council property, mixed development of housing, independent retail - and PLENTY of pressure to keep the existing provision of facilities in a new sports building, could it not be suported to work, rather than stopped in it's tracks?
Or is my vision hopelessly rose-tinted?
lang rabbie
Je ne regrette les gazebos
The stupid claim that all three of Lambeth's leisure centres cost "more to maintain than rebuild" needs to be challenged - it seems to be a comparison of oranges and apples.
What there needs to be is a public discussion of whether:
(i) the cost of thoroughly refurbishing Brixton Rec so that:
- the pool doesn't leak again;
- there is an entrance at ground level that people feel safe using;
- disabled users and other people with limited mobility can get around the building
- (insert other desirables here)
plus the cost of maintaining/operating it over the next twenty to thirty years,
is more or less than
(ii) the cost of constructing a new leisure centre that provides at least the same facilities (in terms of pool areas, useable "dryside" facilities and spacious changing facilities, but not necessarily the space currently lost to the atrium)
plus the cost of operating that over the same timescale.
What there needs to be is a public discussion of whether:
(i) the cost of thoroughly refurbishing Brixton Rec so that:
- the pool doesn't leak again;
- there is an entrance at ground level that people feel safe using;
- disabled users and other people with limited mobility can get around the building
- (insert other desirables here)
plus the cost of maintaining/operating it over the next twenty to thirty years,
is more or less than
(ii) the cost of constructing a new leisure centre that provides at least the same facilities (in terms of pool areas, useable "dryside" facilities and spacious changing facilities, but not necessarily the space currently lost to the atrium)
plus the cost of operating that over the same timescale.
lang rabbie said:
Add in the cost of dismantling the Rec brick-by-brick.
What is the timescale for this Revitalise thingy? Is there a timetable and proper consultations planned? Or is this just an excuse for a lovely shiny four colour expensive paper leaflet councillors can show their wives/husbands to prove how important they are?
I agree with the council that, on paper, these are "exciting and ambitious plans" but what is the likelihood they will ever come to fruition?
I agree with the council that, on paper, these are "exciting and ambitious plans" but what is the likelihood they will ever come to fruition?[/QUOTE]
The reason I feel more optimistic than usual about this is that I believe the money for the transport interchanges / overground improvement is already in place, and doesn't depend on LBL, that LBL do have a stake in it - the rationalisation of their property and office accommodation, and that it is driven by two depts / directorates - property and community renewal, and that the draft proposals meet the agreed aims / targets of both - financial economy over property (offices and unused buildings all over the borough) and the implementation of the UDP / Community Plan.
I'm inclined to respond to the consultation with genuine contributions: yes to a transport interchange - esp the opportunity to make it thoroughly disabled accessible - (will that be thought through?), insist on full range of leisure and sport facilities somewhere in the mix, retention of market (perhaps with expansion for more independent arts/craft/ retailers, and room for more 'farmers market' style stalls, Yes to bringing theatre back into Brixton (Oval House are quoted in the document - they have been talking about this in the various Brixton forums) - and YES to ensuring that social housing partners are brought in to include affordable housing for local people.
The reason I feel more optimistic than usual about this is that I believe the money for the transport interchanges / overground improvement is already in place, and doesn't depend on LBL, that LBL do have a stake in it - the rationalisation of their property and office accommodation, and that it is driven by two depts / directorates - property and community renewal, and that the draft proposals meet the agreed aims / targets of both - financial economy over property (offices and unused buildings all over the borough) and the implementation of the UDP / Community Plan.
I'm inclined to respond to the consultation with genuine contributions: yes to a transport interchange - esp the opportunity to make it thoroughly disabled accessible - (will that be thought through?), insist on full range of leisure and sport facilities somewhere in the mix, retention of market (perhaps with expansion for more independent arts/craft/ retailers, and room for more 'farmers market' style stalls, Yes to bringing theatre back into Brixton (Oval House are quoted in the document - they have been talking about this in the various Brixton forums) - and YES to ensuring that social housing partners are brought in to include affordable housing for local people.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
OpalFruit said:
The reason I feel more optimistic than usual about this is that I believe the money for the transport interchanges / overground improvement is already in place, and doesn't depend on LBL, that LBL do have a stake in it - the rationalisation of their property and office accommodation, and that it is driven by two depts / directorates - property and community renewal, and that the draft proposals meet the agreed aims / targets of both - financial economy over property (offices and unused buildings all over the borough) and the implementation of the UDP / Community Plan.
I'm inclined to respond to the consultation with genuine contributions: yes to a transport interchange - esp the opportunity to make it thoroughly disabled accessible - (will that be thought through?), insist on full range of leisure and sport facilities somewhere in the mix, retention of market (perhaps with expansion for more independent arts/craft/ retailers, and room for more 'farmers market' style stalls, Yes to bringing theatre back into Brixton (Oval House are quoted in the document - they have been talking about this in the various Brixton forums) - and YES to ensuring that social housing partners are brought in to include affordable housing for local people.[/QUOTE]
I was at a forum meeting a recently where Valerie Shawcross(GLA) said the at the moment TfL didnt think a new overhead station at Brixton was econmic.Therefore the proposed new overhead line in South London would pass but not stop at Brixton.I dont know about the tram.
I question whether the proposals will meet in the needs of the community in the end.All the talk about Theatres etc is just that.It will get people to support it but may never happen.Ive a friend in Walthamstow where the centre has been "regenerated" after much consultation.Several years down the line a piece of land designated for community facilities was flogged to a developer.The Council wrung their hands and said unfortunately their wasnt the money to build what had been decided on.
I think this may happen with these plans.People will agree to glossy plans of theatres etc.What will be forgatten is that it may never happen.By that time it will be to late as the land will be sold.
